MXF sample files for testing

Dan Keaton · January 25th, 2009, 02:30 PM

Dear Mark,

Bill Ravens has been seriously testing our firmware release 0.0.218, which includes MXF support.

He reports that both audio and video is working fine in Vegas 8.0(c) and Edius.

He also reports Avid could not read our files. We beleive this to be related to the audio.

Mark, we feel that he is getting the same error message that you have posted.

Here are our current theories:

Technically, codecs should be reading the main part of the audio/video files to set up the parameters to process the file.

However, certain processing routines could be reading information from the metadata to set up the parameters.

We are still working with Avid.

In addition, we will be running tests after we load certain metadata fields with data.

Technically, according to the standard, we should not have to do this.

But, we feel that this may be the most expedient way to get our files to work with Avid.

This is not to bash Avid, I am just attempting to give a progress report.

We feel that many other codec developers are using the metadata to setup the parameters.

Also, we will be sending some files to Cineform for their testing.

Bill Raven's testing has been extensive, but this does not mean that we are golden in working with Edius and Sony Vegas 8.0(c). It just means that our limited tests worked.

Mark Job · January 26th, 2009, 01:06 AM

Hi Dan:
I believe your theory might well be proven, because I too, after watching very carefully what Avid does during the import process (Especially "when" the process fails) after several times, began to suspect a header data placement error, or quite possibly, where the header data is pointing to in the MXF file regarding where the audio sample chunk is placed could be incorrect. My Avid Media Composer begins to load the audio stream and only then fails. Hmmmm, how's Avid coding the header info ? I think the audio & video data is perfectly good for Media Composer, but the header data isn't. Here's a clue for you: Since the data error resides with the audio portion of the decoding process, then look for where the header data tells the application (MC) where to get the "sample" information for the codec. I suspect the data header tells Avid MC to look for the audio sample in a place in the MXF file it is not at. (??) This is just a theory on my part. You would know better being a software engineer yourself.

Perrone Ford · January 26th, 2009, 01:25 AM

Samples dropped into Vegas 8.1 just fine with audio.

No awards for cinematography though!! Keep the engineers in the lab!!

Dan Keaton · January 26th, 2009, 04:57 AM

Dear Mark,

We agree, thanks for your confirmation.

We will be examining our MXF header data, including all MXF fields, comparing it to a file that works in Avid.

Then we will be modifying our code to include this information in the appropriate metadata fields.

I feel that we are close.

We are getting confirmations that our MXF files are working perfectly in both Edius and Vegas 8.0(c). This is encouraging.

Thank you for posting.

Dan Keaton · January 26th, 2009, 05:07 AM

Dear Perrone,

In our lab, we have a large picture window from which one can easily see I-25 going through Colorado Springs. The view overlooks the "Garden of the Gods", an amazing place, and Pikes Peak.

However, we are looking though a plate glass window. At times we turn off the lights in the lab to reduce the reflections.

We have an XH G1, XL H1, and XL H1s allow pointing through the window. These are connected to typically four Flash XDR's for our testing.

At times, when we leave at night, we load up the Flash XDR's with CompactFlash Cards and then let them record all night. Then we check each and every file in the morning.

We could easily improve the images by rigging up a small box against the window to prevent the glare. A polarizer would help also.

Steven Lyons · January 26th, 2009, 05:57 AM

adobe premier cs3 with matrox axio.
Have tested all matrox presets for 1080i and while the mxf test files do import ok
they wont display a picture and when trying to load onto timeline system locks up.

Dan Keaton · January 26th, 2009, 07:11 AM

Dear Steve,

Adobe Premiere, including CS3, does not include a codec for XDCam 4:2:2 HL type files.

Regretfully, the necesary codec has to be purchased separately.

Here is a link to a MainConcept codec:

MainConcept: Information

A free demo version is available from MainConcept.

Perrone Ford · January 26th, 2009, 08:21 AM

Dan, I was only kidding, but it's hilarious how close I was! Keep up the good wok guys.

Tommy Schell · January 27th, 2009, 01:57 PM

We've got another file to try, found here:

(80 Mbytes)
http://convergent-design.fileburst.c...0i5994.MXF.zip

We were able to load this file into Media Composer 3.1.1 .
(No awards for cinematography here, either, I'm afraid.)

More files coming and another release soon.

Tommy

Mark Job · January 27th, 2009, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tommy Schell

We've got another file to try, found here:

(80 Mbytes)
http://convergent-design.fileburst.c...0i5994.MXF.zip

We were able to load this file into Media Composer 3.1.1 .
(No awards for cinematography here, either, I'm afraid.)

More files coming and another release soon.

Tommy

....Perfection ! This file imports beautifully as an Avid DNxHD 220 10 bit file ! This is the most exciting Colorado gas station I have ever seen ! The sight was wonderful against the beautiful Colorado Mountains ;-) Your local overpass looks well built too :-) - Better than our local overpasses in Montreal, Quebec, which fall down ! My version of Avid Media Composer is 3.0.0

EDIT: Uhh, I hope you got I was tongue in cheek about the Gas station & underpass comments ? ;-) I was serious about our road structures in Quebec ;-) Nudege, nudge, wink, wink.

Dan Keaton · January 27th, 2009, 04:37 PM

Dear Mark,

Thank you for the feedback.

We are trying.

We expect to post a new firmware release tonight. At this time we are doing more testing, specifically various video formats.

Mark Job · January 27th, 2009, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Keaton

Dear Mark,

Thank you for the feedback.

We are trying.

We expect to post a new firmware release tonight. At this time we are doing more testing, specifically various video formats.

...I imported this into a 1920 x 1080 project, which imports and plays perfectly-even in full screen mode at the highest resolution. I also switched project formats down to HDV (As it said on the video screen) @ 1440 x 1080 and it plays equally well in Media Composer in full Screen Playback mode. I was able to drop it onto the timeline and play it. Audio quality was good.

Steven Lyons · January 27th, 2009, 05:02 PM

adobe cs3 with Matrox axio le is supposed to support XDCam 4:2:2 type files.
I was excited by this initially because using the matrox hardware should give me realtime using these files, I have posted my findings on the Matrox forum and hope they can shed some light.
maybe it is the bit rate of the files, are they 50mbs or 100mbs?
or are HL type files in some way different?

Steven Lyons · February 11th, 2009, 05:03 PM

I have been talking to matrox axio about lack of compatibility of these mxf files with their 3.6 drivers with premier pro cs3.
I directed them to the posted mxf files and they did some tests with their new 4.0 drivers with premier pro cs4 and all files loaded and played back fine, this is indeed good news.

Dan Keaton · February 12th, 2009, 04:48 AM

Dear Steven,

Thanks for posting the good news.

January 25th, 2009, 02:30 PM	#16
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Mark, Bill Ravens has been seriously testing our firmware release 0.0.218, which includes MXF support. He reports that both audio and video is working fine in Vegas 8.0(c) and Edius. He also reports Avid could not read our files. We beleive this to be related to the audio. Mark, we feel that he is getting the same error message that you have posted. Here are our current theories: Technically, codecs should be reading the main part of the audio/video files to set up the parameters to process the file. However, certain processing routines could be reading information from the metadata to set up the parameters. We are still working with Avid. In addition, we will be running tests after we load certain metadata fields with data. Technically, according to the standard, we should not have to do this. But, we feel that this may be the most expedient way to get our files to work with Avid. This is not to bash Avid, I am just attempting to give a progress report. We feel that many other codec developers are using the metadata to setup the parameters. Also, we will be sending some files to Cineform for their testing. Bill Raven's testing has been extensive, but this does not mean that we are golden in working with Edius and Sony Vegas 8.0(c). It just means that our limited tests worked. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

January 26th, 2009, 01:06 AM	#17
Mark Job Trustee Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada Posts: 1,138	Replying to Dan's post above Hi Dan: I believe your theory might well be proven, because I too, after watching very carefully what Avid does during the import process (Especially "when" the process fails) after several times, began to suspect a header data placement error, or quite possibly, where the header data is pointing to in the MXF file regarding where the audio sample chunk is placed could be incorrect. My Avid Media Composer begins to load the audio stream and only then fails. Hmmmm, how's Avid coding the header info ? I think the audio & video data is perfectly good for Media Composer, but the header data isn't. Here's a clue for you: Since the data error resides with the audio portion of the decoding process, then look for where the header data tells the application (MC) where to get the "sample" information for the codec. I suspect the data header tells Avid MC to look for the audio sample in a place in the MXF file it is not at. (??) This is just a theory on my part. You would know better being a software engineer yourself.

January 26th, 2009, 01:25 AM	#18
Perrone Ford Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Posts: 4,100	Samples dropped into Vegas 8.1 just fine with audio. No awards for cinematography though!! Keep the engineers in the lab!! __________________ DVX100, PMW-EX1, Canon 550D, FigRig, Dell Octocore, Avid MC4/5, MB Looks, RedCineX, Matrox MX02 mini, GTech RAID, Edirol R-4, Senn. G2 Evo, Countryman, Moles and Lowels.

January 26th, 2009, 04:57 AM	#19
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Mark, We agree, thanks for your confirmation. We will be examining our MXF header data, including all MXF fields, comparing it to a file that works in Avid. Then we will be modifying our code to include this information in the appropriate metadata fields. I feel that we are close. We are getting confirmations that our MXF files are working perfectly in both Edius and Vegas 8.0(c). This is encouraging. Thank you for posting. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

January 26th, 2009, 05:07 AM	#20
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Perrone, In our lab, we have a large picture window from which one can easily see I-25 going through Colorado Springs. The view overlooks the "Garden of the Gods", an amazing place, and Pikes Peak. However, we are looking though a plate glass window. At times we turn off the lights in the lab to reduce the reflections. We have an XH G1, XL H1, and XL H1s allow pointing through the window. These are connected to typically four Flash XDR's for our testing. At times, when we leave at night, we load up the Flash XDR's with CompactFlash Cards and then let them record all night. Then we check each and every file in the morning. We could easily improve the images by rigging up a small box against the window to prevent the glare. A polarizer would help also. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

January 26th, 2009, 05:57 AM	#21
Steven Lyons Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Gold Coast Australia Posts: 28	mxf support adobe premier cs3 with matrox axio. Have tested all matrox presets for 1080i and while the mxf test files do import ok they wont display a picture and when trying to load onto timeline system locks up.

January 26th, 2009, 07:11 AM	#22
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Steve, Adobe Premiere, including CS3, does not include a codec for XDCam 4:2:2 HL type files. Regretfully, the necesary codec has to be purchased separately. Here is a link to a MainConcept codec: MainConcept: Information A free demo version is available from MainConcept. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

January 26th, 2009, 08:21 AM	#23
Perrone Ford Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Posts: 4,100	Dan, I was only kidding, but it's hilarious how close I was! Keep up the good wok guys. __________________ DVX100, PMW-EX1, Canon 550D, FigRig, Dell Octocore, Avid MC4/5, MB Looks, RedCineX, Matrox MX02 mini, GTech RAID, Edirol R-4, Senn. G2 Evo, Countryman, Moles and Lowels.

January 27th, 2009, 01:57 PM	#24
Tommy Schell Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Colorado Springs, CO Posts: 65	We've got another file to try, found here: (80 Mbytes) http://convergent-design.fileburst.c...0i5994.MXF.zip We were able to load this file into Media Composer 3.1.1 . (No awards for cinematography here, either, I'm afraid.) More files coming and another release soon. Tommy

January 27th, 2009, 04:37 PM	#26
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Mark, Thank you for the feedback. We are trying. We expect to post a new firmware release tonight. At this time we are doing more testing, specifically various video formats. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

January 27th, 2009, 05:02 PM	#28
Steven Lyons Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Gold Coast Australia Posts: 28	mxf files compatibility adobe cs3 with Matrox axio le is supposed to support XDCam 4:2:2 type files. I was excited by this initially because using the matrox hardware should give me realtime using these files, I have posted my findings on the Matrox forum and hope they can shed some light. maybe it is the bit rate of the files, are they 50mbs or 100mbs? or are HL type files in some way different?

February 11th, 2009, 05:03 PM	#29
Steven Lyons Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Gold Coast Australia Posts: 28	mxf files compatibility I have been talking to matrox axio about lack of compatibility of these mxf files with their 3.6 drivers with premier pro cs3. I directed them to the posted mxf files and they did some tests with their new 4.0 drivers with premier pro cs4 and all files loaded and played back fine, this is indeed good news.

February 12th, 2009, 04:48 AM	#30
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Steven, Thanks for posting the good news. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia