Exported movie looks like poo! at DVinfo.net

William N Zarvis · January 18th, 2007, 04:38 PM

I just edited a 30 minute HD video in PP2 shot on the Sony HDR-FX1. When I export to cineform avi (upper field first)and play in media player the video "flickers". When I export with lower field first the flicker is almost gone but the video seems to be playing a little faster like it is slightly sped up - it's noticeble but not super fast.
What am I doing wrong? VLC won't even play these files claiming the AVIs are broken! How do I export correctly?

My computer is a duo core 4200+ AMD with 2 gigs of ram, a 500 gig raid 0, and a 7600 GT nvidia card.

David Newman · January 18th, 2007, 05:50 PM

For start you are using interlaced on a progressive display, therefore you are relying on you graphics card to de-interlace on the fly (with bob or weave, etc, so who knows what it is doing.) This is not going to look great. Upper firld first is correct for interlaced HD. Most users generating PC playback content will deinterlace the footage upon export.

Mark Leonard · January 18th, 2007, 05:51 PM

Just de-interlace when you export :)

Steven Gotz · January 18th, 2007, 11:07 PM

You might be a lot happier exporting to WMV-HD (WM9) instead. I use 8Mbps because that works on my AveL Linkplayer2 DVD player. But it looks good on a PC as well.

Douglas Turner · January 19th, 2007, 12:22 AM

Unfortunately I find that VLC is poo at playing CFHD avi files... use Media Player Classic in preference.

Also any interlaced footage will look like poo on your computer monitor until you deinterlace or preview on an interlaced monitor (like a TV!).

Steven Gotz · January 19th, 2007, 09:36 AM

Who is viewing CFHD files? And why?

My CFHD will play fine in Media Player but the audio is off sync. I just don't see the point. I use it to decide what files to dump in a project, but I certainly don't ewatch the videos that way. At 40GB per hour, it is a LOT of bandwidth for no real purpose.

Douglas Turner · January 19th, 2007, 03:10 PM

Hi Steven,

I need one virtually lossless output from my feature film from which to render out to WMV HD, HD DVD, HD Divx, SD DVD PAL/NTSC etc...

Compared to uncompressed 1920x1080 uncompressed avi or mov, 40GB per hr isn't a big file - even for a 90 min feature.

I prefer to use Sorensen Squeeze than Premiere to do these compressions... so that's the reason why I want to render out to CFHD.

Also, Media Player Classic plays them fine. Avoid Media Player :)

Cheers, Doug.

Steven Gotz · January 19th, 2007, 05:07 PM

I understand why you export to that format, I just don't understand why you would try to play it in a player and have it come out perfectly. Skip that step and the rest makes sense.

William N Zarvis · January 19th, 2007, 11:19 PM

I exported to a de-interlaced CFHD avi. Still looks bad in WMP. So, if this is a bad idea what should I export to watch a good copy of my film on my 20" apple LCD monitor? Any suggestions?

Steven Gotz · January 20th, 2007, 09:24 AM

There is no real need to go all the way up in quality to a CFHD just to watch the movie in Media Player.

Depending on your screen resolution, you may want to export to a WM9 file using about 8Mbps at 1280X720, or go to a higher data rate (as high as your PC can handle, I suppose, or around 10Mbps or even more) at 1920X1080. Obviously this means using square pixels.

Douglas Turner · January 20th, 2007, 04:29 PM

Media Player Classic plays my CFHD avi files perfectly, so why not try and play it.

My advice to people to stop relying on Windows Media Player (aka Spyware) and even VLC - Media Player Classic is a brilliantly simple piece of software...

If ALL you want to do is view your high def creation, I agree with Steven, try WMV - but make sure your computer has ebough grunt.

Tim Bucklin · January 22nd, 2007, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven Gotz

Who is viewing CFHD files? And why?

My CFHD will play fine in Media Player but the audio is off sync. I just don't see the point. I use it to decide what files to dump in a project, but I certainly don't ewatch the videos that way. At 40GB per hour, it is a LOT of bandwidth for no real purpose.

Hi Steven,
If you want to improve playback in WMP, send an email to us at support@cineform.com -- we've got a quick fix that allows CFHD.avi to playback at half-res so that it is smooth and in sync with the audio.

Steven Gotz · January 22nd, 2007, 05:30 PM

Tim,

Actually, I really can't think of a need for it. That's my point. I export to CFHD AVI on a regular basis. But I don't show the video to anyone that way. For that, I use WMV, and I usually play it on my Linkplayer2.

I distribute HD frame sizes, but I either use M2T or WMV to be played on the same player I use at home, which I supplied to my corporate customers for their training facilities as part of the contract. That was my edge.

But thanks for the offer and I will keep it in mind of something changes.

Douglas Turner · January 22nd, 2007, 05:43 PM

Tim,

I have the regs fix you mention, and it's very handy. I heartily recommend using it to anyone who's PC has hassles playing full quality CFHD avi's.

Steven,

Don't poo-poo CFHD avi's!! ;) I'm lucky enough to have a fast enough PC that plays CFHD avi's perfectly... so I don't have to render out a WMV just to watch - I can render out one Master CFHD avi and also watch it. So why not?

Just back on topic for a second(!) - back to William's first question... if you want to view your creation on your PC, and you want that filmic 'look' (ie. getting rid of the nasty combing interlaced look), then try out DVFilm Maker (www.dvfilm.com) to deinterlace the footage (you lose less resolution than using native deinterlacing).

I also invested in Magic Bullet Colorista yesterday - superior and faster to render than the built-in Premiere Pro Color Correcting plug-in (see the demo on www.redgiantsoftware.com).

Cheers, Doug.

Dave Campbell · January 22nd, 2007, 08:31 PM

This thread is interesting. Meaning, I have been talking to a number of folks who have new HDTV's. A lot are really saying who cares about HD. With the qualify of the displays, the quality of the DVD widescreen movies and players, and a lot of us older folks having older eyes, and two stupid formats that are more interested in their profits than the consumer, DVD is much better to use. I know this year making my family christmas video with all HDV footage and the CFHD, VD and TMPGENC encoder, my DVD video looks great on an HD display!!

With such a large percentage of folks having DVD players, why not use them.

And for me the bottom line is I MUST have a MENU structure!!!!!!!

So, even though messing around with M2t files, cfhd.avi's, wmv, etc. may be cool for use nerds, I see no real world quantity use now, or anytime soon.

Dave

January 18th, 2007, 04:38 PM	#1
William N Zarvis Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Pittsfield, MA Posts: 86	Exported movie looks like poo! I just edited a 30 minute HD video in PP2 shot on the Sony HDR-FX1. When I export to cineform avi (upper field first)and play in media player the video "flickers". When I export with lower field first the flicker is almost gone but the video seems to be playing a little faster like it is slightly sped up - it's noticeble but not super fast. What am I doing wrong? VLC won't even play these files claiming the AVIs are broken! How do I export correctly? My computer is a duo core 4200+ AMD with 2 gigs of ram, a 500 gig raid 0, and a 7600 GT nvidia card.

January 18th, 2007, 05:50 PM	#2
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	For start you are using interlaced on a progressive display, therefore you are relying on you graphics card to de-interlace on the fly (with bob or weave, etc, so who knows what it is doing.) This is not going to look great. Upper firld first is correct for interlaced HD. Most users generating PC playback content will deinterlace the footage upon export. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

January 18th, 2007, 11:07 PM	#4
Steven Gotz Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Clermont, FL Posts: 1,520	You might be a lot happier exporting to WMV-HD (WM9) instead. I use 8Mbps because that works on my AveL Linkplayer2 DVD player. But it looks good on a PC as well. __________________ Steven Gotz http://www.stevengotz.com

January 19th, 2007, 09:36 AM	#6
Steven Gotz Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Clermont, FL Posts: 1,520	Who is viewing CFHD files? And why? My CFHD will play fine in Media Player but the audio is off sync. I just don't see the point. I use it to decide what files to dump in a project, but I certainly don't ewatch the videos that way. At 40GB per hour, it is a LOT of bandwidth for no real purpose. __________________ Steven Gotz http://www.stevengotz.com

January 19th, 2007, 05:07 PM	#8
Steven Gotz Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Clermont, FL Posts: 1,520	I understand why you export to that format, I just don't understand why you would try to play it in a player and have it come out perfectly. Skip that step and the rest makes sense. __________________ Steven Gotz http://www.stevengotz.com

January 18th, 2007, 05:51 PM	#3
Mark Leonard Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Mobile, Alabama Posts: 166	Just de-interlace when you export :)

January 19th, 2007, 12:22 AM	#5
Douglas Turner Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 132	Unfortunately I find that VLC is poo at playing CFHD avi files... use Media Player Classic in preference. Also any interlaced footage will look like poo on your computer monitor until you deinterlace or preview on an interlaced monitor (like a TV!).

January 19th, 2007, 03:10 PM	#7
Douglas Turner Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 132	Hi Steven, I need one virtually lossless output from my feature film from which to render out to WMV HD, HD DVD, HD Divx, SD DVD PAL/NTSC etc... Compared to uncompressed 1920x1080 uncompressed avi or mov, 40GB per hr isn't a big file - even for a 90 min feature. I prefer to use Sorensen Squeeze than Premiere to do these compressions... so that's the reason why I want to render out to CFHD. Also, Media Player Classic plays them fine. Avoid Media Player :) Cheers, Doug.

January 19th, 2007, 11:19 PM	#9
William N Zarvis Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Pittsfield, MA Posts: 86	I exported to a de-interlaced CFHD avi. Still looks bad in WMP. So, if this is a bad idea what should I export to watch a good copy of my film on my 20" apple LCD monitor? Any suggestions?

January 20th, 2007, 09:24 AM	#10
Steven Gotz Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Clermont, FL Posts: 1,520	There is no real need to go all the way up in quality to a CFHD just to watch the movie in Media Player. Depending on your screen resolution, you may want to export to a WM9 file using about 8Mbps at 1280X720, or go to a higher data rate (as high as your PC can handle, I suppose, or around 10Mbps or even more) at 1920X1080. Obviously this means using square pixels. __________________ Steven Gotz http://www.stevengotz.com

January 20th, 2007, 04:29 PM	#11
Douglas Turner Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 132	Media Player Classic plays my CFHD avi files perfectly, so why not try and play it. My advice to people to stop relying on Windows Media Player (aka Spyware) and even VLC - Media Player Classic is a brilliantly simple piece of software... If ALL you want to do is view your high def creation, I agree with Steven, try WMV - but make sure your computer has ebough grunt.

January 22nd, 2007, 05:30 PM	#13
Steven Gotz Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Clermont, FL Posts: 1,520	Tim, Actually, I really can't think of a need for it. That's my point. I export to CFHD AVI on a regular basis. But I don't show the video to anyone that way. For that, I use WMV, and I usually play it on my Linkplayer2. I distribute HD frame sizes, but I either use M2T or WMV to be played on the same player I use at home, which I supplied to my corporate customers for their training facilities as part of the contract. That was my edge. But thanks for the offer and I will keep it in mind of something changes. __________________ Steven Gotz http://www.stevengotz.com

January 22nd, 2007, 05:43 PM	#14
Douglas Turner Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 132	Tim, I have the regs fix you mention, and it's very handy. I heartily recommend using it to anyone who's PC has hassles playing full quality CFHD avi's. Steven, Don't poo-poo CFHD avi's!! ;) I'm lucky enough to have a fast enough PC that plays CFHD avi's perfectly... so I don't have to render out a WMV just to watch - I can render out one Master CFHD avi and also watch it. So why not? Just back on topic for a second(!) - back to William's first question... if you want to view your creation on your PC, and you want that filmic 'look' (ie. getting rid of the nasty combing interlaced look), then try out DVFilm Maker (www.dvfilm.com) to deinterlace the footage (you lose less resolution than using native deinterlacing). I also invested in Magic Bullet Colorista yesterday - superior and faster to render than the built-in Premiere Pro Color Correcting plug-in (see the demo on www.redgiantsoftware.com). Cheers, Doug.

January 22nd, 2007, 08:31 PM	#15
Dave Campbell Major Player Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 568	This thread is interesting. Meaning, I have been talking to a number of folks who have new HDTV's. A lot are really saying who cares about HD. With the qualify of the displays, the quality of the DVD widescreen movies and players, and a lot of us older folks having older eyes, and two stupid formats that are more interested in their profits than the consumer, DVD is much better to use. I know this year making my family christmas video with all HDV footage and the CFHD, VD and TMPGENC encoder, my DVD video looks great on an HD display!! With such a large percentage of folks having DVD players, why not use them. And for me the bottom line is I MUST have a MENU structure!!!!!!! So, even though messing around with M2t files, cfhd.avi's, wmv, etc. may be cool for use nerds, I see no real world quantity use now, or anytime soon. Dave