Aspect 4.0/PPro 2.0 Compiler Problem

Michael Stewart · February 3rd, 2006, 08:40 PM

Hi Robert I would bet money it is the matrox, not only the card, many times (pinnacle was notorious for it, once it loads its proprietary codec you lose the windows codec so even without the card in or enabled, it still uses the codec of the 3rd party (at least with pinnacle it did, not sure of Matrox.

Mike

Robert Young · February 3rd, 2006, 10:15 PM

Mike
Hmmm... Well I may have to uninstall all of the Matrox stuff. However, I do keep up with the Matrox RTX100 forum. I am reading many posts by Matrox/PPro1.51/AspectHD users who are not reporting any HDV problems with that configuration, so I was hopeful.
I'm still waiting to hear from Cineform support. They have not yet ventured an opinion. PPro 1.51 has a mini version of AspectHD included. It's hard to imagine that's a conflict with PP2.0/Aspect4.0 since Cineform is currently recommending that you leave PP1.51 installed when upgrading to PP2.0/Aspect4.0

Michael Stewart · February 3rd, 2006, 10:30 PM

Just try it with a clean ppro and aspect and see what you get.

Mike

Alan Mills · February 4th, 2006, 06:58 AM

If I might just add my experience on this.

I have Premiere Pro 1.5.1 and 3.4 (just upgraded to v4 but not really used it yet) installed along side my Matrox RT.X100 and I picked up this idea from another forum.

When you want to edit in Matrox Mode then copy the Cineform directory from your plugins directory out of the way and vice-versa when you are editing in Cineform mode. The idea being that on starting Premiere Pro you will have only one of the sets of driver loaded and so no possible conflicts. Make sure you have backups though.

I have created a couple of two line .bat files to do the neceesaary copying/moving of directories for me.

Doing this has certainly caused me to stop getting those annoying "unknown errors" from premiere Pro when editing/redering/exporting HDV footage.

Not sure if Cineform Support have an official position on this practice but it is working for me and does for others too.

Just don't do what I did and try to upgrade from AspectHD 3.3 to 3.4 when your system is in "Matrox Mode". No wonder it failed. D'oh!

Robert Young · February 5th, 2006, 02:48 PM

Alan
I think you are giving me an excellent clue. I want to make sure that I understand exactly what you are recommending.

Here is my set up currently:
Matrox RT100 card is installed
Matrox XTools software is installed and plugged into PPro 1.51 only
New install of PPro 2.0
Cineform Aspect 4.0 installed and plugged into PPro 2.0 only

I am trying to edit HDV CFHD on PPro 2.0/Aspect 4.0 setup and constantly get the unknown compiler error when export/rendering the timeline.

What exactly would you recommend that I do to correct this configuration and solve the rendering problem? The PPro 1.5 Plug in folder does have Matrox items, but the PPro 2.0 Plug in folder has no Matrox items that I can identify.
As a last resort I will just uninstall PPro 1.51/Matrox completely, as Mike has suggested, but I would rather not, since I still have some Matrox projects online.
Bob

Alan Mills · February 5th, 2006, 04:08 PM

Tricky, and in truth I don't know the answer. I'm still waiting for a copy of Adobe production Studio here in the UK so I've only dealt with the problem of Matrox vs Cineform for Premiere Pro 1.5.1. I have no experience of how/if Premiere Pro 2 causes any conflicts as well.

I can't imagine why having Xtool installed fro V1.5 would affect Ppro2 because the drivers should not be being loaded when you start PPro2.

Of course, no matter which mode I'm in here, there is always some Matrox code sitting in the background and resident in my task bar i.e. WYSIWYG DirectShow Control Panel. Could this cause problems? I don't know.

I can't see how a plugin for v1.5 can conflict with a plugin for v2 though, so I'm not personally convinced this is your problem.

Marc Colemont · February 5th, 2006, 05:36 PM

I would wait to install the 2.0 until Matrox is releasing the new driver for it.
The Maxtrox card/software is indeed very picky. Any change in the system can screw up the whole system.
I would advice to make an image ghost after you have the 1.5 working OK with the Matrox software. Test out througly before deciding that it works.
Only then tryout other stuff. In case it doesn't work it's easy to roll back then.

Robert Young · February 6th, 2006, 01:04 AM

I uninstalled Matrox XTools software: no help
I then physically removed the RTX100 Card and plugged my capture firewire into a PCI firewire card rather than the Matrox card or the Audigy 2 firewire port.
After recapturing some HDV footage the Cineform complier works fine. No more failed renders and exports. At least on this 5 min series of clips.
Perhaps when Matrox releases the XTools upgrade for PPro 2.0, I'll try to reinstall the RTX100.
My main interest is improving the image quality on my DVDs. When I downconvert CFHD using Aspect Export, the final DVD images are softer, and have some faint interlace artifact compared to the Sony 16x9 in-camera downconvert. I am transcoding to m2v using the Adobe products. I've heard that Procoder 2 gives better results.
Thanks to all for your help.
I've used desktop NLEs long enough that I should know not to expect software to work just because I bought it and installed it. The triumph of hope over experience, I guess.
Bob

Michael Stewart · February 6th, 2006, 08:03 AM

Congratualtions Robert! search the threads here for making dvd's they will look better than downconverting in camera, try some of the suggestions.

Mike

Thad Huston · February 8th, 2006, 02:00 PM

Hey all,

Sorry I didnt chime in on this one earlier. I was working on Robert's ticket and frankly had no idea what was wrong.

I saw that he had a Matrox board, but never suggested that he remove it assuming that there was no way that 1.5.1 Matrox plugins could interfere in 2.0.
Clearly that assumption was wrong.

I still dont understand exactly how this could be possible, but Im just glad it is resolved.

Thad H.
CineForm

Robert Young · February 8th, 2006, 11:17 PM

Thad
There is one other detail that may or may not be relevant. When I still had the Matrox/PPro 1.51 onboard, I was capturing firewire thru the FW port on the Audigy 2Z soundcard. When I uninstalled the Matrox stuff, I also switched the firewire over to a PCI firewire card port. I thought I had recalled a post about problems associated with Audigy FW for HDV/Aspect, but am not sure. Have problems been reported with this issue?? I would hate to blame the Matrox RTX, if something else was at fault.
Bob

Luis Otero · February 11th, 2006, 01:25 AM

Robert,

I experienced EXACTLY the same problems you had, and after MANY try-and-error testing the result was: MATROX software and card. If you remove the software, or move it as suggested in some posting here, and the card is not removed, forget about it... Having either the card or the software, or both for that matter, created to me a lot of problems when trying to use the system with HDV or Matrox DV.

Just my 2 cents...

Luis

Robert Young · February 12th, 2006, 03:20 AM

Luis
Thanks for the confirmation. Although I am sorry my Matrox system is history.
Bob

February 6th, 2006, 01:04 AM	#23
Robert Young Trustee Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Coronado Island Posts: 1,472	Victory!! I uninstalled Matrox XTools software: no help I then physically removed the RTX100 Card and plugged my capture firewire into a PCI firewire card rather than the Matrox card or the Audigy 2 firewire port. After recapturing some HDV footage the Cineform complier works fine. No more failed renders and exports. At least on this 5 min series of clips. Perhaps when Matrox releases the XTools upgrade for PPro 2.0, I'll try to reinstall the RTX100. My main interest is improving the image quality on my DVDs. When I downconvert CFHD using Aspect Export, the final DVD images are softer, and have some faint interlace artifact compared to the Sony 16x9 in-camera downconvert. I am transcoding to m2v using the Adobe products. I've heard that Procoder 2 gives better results. Thanks to all for your help. I've used desktop NLEs long enough that I should know not to expect software to work just because I bought it and installed it. The triumph of hope over experience, I guess. Bob

February 8th, 2006, 02:00 PM	#25
Thad Huston AJA Video Systems Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Grass Valley, CA Posts: 36	Glad this got resolved Hey all, Sorry I didnt chime in on this one earlier. I was working on Robert's ticket and frankly had no idea what was wrong. I saw that he had a Matrox board, but never suggested that he remove it assuming that there was no way that 1.5.1 Matrox plugins could interfere in 2.0. Clearly that assumption was wrong. I still dont understand exactly how this could be possible, but Im just glad it is resolved. Thad H. CineForm __________________ TH www.aja.com

February 3rd, 2006, 08:40 PM	#16
Michael Stewart Major Player Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Spokane, Wa. Posts: 445	Hi Robert I would bet money it is the matrox, not only the card, many times (pinnacle was notorious for it, once it loads its proprietary codec you lose the windows codec so even without the card in or enabled, it still uses the codec of the 3rd party (at least with pinnacle it did, not sure of Matrox. Mike

February 3rd, 2006, 10:15 PM	#17
Robert Young Trustee Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Coronado Island Posts: 1,472	Mike Hmmm... Well I may have to uninstall all of the Matrox stuff. However, I do keep up with the Matrox RTX100 forum. I am reading many posts by Matrox/PPro1.51/AspectHD users who are not reporting any HDV problems with that configuration, so I was hopeful. I'm still waiting to hear from Cineform support. They have not yet ventured an opinion. PPro 1.51 has a mini version of AspectHD included. It's hard to imagine that's a conflict with PP2.0/Aspect4.0 since Cineform is currently recommending that you leave PP1.51 installed when upgrading to PP2.0/Aspect4.0

February 3rd, 2006, 10:30 PM	#18
Michael Stewart Major Player Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Spokane, Wa. Posts: 445	Just try it with a clean ppro and aspect and see what you get. Mike

February 4th, 2006, 06:58 AM	#19
Alan Mills Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 67	If I might just add my experience on this. I have Premiere Pro 1.5.1 and 3.4 (just upgraded to v4 but not really used it yet) installed along side my Matrox RT.X100 and I picked up this idea from another forum. When you want to edit in Matrox Mode then copy the Cineform directory from your plugins directory out of the way and vice-versa when you are editing in Cineform mode. The idea being that on starting Premiere Pro you will have only one of the sets of driver loaded and so no possible conflicts. Make sure you have backups though. I have created a couple of two line .bat files to do the neceesaary copying/moving of directories for me. Doing this has certainly caused me to stop getting those annoying "unknown errors" from premiere Pro when editing/redering/exporting HDV footage. Not sure if Cineform Support have an official position on this practice but it is working for me and does for others too. Just don't do what I did and try to upgrade from AspectHD 3.3 to 3.4 when your system is in "Matrox Mode". No wonder it failed. D'oh!

February 5th, 2006, 02:48 PM	#20
Robert Young Trustee Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Coronado Island Posts: 1,472	Alan I think you are giving me an excellent clue. I want to make sure that I understand exactly what you are recommending. Here is my set up currently: Matrox RT100 card is installed Matrox XTools software is installed and plugged into PPro 1.51 only New install of PPro 2.0 Cineform Aspect 4.0 installed and plugged into PPro 2.0 only I am trying to edit HDV CFHD on PPro 2.0/Aspect 4.0 setup and constantly get the unknown compiler error when export/rendering the timeline. What exactly would you recommend that I do to correct this configuration and solve the rendering problem? The PPro 1.5 Plug in folder does have Matrox items, but the PPro 2.0 Plug in folder has no Matrox items that I can identify. As a last resort I will just uninstall PPro 1.51/Matrox completely, as Mike has suggested, but I would rather not, since I still have some Matrox projects online. Bob

February 5th, 2006, 04:08 PM	#21
Alan Mills Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 67	Tricky, and in truth I don't know the answer. I'm still waiting for a copy of Adobe production Studio here in the UK so I've only dealt with the problem of Matrox vs Cineform for Premiere Pro 1.5.1. I have no experience of how/if Premiere Pro 2 causes any conflicts as well. I can't imagine why having Xtool installed fro V1.5 would affect Ppro2 because the drivers should not be being loaded when you start PPro2. Of course, no matter which mode I'm in here, there is always some Matrox code sitting in the background and resident in my task bar i.e. WYSIWYG DirectShow Control Panel. Could this cause problems? I don't know. I can't see how a plugin for v1.5 can conflict with a plugin for v2 though, so I'm not personally convinced this is your problem.

February 5th, 2006, 05:36 PM	#22
Marc Colemont Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 695	I would wait to install the 2.0 until Matrox is releasing the new driver for it. The Maxtrox card/software is indeed very picky. Any change in the system can screw up the whole system. I would advice to make an image ghost after you have the 1.5 working OK with the Matrox software. Test out througly before deciding that it works. Only then tryout other stuff. In case it doesn't work it's easy to roll back then.

February 6th, 2006, 08:03 AM	#24
Michael Stewart Major Player Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Spokane, Wa. Posts: 445	Congratualtions Robert! search the threads here for making dvd's they will look better than downconverting in camera, try some of the suggestions. Mike

February 8th, 2006, 11:17 PM	#26
Robert Young Trustee Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Coronado Island Posts: 1,472	Thad There is one other detail that may or may not be relevant. When I still had the Matrox/PPro 1.51 onboard, I was capturing firewire thru the FW port on the Audigy 2Z soundcard. When I uninstalled the Matrox stuff, I also switched the firewire over to a PCI firewire card port. I thought I had recalled a post about problems associated with Audigy FW for HDV/Aspect, but am not sure. Have problems been reported with this issue?? I would hate to blame the Matrox RTX, if something else was at fault. Bob

February 11th, 2006, 01:25 AM	#27
Luis Otero Major Player Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Fort Dodge, IA Posts: 221	Robert, I experienced EXACTLY the same problems you had, and after MANY try-and-error testing the result was: MATROX software and card. If you remove the software, or move it as suggested in some posting here, and the card is not removed, forget about it... Having either the card or the software, or both for that matter, created to me a lot of problems when trying to use the system with HDV or Matrox DV. Just my 2 cents... Luis

February 12th, 2006, 03:20 AM	#28
Robert Young Trustee Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Coronado Island Posts: 1,472	Luis Thanks for the confirmation. Although I am sorry my Matrox system is history. Bob