XDR Featuring Quicktime File Fast Importable in Avid ? at DVinfo.net

Mark Job · January 18th, 2009, 06:23 PM

Hi Dan:
I've been reading about how the Flash XDR records Quicktime files which import and work well in Final Cut Pro. This is great news, but my local industry doesn't use Final Cut Pro as its primary NLE tool (Yet). We're all on Avid Media Composer for Network TV, TV Commercial, Music Video, High End Industrial videos, and Episodic TV Drama. I sincerely hope full Quicktime MXF based codec record capability is facilitated ASAP. What would be useful is to offer the option of QT DNxHD 145 8 bit or 10 bit codec, or DNxHD 220X (10 Bit) as the Quicktime wrapper. The techical benefits of the DNxHD codec are sensational ! You can read the tech details and licensing info at Avid DNxHD Codec .

Dan Keaton · January 18th, 2009, 10:15 PM

Dear Mark,

We are very close with our MXF support.

This will allow you to easily transfer a Flash XDR recording to Avid.

Our "Essence" (the actual video and audio data) is MPEG2.

Then we put it into a proper Quicktime or MXF wrapper.

I will look into DNxHD. I have read the link you provided.

Mark Job · January 18th, 2009, 11:16 PM

Hi Dan:
I work in the DNxHD codec all of the time and this is an absolutely visually lossless codec. I've done several tests from original HDV to DNxHD 145 8 bit and there is no visually discernable difference. Avid wants everyone to code for for DNxHD, so the terms for convergent will be quite agreeable, no doubt. The DNxHD 220 Mbit 10bit is awesome for even the most exacting primary & secondary color corrections. If the Flash XDR could somehow be setup to do a direct Quicktime capture in Avid Quicktime DNxHD 220 10 bit, then this could be fast imported into Avid, or played directly from the CF cards.

Bill Ravens · January 19th, 2009, 06:53 AM

MArk...

The Flash XDR uses a purpose built Sony codec for compressing the data stream into Sony mxf. There is no other compression scheme possible with Flash XDR without changing the internal processor. A software solution is your best bet. Converting the Sony mxf to DNxHD after you've transferred the recorded files to your HD.

Personally, Cineform is about to make LUT's available in version 4 of their transcoder. LUT's would be promoted as metadata, along with the image file. This is a really attractive solution, well worth the extra encoding time.

Mark Job · January 20th, 2009, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Ravens

MArk...

The Flash XDR uses a purpose built Sony codec for compressing the data stream into Sony mxf. There is no other compression scheme possible with Flash XDR without changing the internal processor. A software solution is your best bet. Converting the Sony mxf to DNxHD after you've transferred the recorded files to your HD.

Personally, Cineform is about to make LUT's available in version 4 of their transcoder. LUT's would be promoted as metadata, along with the image file. This is a really attractive solution, well worth the extra encoding time.

...Hey Bill. I was thinking one could simply "Play Out" the CF cards from the XDR and capture using whatever codec you wish with MC. This could be a simple work around. Since the XDR has an RS 422, then maybe it will do a full batch cap and recap via VITC TC ?

Dan Keaton · January 20th, 2009, 03:41 AM

Dear Mark,

Yes, any clips recorded by the Flash XDR, can simply be played back from with the Flash XDR, via the HD-SDI outputs, then captured by the codec of your choice.

This works if the files were originally recorded in Quicktime, our own CDV format, or MXF.

Nic van Oudtshoorn · January 23rd, 2009, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Keaton

Dear Mark,

Yes, any clips recorded by the Flash XDR, can simply be played back from with the Flash XDR, via the HD-SDI outputs, then captured by the codec of your choice.

This works if the files were originally recorded in Quicktime, our own CDV format, or MXF.

I use this method all the time to record via SDI from the XDR to a Black Magic Decklink HD card on a PC (a very fast one I must add with high-speed SCSI drives) set to 4:2:2 uncompressed. I can record either to 50i or 25p, although I usually match the Decklink setting to the recording setting on the XDR, which I in turn set to CDV. The results are brilliant and I have never experienced a dropped frame or any artifacts. I edit the resulting uncompressed files in Premiere Pro and After Effects.

My question to the Convergent Design experts is: if I am in the field, can I simply copy all the files on the SD cards to a hard disk on my laptop (ensuring each SD card is copied to a separate subdirectory), then when I get back to the editing suite copy them back to SD cards, re-insert them in the XDR and play them back via SDI as above?

I am off to a major shoot in Africa soon and would like to use this method if it is foolproof.

Dan Keaton · January 23rd, 2009, 07:10 PM

Dear Nic,

I have checked with our engineers and we do not recommend this procedure.

I am sorry, but we do not feel that this can be done reliably.

There is a hidden file that would have to be copied and restored, but everything would have to be just right for this to work.

I would not risk it.

January 18th, 2009, 06:23 PM	#1
Mark Job Trustee Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada Posts: 1,138	XDR Featuring Quicktime File Fast Importable in Avid ? Hi Dan: I've been reading about how the Flash XDR records Quicktime files which import and work well in Final Cut Pro. This is great news, but my local industry doesn't use Final Cut Pro as its primary NLE tool (Yet). We're all on Avid Media Composer for Network TV, TV Commercial, Music Video, High End Industrial videos, and Episodic TV Drama. I sincerely hope full Quicktime MXF based codec record capability is facilitated ASAP. What would be useful is to offer the option of QT DNxHD 145 8 bit or 10 bit codec, or DNxHD 220X (10 Bit) as the Quicktime wrapper. The techical benefits of the DNxHD codec are sensational ! You can read the tech details and licensing info at Avid DNxHD Codec .

January 18th, 2009, 10:15 PM	#2
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Mark, We are very close with our MXF support. This will allow you to easily transfer a Flash XDR recording to Avid. Our "Essence" (the actual video and audio data) is MPEG2. Then we put it into a proper Quicktime or MXF wrapper. I will look into DNxHD. I have read the link you provided. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

January 20th, 2009, 03:41 AM	#6
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Mark, Yes, any clips recorded by the Flash XDR, can simply be played back from with the Flash XDR, via the HD-SDI outputs, then captured by the codec of your choice. This works if the files were originally recorded in Quicktime, our own CDV format, or MXF. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

January 23rd, 2009, 07:10 PM	#8
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Nic, I have checked with our engineers and we do not recommend this procedure. I am sorry, but we do not feel that this can be done reliably. There is a hidden file that would have to be copied and restored, but everything would have to be just right for this to work. I would not risk it. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

January 18th, 2009, 11:16 PM	#3
Mark Job Trustee Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada Posts: 1,138	Hi Dan: I work in the DNxHD codec all of the time and this is an absolutely visually lossless codec. I've done several tests from original HDV to DNxHD 145 8 bit and there is no visually discernable difference. Avid wants everyone to code for for DNxHD, so the terms for convergent will be quite agreeable, no doubt. The DNxHD 220 Mbit 10bit is awesome for even the most exacting primary & secondary color corrections. If the Flash XDR could somehow be setup to do a direct Quicktime capture in Avid Quicktime DNxHD 220 10 bit, then this could be fast imported into Avid, or played directly from the CF cards.

January 19th, 2009, 06:53 AM	#4
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	MArk... The Flash XDR uses a purpose built Sony codec for compressing the data stream into Sony mxf. There is no other compression scheme possible with Flash XDR without changing the internal processor. A software solution is your best bet. Converting the Sony mxf to DNxHD after you've transferred the recorded files to your HD. Personally, Cineform is about to make LUT's available in version 4 of their transcoder. LUT's would be promoted as metadata, along with the image file. This is a really attractive solution, well worth the extra encoding time.