Prospect HD -- various questions

Dean Gough · March 23rd, 2006, 08:58 PM

I recently read an article that the Waifan HR-1 was going to add support quicktime files, am I right in assuming this functionality is automatically built into Prospect HD for people building there own recorders or is this going to be exclusive to the HR-1?

Robert Sanders · March 24th, 2006, 12:25 PM

It'll be specific to Cineform and any vendors who use their software. However, this is still rumor and speculation.

It will mostly likely only work on Intel based Macs. I believe Apple will roll out Intel PowerMacs sometimes this summer.

I would love to be able to finally use these codecs in FCP.

David Taylor · March 25th, 2006, 04:01 PM

We have not squelched rumor and inuendo posted by others postulating interest by CineForm in QuickTime, but we haven't confirmed anything either.... Was that helpful?

Geoff Murillo · June 5th, 2006, 01:40 PM

Hi David,

I spent the weekend doing some camera tests with my JVC HD100 and my new Redrock Micro M2 adapter.

When I tried to import the footage with the "Convert to Large Cineform file size", "Upscale HDV to 1920X1080" and "rotate 180 degrees for the Redrock Micro adapter", my footage comes out split horizontally with a little more than half of the image in correct orientation an the other half of the image is still upside down. Is this a bug?

Before getting the M2 adapter, I've was able to import and upscale with no problems. Is the 180 degree rotation of the image my problem? I'm editing on a 3.0ghz dual-core pc.

I want to take my 720P image up to 1080P so that I can have the ability to go out to tape in the future.

Sincerely,

-Geoff Murillo

David Newman · June 5th, 2006, 02:11 PM

What version of Prospect HD are you running? HDLink reports the version and build number in is splash screen. This works fine on my internal build of PHD.

Geoff Murillo · June 5th, 2006, 02:32 PM

Hi David,

I've got Prospect 2.0 (edit-only), build 54.

-Geoff

David Newman · June 5th, 2006, 03:00 PM

We have to get you an updated. We are up to build 65+ now on Prospect HD Ingest & Edit. Email support@cineform.com to get a download link.

Geoff Murillo · June 5th, 2006, 08:43 PM

Hi David,

I downloaded the new build and I still get the same problem.

I'm going to submit a ticket with support.

-Geoff

David Newman · June 5th, 2006, 08:57 PM

Real-time capture or M2T conversion? I tested m2t conversion, and that is working fine -- can you verifiy?

Geoff Murillo · June 5th, 2006, 09:19 PM

Hi David,
I've tried both real-time conversion and m2t conversion. Same result. I've submitted a ticket with a jpeg of a frame.

It's weird, if I only have two of the three fields selected (M2 lens adapter mode, Up convert 8-bit to 10-bit, or Up scale HDV to 1920X1080), the conversion adheres to the two advanced capture filters selected.

But when I add a third filter (any of the fields above) I get the strange horizontal split-screen effect.

-Geoff

David Newman · June 5th, 2006, 09:41 PM

Well as soon as we can reproduce it, it sounds very fixable.

Geoff Murillo · June 28th, 2006, 01:36 PM

Hi David,

I finished shooting my short film and I'm getting ready to convert all of my m2t clips (720p @ 24fps) into Cineform AVI's.

I have a couple of questions for you. I ultimately want to be able to lay my final cut out to HD tape. If I wanted to go the 1080p route, am I better off upconverting my m2t's to 1920X1080 24p AVI's before I edit, or making the conversion after I edit? I know that my titles will look softer if I convert after the edit, but if I saved the title creation until after I've upconverted my final cut, would it matter?

Or should I just output a 720p master to tape? I don't want to upconvert just to upconvert if it's going to soften my image dramatically - I'd rather stay in the native resolution if that's the case.

Do you have any thoughts on the upcoversion issue? Is the upcoversion option in HDLink better, or the same as the one in Premiere Pro 2.0? Do you think my footage will look too soft if I do upconvert? Obviously I want to maintain the highest quality.

And, if I decided to lay out a 720p project to tape, which deck would you recommend, so that I maintain the high quality of my 10-Bit Cineform files?

Thanks,

Geoff Murillo

David Newman · June 28th, 2006, 02:17 PM

Lot will depend on the work you are planning after you have mastered out. Is in going to film? There are likely better resizing for a film blow-up than either HDLink or Premiere Pro can provide, that said the availble resizers are still nice in both cases (HDLink may have the edge.) The image will not loose detail through this resize, yet it may look softer to have an 720 image in 1080p frame (this is normal), so you will likely add sharpening filters during the post to compensate. The 1080p encode will have even more compressed headroom, yet the files will be bigger -- that is the only trade-off. So if you system is faster enough do the resize on capture. Plus there are more quality export deck options for 1080p then 720p, either D5 or HDCAM-SR (best) are good choices for 1080p24 exports.

Geoff Murillo · June 28th, 2006, 06:40 PM

It's settled. I'm going to go with the 1920X1080 conversion in HDLink.

Thank You David,

-Geoff

Joe Carney · July 5th, 2006, 01:04 PM

Hopefully this can be done.

Capture PC with AJA LHe, ProspectHD and AE for effects stuff.
Do initial post/color correction work, sfx, blah, blah
Render out to eSata drives using Cineform IC.

then...
Connect drives to another PC with Vegas 6 ConnectHD, blah blah....

Capture PC will be connecting to HD100 and capturing at 8bit 4:2:2 to keep things workable in Vegas (at least for the time being).

Is the above scenario plausible?
Is there a better setup using Cineforum software to do this?

Need different machines because one will be doing finishing and surround stuff, while the other is capturing or doing sfx processing.

I'm not ready to consider Premier Pro at this time.

March 23rd, 2006, 08:58 PM	#31
Dean Gough Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Wellington, New Zealand Posts: 51	Prospect HD and Wafian HR-1 I recently read an article that the Waifan HR-1 was going to add support quicktime files, am I right in assuming this functionality is automatically built into Prospect HD for people building there own recorders or is this going to be exclusive to the HR-1?

March 24th, 2006, 12:25 PM	#32
Robert Sanders Starway Pictures Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Studio City Posts: 581	It'll be specific to Cineform and any vendors who use their software. However, this is still rumor and speculation. It will mostly likely only work on Intel based Macs. I believe Apple will roll out Intel PowerMacs sometimes this summer. I would love to be able to finally use these codecs in FCP. __________________ http://www.starwaypictures.com http://starwaypictures.blogspot.com/

June 5th, 2006, 01:40 PM	#34
Geoff Murillo Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Glendale, CA Posts: 92	Prospect HD Link conversion problem Hi David, I spent the weekend doing some camera tests with my JVC HD100 and my new Redrock Micro M2 adapter. When I tried to import the footage with the "Convert to Large Cineform file size", "Upscale HDV to 1920X1080" and "rotate 180 degrees for the Redrock Micro adapter", my footage comes out split horizontally with a little more than half of the image in correct orientation an the other half of the image is still upside down. Is this a bug? Before getting the M2 adapter, I've was able to import and upscale with no problems. Is the 180 degree rotation of the image my problem? I'm editing on a 3.0ghz dual-core pc. I want to take my 720P image up to 1080P so that I can have the ability to go out to tape in the future. Sincerely, -Geoff Murillo

June 5th, 2006, 02:11 PM	#35
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	What version of Prospect HD are you running? HDLink reports the version and build number in is splash screen. This works fine on my internal build of PHD. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

June 5th, 2006, 03:00 PM	#37
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	We have to get you an updated. We are up to build 65+ now on Prospect HD Ingest & Edit. Email support@cineform.com to get a download link. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

March 25th, 2006, 04:01 PM	#33
David Taylor Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Solana Beach, CA Posts: 853	We have not squelched rumor and inuendo posted by others postulating interest by CineForm in QuickTime, but we haven't confirmed anything either.... Was that helpful?

June 5th, 2006, 02:32 PM	#36
Geoff Murillo Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Glendale, CA Posts: 92	Hi David, I've got Prospect 2.0 (edit-only), build 54. -Geoff

June 5th, 2006, 08:43 PM	#38
Geoff Murillo Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Glendale, CA Posts: 92	Hi David, I downloaded the new build and I still get the same problem. I'm going to submit a ticket with support. -Geoff

June 5th, 2006, 08:57 PM	#39
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Real-time capture or M2T conversion? I tested m2t conversion, and that is working fine -- can you verifiy? __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

June 5th, 2006, 09:19 PM	#40
Geoff Murillo Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Glendale, CA Posts: 92	Hi David, I've tried both real-time conversion and m2t conversion. Same result. I've submitted a ticket with a jpeg of a frame. It's weird, if I only have two of the three fields selected (M2 lens adapter mode, Up convert 8-bit to 10-bit, or Up scale HDV to 1920X1080), the conversion adheres to the two advanced capture filters selected. But when I add a third filter (any of the fields above) I get the strange horizontal split-screen effect. -Geoff

June 5th, 2006, 09:41 PM	#41
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Well as soon as we can reproduce it, it sounds very fixable. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

June 28th, 2006, 01:36 PM	#42
Geoff Murillo Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Glendale, CA Posts: 92	1080p or 720p with Prospect Hi David, I finished shooting my short film and I'm getting ready to convert all of my m2t clips (720p @ 24fps) into Cineform AVI's. I have a couple of questions for you. I ultimately want to be able to lay my final cut out to HD tape. If I wanted to go the 1080p route, am I better off upconverting my m2t's to 1920X1080 24p AVI's before I edit, or making the conversion after I edit? I know that my titles will look softer if I convert after the edit, but if I saved the title creation until after I've upconverted my final cut, would it matter? Or should I just output a 720p master to tape? I don't want to upconvert just to upconvert if it's going to soften my image dramatically - I'd rather stay in the native resolution if that's the case. Do you have any thoughts on the upcoversion issue? Is the upcoversion option in HDLink better, or the same as the one in Premiere Pro 2.0? Do you think my footage will look too soft if I do upconvert? Obviously I want to maintain the highest quality. And, if I decided to lay out a 720p project to tape, which deck would you recommend, so that I maintain the high quality of my 10-Bit Cineform files? Thanks, Geoff Murillo

June 28th, 2006, 02:17 PM	#43
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Lot will depend on the work you are planning after you have mastered out. Is in going to film? There are likely better resizing for a film blow-up than either HDLink or Premiere Pro can provide, that said the availble resizers are still nice in both cases (HDLink may have the edge.) The image will not loose detail through this resize, yet it may look softer to have an 720 image in 1080p frame (this is normal), so you will likely add sharpening filters during the post to compensate. The 1080p encode will have even more compressed headroom, yet the files will be bigger -- that is the only trade-off. So if you system is faster enough do the resize on capture. Plus there are more quality export deck options for 1080p then 720p, either D5 or HDCAM-SR (best) are good choices for 1080p24 exports. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

June 28th, 2006, 06:40 PM	#44
Geoff Murillo Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Glendale, CA Posts: 92	It's settled. I'm going to go with the 1920X1080 conversion in HDLink. Thank You David, -Geoff

July 5th, 2006, 01:04 PM	#45
Joe Carney Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Centreville Va Posts: 1,828	ProspectHD, AE and Vegas Hopefully this can be done. Capture PC with AJA LHe, ProspectHD and AE for effects stuff. Do initial post/color correction work, sfx, blah, blah Render out to eSata drives using Cineform IC. then... Connect drives to another PC with Vegas 6 ConnectHD, blah blah.... Capture PC will be connecting to HD100 and capturing at 8bit 4:2:2 to keep things workable in Vegas (at least for the time being). Is the above scenario plausible? Is there a better setup using Cineforum software to do this? Need different machines because one will be doing finishing and surround stuff, while the other is capturing or doing sfx processing. I'm not ready to consider Premier Pro at this time. __________________ Boycott Guinness, bring back the pint!!!