Updated Convergent Designs Flash XDR F.A.Q.

Mike Schell · November 6th, 2007, 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Hurd

Sure, the XDR will be compatible with the Sony PMW-EX1. The EX1 has an SDI output and the XDR is an SDI recorder, so no problem. However, and this is nothing against what Convergent is doing, but I'm pretty sure that most folks who buy the EX1 will find its onboard SxS flash memory XDCAM HD recording system to be perfectly adequate for their needs, making the XDR redundant unless you want it there for dual media recording / instant backup duties.

Hi Chris-
I would agree that most users will find the quality of the EX1 acceptable, but I think they will consider the Flash XDR for it's improved video quality. Both products record MPEG2 to Flash memory, but the EX1 is limited to 35 Mbps Long-GOP 4:2:0, while Flash XDR will go up to 100 Mbps 4:2:2 Long-GOP or 160 Mbps I-Frame Only. In this application, the SxS would be used as the backup memory.

Mike Schell

James Huenergardt · November 6th, 2007, 08:51 AM

Mike,

I'm wondering how the FAT32 4GIG limitation will affect my work flow.

If I have a clip that's going to be over 4GIG, once I get it onto my computer, is there any way to combine the clips together?

I guess I could put them in one sequence and the edit the sequence as a clip, but Premiere Pro really slows down when you do that.

How does one handle this in the editing software like Premiere Pro?

Also, I'm a little rusty on my computer math. At 160Mbps, how long is a 4GIG clip? What about 100Mbps?

I'm pretty excited about this device. I have an EX1 coming and can't wait to put my order in for the Flash XDR!

Also, am I going to need to use 'pro' quality batteries or will my old Sony batteries that power my Z1U work?

Alan Waters · November 6th, 2007, 09:46 AM

so how long can you record for with 100mbps?

Mike Schell · November 6th, 2007, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by James Huenergardt

Mike,

I'm wondering how the FAT32 4GIG limitation will affect my work flow.

If I have a clip that's going to be over 4GIG, once I get it onto my computer, is there any way to combine the clips together?

I guess I could put them in one sequence and the edit the sequence as a clip, but Premiere Pro really slows down when you do that.

How does one handle this in the editing software like Premiere Pro?

Also, I'm a little rusty on my computer math. At 160Mbps, how long is a 4GIG clip? What about 100Mbps?

I'm pretty excited about this device. I have an EX1 coming and can't wait to put my order in for the Flash XDR!

Also, am I going to need to use 'pro' quality batteries or will my old Sony batteries that power my Z1U work?

Hi James-
Very good questions. Your understanding regarding the 4G file limit is correct, you will need to place the files in the same sequence. The individual files could be combined together, but this would require a special utility on the PC/MAC.

At 100 Mbps you have 320 seconds of footage in a 4GB file, at 160Mbps you get 200 seconds.

We're still working on the battery options, so I need to defer this last question until we have the various options finalized. Currently, Flash XDR has a 4-pin XLR connector for power, but we are studying various other mounting options.

Mike Schell

Joe Carney · November 6th, 2007, 11:54 AM

Hopefully you will look at the upcoming SATA II compatible SSHDs. You could make a small removable Raid 0 cartridge for the XDR recorder, then a simple read only device with interfaces for PciE, eSata, Firewire.

Seagate is planning on 120gig SSHDs in 2008. Write speeds on current Raid 0 configurations are 45MB ps and getting faster each generation. Samsung's upcoming 64GB is supposed to be 100MB write.

Just my .02

Mike Schell · November 6th, 2007, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe Carney

Hopefully you will look at the upcoming SATA II compatible SSHDs. You could make a small removable Raid 0 cartridge for the XDR recorder, then a simple read only device with interfaces for PciE, eSata, Firewire.

Seagate is planning on 120gig SSHDs in 2008. Write speeds on current Raid 0 configurations are 45MB ps and getting faster each generation. Samsung's upcoming 64GB is supposed to be 100MB write.

Just my .02

Hi Joe-
We are watching this technology like a hawk and already have NDAs with some of the leading manufacturers of SSD. So, I can't say much, but you're on the right track.

Mike Schell

John Mitchell · November 6th, 2007, 06:44 PM

Mike is there any reason why the FlashXDR has to use FAT32? I know it is for cross platform compatibility, but could it not be designed to use both FAT32 and NTFS.

FAT32 is not very robust and the 2 gig files do present problems in NLE workflows. For example on multicam shoots when it comes to grouping clips, having a bunch of different clips that stop and start at different times creates brain teasing problems if you don't have matching timecode.

John Mitchell · November 6th, 2007, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Schell

Hi Chris-
I would agree that most users will find the quality of the EX1 acceptable, but I think they will consider the Flash XDR for it's improved video quality. Both products record MPEG2 to Flash memory, but the EX1 is limited to 35 Mbps Long-GOP 4:2:0, while Flash XDR will go up to 100 Mbps 4:2:2 Long-GOP or 160 Mbps I-Frame Only. In this application, the SxS would be used as the backup memory.

Mike Schell

That and the extra ease of editing and outputting I frame - I concur.

Thomas Smet · November 6th, 2007, 07:09 PM

What edit systems that can work with HD at decent rates still use Fat32? Didn't that die off with Windows 98? Sorry I have been using NTFS for as long as I can remember and I cannot remember what still uses Fat32.

John Mitchell · November 6th, 2007, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomas Smet

What edit systems that can work with HD at decent rates still use Fat32? Didn't that die off with Windows 98? Sorry I have been using NTFS for as long as I can remember and I cannot remember what still uses Fat32.

None as far as I know Thomas. I was referring to the fact that you can mount FAT32 on a Mac or a PC, not its edit capability. I was asking for NTFS because I feel it is more stable and there is no need to concatenate files.

Mike Schell · November 6th, 2007, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Mitchell

Mike is there any reason why the FlashXDR has to use FAT32? I know it is for cross platform compatibility, but could it not be designed to use both FAT32 and NTFS.

FAT32 is not very robust and the 2 gig files do present problems in NLE workflows. For example on multicam shoots when it comes to grouping clips, having a bunch of different clips that stop and start at different times creates brain teasing problems if you don't have matching timecode.

Hi John-
We choose FAT32 simply for time to market reasons. We concur that NTFS is a better overall choice. I'll add this to our engineering discussion tomorrow and ask if we can add this to the roadmap for a future software upgrade. I can't make any promises yet, but we will investigate further.

Mike Schell

John Mitchell · November 6th, 2007, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Schell

Hi John-
We choose FAT32 simply for time to market reasons. We concur that NTFS is a better overall choice. I'll add this to our engineering discussion tomorrow and ask if we can add this to the roadmap for a future software upgrade. I can't make any promises yet, but we will investigate further.

Mike Schell

Can't ask for any more than that!

I guess it does become difficult for you guys to support multiple filesystems (I guess the Mac guys would like their's as well) but if it is on a wishlist that's more of a hearing than you'd get from many.

Carl Dieker · November 7th, 2007, 07:50 AM

I have been looking for info on wether Convergent Designs upcoming FLASH XDR records in 10 bit 4:2:2 100 mbps I-frame or only in 8 bit.
Does anybody know?

Thanks,

Calle

Mike Schell · November 7th, 2007, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carl Dieker

I have been looking for info on wether Convergent Designs upcoming FLASH XDR records in 10 bit 4:2:2 100 mbps I-frame or only in 8 bit.
Does anybody know?

Thanks,

Calle

Since the Flash XDR uses an MPEG2 CODEC, it's 8-bits 4:2:2. All MPEG2 based products, such as the Sony XDCAM HD and EX family as well as HDCAM are all 8-bit CODEC, as well as the Panasonic DVCProHD CODEC.

Mike Schell
Convergent Design

Brian Langeman · November 15th, 2007, 09:47 AM

Could you choose any format to record onto the flash cards? For instance, if you were to use the HD SDI from the Sony EX1, could you record DVCPRO HD on the XDR? Or does it have to be XDCAM HD?

I would be interested in the full 1080P 4:2:2 160 Mbps I frame compression for compositing and editing issues as most people here probably are too. But does FCP 6 support this? I see XDCAM HD 35 Mbps options under the codecs. Does it limit it to 35 Mbps? Would you have to use something like the Apple ProRes codec, cause it's 4:2:2 too.

November 6th, 2007, 11:54 AM	#65
Joe Carney Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Centreville Va Posts: 1,828	Hopefully you will look at the upcoming SATA II compatible SSHDs. You could make a small removable Raid 0 cartridge for the XDR recorder, then a simple read only device with interfaces for PciE, eSata, Firewire. Seagate is planning on 120gig SSHDs in 2008. Write speeds on current Raid 0 configurations are 45MB ps and getting faster each generation. Samsung's upcoming 64GB is supposed to be 100MB write. Just my .02 __________________ Boycott Guinness, bring back the pint!!!

November 7th, 2007, 07:50 AM	#73
Carl Dieker New Boot Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Stockholm, Sweden Posts: 13	FLASH XDR records in 10 bit? I have been looking for info on wether Convergent Designs upcoming FLASH XDR records in 10 bit 4:2:2 100 mbps I-frame or only in 8 bit. Does anybody know? Thanks, Calle

November 6th, 2007, 08:51 AM	#62
James Huenergardt Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Chehalis, WA Posts: 513	Mike, I'm wondering how the FAT32 4GIG limitation will affect my work flow. If I have a clip that's going to be over 4GIG, once I get it onto my computer, is there any way to combine the clips together? I guess I could put them in one sequence and the edit the sequence as a clip, but Premiere Pro really slows down when you do that. How does one handle this in the editing software like Premiere Pro? Also, I'm a little rusty on my computer math. At 160Mbps, how long is a 4GIG clip? What about 100Mbps? I'm pretty excited about this device. I have an EX1 coming and can't wait to put my order in for the Flash XDR! Also, am I going to need to use 'pro' quality batteries or will my old Sony batteries that power my Z1U work?

November 6th, 2007, 09:46 AM	#63
Alan Waters Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Ireland Posts: 36	so how long can you record for with 100mbps?

November 6th, 2007, 06:44 PM	#67
John Mitchell Contributor Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 873	Mike is there any reason why the FlashXDR has to use FAT32? I know it is for cross platform compatibility, but could it not be designed to use both FAT32 and NTFS. FAT32 is not very robust and the 2 gig files do present problems in NLE workflows. For example on multicam shoots when it comes to grouping clips, having a bunch of different clips that stop and start at different times creates brain teasing problems if you don't have matching timecode.

November 6th, 2007, 07:09 PM	#69
Thomas Smet Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 1,719	What edit systems that can work with HD at decent rates still use Fat32? Didn't that die off with Windows 98? Sorry I have been using NTFS for as long as I can remember and I cannot remember what still uses Fat32.

November 15th, 2007, 09:47 AM	#75
Brian Langeman Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Leamington, Ontario, Canada Posts: 25	Could you choose any format to record onto the flash cards? For instance, if you were to use the HD SDI from the Sony EX1, could you record DVCPRO HD on the XDR? Or does it have to be XDCAM HD? I would be interested in the full 1080P 4:2:2 160 Mbps I frame compression for compositing and editing issues as most people here probably are too. But does FCP 6 support this? I see XDCAM HD 35 Mbps options under the codecs. Does it limit it to 35 Mbps? Would you have to use something like the Apple ProRes codec, cause it's 4:2:2 too.