Fantasy Project and Cineform at DVinfo.net

David Kirlew · September 9th, 2006, 09:44 PM

I've a got a feature length movie that I am directin and editing. I've decided to use Cineform's Prospect HD 2K solution. Due to the fantasy element to the project I've ruled out a tape based solution. Now I've looked over Silicon Imaging camera and kept up to date on the indie spoon blog. Along with the SI camera I'm lookiing at the Red camera and the Canon XL-H1 with Wafian recorder. Which of these camera and workflows who give the best quality picture?

Gary McClurg · September 9th, 2006, 10:23 PM

The only one that I know for sure that is out is the Canon...

I think Silicon is going to be sold about now...]

The Red when it arrives sounds like it will be the best... but you're looking at least 6 months to a year before its out... because I don't know how far down the line you'd be on the order list...

David Kirlew · September 9th, 2006, 11:33 PM

I've got at least another 6-8months before we start shooting sometime probably next spring or summer. So any of those cameras the SI or red could be out. Could someone who has done tests tell how the SI camera compares to higher end camera like the Sony F900/950, VariCam, or Viper?

Luis Otero · September 10th, 2006, 07:18 AM

David,

You can be surprised about what you can get out of the JVC HD100, with Paolo's settings. Way more economic, true 24 fps, and can go uncompressed (bypassing the tape) via component output. Just search for examples throughout this community.

Luis

David Kirlew · September 13th, 2006, 07:26 AM

Thanks for the replies. I will consider my options and make a final decision to shooting and availability of the cameras.

Joe Carney · September 14th, 2006, 12:21 PM

[QUOTE=Gary McClurg]
I think Silicon is going to be sold about now...]

The company or the camera?

Simon Hansen · October 25th, 2006, 07:33 AM

Hi David,

I've been in your shoes. Want the best quality on a shoestring, that is actually ready to shoot when you shoot. If you want to sail right on the edge you're gonna have some hiccups. The latest stuff is always more tricky but gives you other advantages. Pick something that's already worked elswhere and you will have an easier time but might miss out on the very latest advantages. It comes down to your core competancies and what is impportant to you. We changed mid stream with less than 2 months to our shoot. I only got the physical cameras days before our 1st of 62 shoot days. For spoon we tested HD750, the HD100 attached to a wafian with lens adapter anf then finally the SI 1920. I have also shot 35mm on some prior scenes and we have shot with the sony 900 aswell on other projects. If I were going again - no question SI1920. If there was actually a Red ready to go It sounds great but it's not yet a viable working solution. WIll it be in 6-months when you shoot? Only red know that. The 2 options worth debating are Sony versus SI as Both are ready to go.

Sony - tape 8bit established, ready to use, 5 year + track record, digi prime lenses etc

SI - disk 10bit ,limited track record, brnad new tech, film lenses, many modes including slo mo modes

In My mind the most important things are the Lens, sensor size, compression and the bit depth. So which option best achieves these?

SI film lens ----------- Sony Digi prime
SI sensor 2/3 inch----- Sony 2/3 inch
Cineform Raw Wavelet-- Sony DCT
SI 8 bit---------------- Sony 8 bit

If you are a safe player go Sony. If you want a better picture with more options go SI. If you can work with an SI you will be more competitive that's a fact. But if you are nervous of new processes and endless adaptive thinking go Sony. Best of Luck.

Simon

David Newman · October 25th, 2006, 09:19 AM

Cool post Simon,

Last line should be "SI 10 bit---------------- Sony 8 bit"

David Kirlew · October 25th, 2006, 08:09 PM

right now I'm currently helping a friend of mine work on the script which should be done sometime spring of next year so at the earliest we would start is summer of next year. I'm still evaluating all my possible options from the JVC Wafian solution, to Red, SI, as well as the Sony F900 series and Varicam possiblities. We definately will use the CineForm Prospect HD solution because there will be a bit of blue/greenscreen work and compositing. As I continue I will keep you guys informed as far as what we want to do. Because the SI camera is available right now I'm leaning towards that solution. I am keeping a close eye on Red and how its development's is coming along

September 9th, 2006, 09:44 PM	#1
David Kirlew Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 25	Fantasy Project and Cineform I've a got a feature length movie that I am directin and editing. I've decided to use Cineform's Prospect HD 2K solution. Due to the fantasy element to the project I've ruled out a tape based solution. Now I've looked over Silicon Imaging camera and kept up to date on the indie spoon blog. Along with the SI camera I'm lookiing at the Red camera and the Canon XL-H1 with Wafian recorder. Which of these camera and workflows who give the best quality picture? __________________ David Kirlew

September 9th, 2006, 11:33 PM	#3
David Kirlew Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 25	I've got at least another 6-8months before we start shooting sometime probably next spring or summer. So any of those cameras the SI or red could be out. Could someone who has done tests tell how the SI camera compares to higher end camera like the Sony F900/950, VariCam, or Viper? __________________ David Kirlew

September 13th, 2006, 07:26 AM	#5
David Kirlew Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 25	Thanks for the replies. I will consider my options and make a final decision to shooting and availability of the cameras. __________________ David Kirlew

September 14th, 2006, 12:21 PM	#6
Joe Carney Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Centreville Va Posts: 1,828	[QUOTE=Gary McClurg] I think Silicon is going to be sold about now...] The company or the camera? __________________ Boycott Guinness, bring back the pint!!!

October 25th, 2006, 07:33 AM	#7
Simon Hansen New Boot Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Cape Town Posts: 11	Tested A few solutions Hi David, I've been in your shoes. Want the best quality on a shoestring, that is actually ready to shoot when you shoot. If you want to sail right on the edge you're gonna have some hiccups. The latest stuff is always more tricky but gives you other advantages. Pick something that's already worked elswhere and you will have an easier time but might miss out on the very latest advantages. It comes down to your core competancies and what is impportant to you. We changed mid stream with less than 2 months to our shoot. I only got the physical cameras days before our 1st of 62 shoot days. For spoon we tested HD750, the HD100 attached to a wafian with lens adapter anf then finally the SI 1920. I have also shot 35mm on some prior scenes and we have shot with the sony 900 aswell on other projects. If I were going again - no question SI1920. If there was actually a Red ready to go It sounds great but it's not yet a viable working solution. WIll it be in 6-months when you shoot? Only red know that. The 2 options worth debating are Sony versus SI as Both are ready to go. Sony - tape 8bit established, ready to use, 5 year + track record, digi prime lenses etc SI - disk 10bit ,limited track record, brnad new tech, film lenses, many modes including slo mo modes In My mind the most important things are the Lens, sensor size, compression and the bit depth. So which option best achieves these? SI film lens ----------- Sony Digi prime SI sensor 2/3 inch----- Sony 2/3 inch Cineform Raw Wavelet-- Sony DCT SI 8 bit---------------- Sony 8 bit If you are a safe player go Sony. If you want a better picture with more options go SI. If you can work with an SI you will be more competitive that's a fact. But if you are nervous of new processes and endless adaptive thinking go Sony. Best of Luck. Simon

September 9th, 2006, 10:23 PM	#2
Gary McClurg Major Player Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Springfield, MO, USA Posts: 389	The only one that I know for sure that is out is the Canon... I think Silicon is going to be sold about now...] The Red when it arrives sounds like it will be the best... but you're looking at least 6 months to a year before its out... because I don't know how far down the line you'd be on the order list...

September 10th, 2006, 07:18 AM	#4
Luis Otero Major Player Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Fort Dodge, IA Posts: 221	David, You can be surprised about what you can get out of the JVC HD100, with Paolo's settings. Way more economic, true 24 fps, and can go uncompressed (bypassing the tape) via component output. Just search for examples throughout this community. Luis

October 25th, 2006, 09:19 AM	#8
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Cool post Simon, Last line should be "SI 10 bit---------------- Sony 8 bit" __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

October 25th, 2006, 08:09 PM	#9
David Kirlew Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 25	right now I'm currently helping a friend of mine work on the script which should be done sometime spring of next year so at the earliest we would start is summer of next year. I'm still evaluating all my possible options from the JVC Wafian solution, to Red, SI, as well as the Sony F900 series and Varicam possiblities. We definately will use the CineForm Prospect HD solution because there will be a bit of blue/greenscreen work and compositing. As I continue I will keep you guys informed as far as what we want to do. Because the SI camera is available right now I'm leaning towards that solution. I am keeping a close eye on Red and how its development's is coming along __________________ David Kirlew