PhotoFast 64 GB CompactFlash card

Dan Keaton · October 31st, 2009, 05:07 PM

Dear Gints,

The PhotoFlash 64 GB card, Model 533x, is a MLC (Multiple Level Cell).

There are no SLC 64 GB cards, as far as I know.

These fast speeds are obtained by using fast memory and parallel architecture.

Gints Klimanis · October 31st, 2009, 05:37 PM

Thanks for the info, Dan. The data integrity of MLC is scary, though with greater capacity, each cell is used less often in the same application. We're already reading about the high capacity Solid State Drives (SSD) that are wearing out.

Here is a good site for SSD articles that contain comparisons between "consumer grade" MLC and "professional grade" SLC:

Are MLC SSDs Ever Safe in Enterprise Apps? - article on STORAGEsearch.com

Dan Keaton · October 31st, 2009, 06:05 PM

Dear Gints,

Solid State Drives are used entirely different than CompactFlash cards for video recording.

The File Allocation Table, as used by a typical operating system is updated almost constantly when any program in a computer is writing to a hard drive or Solid State Drive.

We have designed the nanoFlash to avoid these constant updates.

It is no surprise to me that some Solid State Drives are wearing out when being used in normal computer applications.

We expect our recommended CompactFlash cards to work for years, even if used continuously. The wear that we place on a CompactFlash can is no where near as heavy as everyday usage on a Solid State Drive.

We do recommend purchasing CompactFlash cards with a lifetime warranty.

One always has the option of purchasing SLC CompactFlash cards if desired. The largest that I know of are 16 GB at this time.

Mark Job · October 31st, 2009, 07:08 PM

Hi Dan:
What's an SLC Compact Flash Card ?

EDIT: And I answer my own question = Single-Level Cell

EDIT 2: OK. I read this http://www.supertalent.com/datasheet...whitepaper.pdf

Dan Keaton · October 31st, 2009, 07:19 PM

Dear Mark,

A SLC, Single Level Cell, uses technology which uses only one level of voltage to represent 1 bit. Voltage Present = 1, No Voltage Present = 0, or it could be reversed, but this is simpler and faster than MLC.

MLC is Multiple Level Cell. Different voltages represent the values placed into the cell. Thus, one can store multiple bits in one cell.

The difference is that it takes longer to generate the proper voltages and to read out the exact voltages which respresent the values.

SLC's have more endurance.

However, modern MLC's have been used for years, and good ones are very durable and reliable.

Most CompactFlash cards are MLC. More expensive ones may be SLC.

At any given point in time, so far at least, MLC has higher capacity.

SLC used to be higher in performance, but the very latest high capacity MLC CompactFlash cards have higher capacity than most SLC cards at this time.

The nanoFlash and Flash XDR can work with quality, qualified CompactFlash cards of either SLC or MLC design.

Mark Job · October 31st, 2009, 09:18 PM

Hi Dan:
Thanks for the heads up on this. You learn something new every day.

Barry J. Weckesser · November 7th, 2009, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Schell

Just a quick note on the PhotoFast 64GB cards, that I completely forgot to communicate to anyone (please excuse my oversight).

The Photofast 64GB 533X Compact Flash card has incorrect size information in some of the ID headers read on power-up. The header used by the current nanoFlash firmware identified the card as 8GB, while the header used by most file system correctly identifies the card as 64GB.

This has been correccted in the next nano/XDR firmware release, which is now in final test. Until then the "64GB" card is limited to 8GB. The 32GB PhotFast card does not exhibit this issue.

As Dan mentioned, the 32/64 GB PhotoFast cards are currently limited to 160 Mbps, but will be increased to 220 Mbps with this new firmware. In our tests the 32/64 GB cards perform very well and have the fastest read (transfer times) we have ever measured (about 50 MBytes/sec using an Express 34 card).

On the other hand, we can not recommend the Pretec 64GB card, as initial tests were not positive.

We will endeavor to complete checkout of the new nano/XDR firmware ASAP, but release is always predicated on passing all the reliability tests.

Best-

I just put the 64GB card in a USB reader and plugged it into my computer system - it shows it as being an 8 GB card - I assume this is the same problem as with the Nanoflash? (I am running Windows XP Pro).

Dan Keaton · November 7th, 2009, 11:16 PM

Dear Barry,

Yes.

Ned Soltz · November 10th, 2009, 08:31 PM

FYI-- DVNation shows no stock of 64gb cards as of Nov 10.

Mike Schell · November 10th, 2009, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ned Soltz

FYI-- DVNation shows no stock of 64gb cards as of Nov 10.

Hi Ned-
Just got a note from the guys at DVNation that more 64GB cards should be available next week. I recommended that they drastically increase their stocking levels on this card, as it will likely be very popular. We have qualified the 64GB card for bit-rates up to 220 Mbps, which means you can use our very highest quality: 180 Mbps Long-GOP.

Personally, I think $299 is a very reasonable price for a 64GB card. It's 1/3 the price of the new "low-cost" 64GB P2 card!

Best-

October 31st, 2009, 05:07 PM	#16
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Gints, The PhotoFlash 64 GB card, Model 533x, is a MLC (Multiple Level Cell). There are no SLC 64 GB cards, as far as I know. These fast speeds are obtained by using fast memory and parallel architecture. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

October 31st, 2009, 06:05 PM	#18
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Gints, Solid State Drives are used entirely different than CompactFlash cards for video recording. The File Allocation Table, as used by a typical operating system is updated almost constantly when any program in a computer is writing to a hard drive or Solid State Drive. We have designed the nanoFlash to avoid these constant updates. It is no surprise to me that some Solid State Drives are wearing out when being used in normal computer applications. We expect our recommended CompactFlash cards to work for years, even if used continuously. The wear that we place on a CompactFlash can is no where near as heavy as everyday usage on a Solid State Drive. We do recommend purchasing CompactFlash cards with a lifetime warranty. One always has the option of purchasing SLC CompactFlash cards if desired. The largest that I know of are 16 GB at this time. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

October 31st, 2009, 07:19 PM	#20
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Mark, A SLC, Single Level Cell, uses technology which uses only one level of voltage to represent 1 bit. Voltage Present = 1, No Voltage Present = 0, or it could be reversed, but this is simpler and faster than MLC. MLC is Multiple Level Cell. Different voltages represent the values placed into the cell. Thus, one can store multiple bits in one cell. The difference is that it takes longer to generate the proper voltages and to read out the exact voltages which respresent the values. SLC's have more endurance. However, modern MLC's have been used for years, and good ones are very durable and reliable. Most CompactFlash cards are MLC. More expensive ones may be SLC. At any given point in time, so far at least, MLC has higher capacity. SLC used to be higher in performance, but the very latest high capacity MLC CompactFlash cards have higher capacity than most SLC cards at this time. The nanoFlash and Flash XDR can work with quality, qualified CompactFlash cards of either SLC or MLC design. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

October 31st, 2009, 09:18 PM	#21
Mark Job Trustee Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada Posts: 1,138	Dan Elaborated Hi Dan: Thanks for the heads up on this. You learn something new every day.

November 7th, 2009, 11:16 PM	#23
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Barry, Yes. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

October 31st, 2009, 05:37 PM	#17
Gints Klimanis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,222	Thanks for the info, Dan. The data integrity of MLC is scary, though with greater capacity, each cell is used less often in the same application. We're already reading about the high capacity Solid State Drives (SSD) that are wearing out. Here is a good site for SSD articles that contain comparisons between "consumer grade" MLC and "professional grade" SLC: Are MLC SSDs Ever Safe in Enterprise Apps? - article on STORAGEsearch.com

October 31st, 2009, 07:08 PM	#19
Mark Job Trustee Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada Posts: 1,138	Hi Dan: What's an SLC Compact Flash Card ? EDIT: And I answer my own question = Single-Level Cell EDIT 2: OK. I read this http://www.supertalent.com/datasheet...whitepaper.pdf

November 10th, 2009, 08:31 PM	#24
Ned Soltz Major Player Join Date: May 2006 Location: Teaneck, NJ Posts: 659	FYI-- DVNation shows no stock of 64gb cards as of Nov 10.