info about demo at DVinfo.net

Carlo Macchiavello · January 31st, 2011, 04:38 PM

i suggest to my customer to try Cineform, like DI for its work
he have blackmagic deck link, and he connect to it an HDcam deck (sony hdwn 2000p)

he see all work fine from black magic interface, he control by remote, he can capture, and all work fine with remote, and timecode of captured file (blackmagic codec) is the same of tape.

he try to capture by hdlink, enable in prefs panel the aja/blackmagic panel, but remote not work (interface with play, rew, forw and stop stay not enable) and when he try to capture in cineform, timecode is not recorded... cineform build a new timecode from zero.

seems like hdlink ignore remote.
is there a limit of demo version of neo3D?

and more...
he try also to convert two file from alexa arriflex, and timecodes of cineform movs are different from original mov's timecode.
any idea?

David Newman · January 31st, 2011, 05:10 PM

HDLink doesn't don't handle timecode for all sources -- not the market for which is was designed. Blackmagic has a CineForm license so there tool could (or should) offer CineForm capture. AJA does, so should BMD.

Carlo Macchiavello · February 1st, 2011, 10:34 AM

and what about hdlink control panel? remote is enable only for hdv camera?
is not enable for professional tools like hd cam deck?

timecode is very important for many people that work in mixed environment. under quicktime timecode is a text track that you can edit. Is a problem with avi wrapper?

think about a medium production, where there is a mixed workflow, be cause director want to edit in 2D its prores files from alexa directly, and in the same time stereographer convert raw file of alexa to cineform, mux, and prepare for editing.

if timecode is the same (with alexa cable, both eyes have exactly the same timecode), in avid or in every other editor, you relink media, editing software find timecode, and editing 2D did from director with editor is magically 3D and all people can continue to cineform 3D workflow.

if director must attend the work of conversion in cineform, muxing, often not want to work in 3D with cineform, but prefer to use some other tools to edit 3D like vegas, avid or finalcut with some plugins that create virtual 3D tracks...

i know that neo3D workflow is the best, but not everytimes in a production you can apply it.

Serious questions

A timecode copy from original shooting to cineform during conversion in cineform is in your schedule?
Aja tool when capture in cineform capture also timecode info?

my customer before to buy xxxx $ of neo3D, what to know if is right tool for him.

David Newman · February 1st, 2011, 12:08 PM

HDLink is a consumer/prosumer tool, not designed for HDSDI workflow (see those controls are HDV only.) You are just using the wrong tool. For deck control and HDSDI ingest you need to look at AJA's tools which now come with MediaNXS which supports CineForm HD and 3D acquisition (with only a NeoHD license -- MediaNXS - Digital Intermediate I/O.) BMD should offer something similar.

Neo3D is for 3D editing, not 3D ingest, for that like to AJA and BMD, both are CineForm 3D licensees.

Carlo Macchiavello · February 1st, 2011, 01:00 PM

ehm i agree that hdlink is a prosumer tool, but in mov file, timecode is a simple text track...
i did a simple copy and paste from original prores mov to cineform mov, and i have original time code.

I think many people would like to see that hdlink add this small addition to their workflow, instead to do tons of "extract-select all-copy-goto to Cineform mov-add to movie" steps to have original timecode.

and ... ehm...
add timecode copying is a way to grab many people that stay in "prores valley" because they capture and ingest video file with final cut, and not use cineform be cause they miss timecode. it's a friendly suggest to increase sales ;-)

Ben Hickson · February 4th, 2011, 08:42 PM

+1 for TC

I don't use timecode I just own a T2i but I agree that would get people out of ProRes Valley.

That, and making FirstLight defeat Apple Color. Bigger task of course, but since apple won't let outside codecs in to Color, lots of people still won't use CineForm for that holdout alone. At least here in Nashville.

January 31st, 2011, 04:38 PM	#1
Carlo Macchiavello Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: italy Posts: 107	info about demo i suggest to my customer to try Cineform, like DI for its work he have blackmagic deck link, and he connect to it an HDcam deck (sony hdwn 2000p) he see all work fine from black magic interface, he control by remote, he can capture, and all work fine with remote, and timecode of captured file (blackmagic codec) is the same of tape. he try to capture by hdlink, enable in prefs panel the aja/blackmagic panel, but remote not work (interface with play, rew, forw and stop stay not enable) and when he try to capture in cineform, timecode is not recorded... cineform build a new timecode from zero. seems like hdlink ignore remote. is there a limit of demo version of neo3D? and more... he try also to convert two file from alexa arriflex, and timecodes of cineform movs are different from original mov's timecode. any idea?

January 31st, 2011, 05:10 PM	#2
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	HDLink doesn't don't handle timecode for all sources -- not the market for which is was designed. Blackmagic has a CineForm license so there tool could (or should) offer CineForm capture. AJA does, so should BMD. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

February 1st, 2011, 12:08 PM	#4
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	HDLink is a consumer/prosumer tool, not designed for HDSDI workflow (see those controls are HDV only.) You are just using the wrong tool. For deck control and HDSDI ingest you need to look at AJA's tools which now come with MediaNXS which supports CineForm HD and 3D acquisition (with only a NeoHD license -- MediaNXS - Digital Intermediate I/O.) BMD should offer something similar. Neo3D is for 3D editing, not 3D ingest, for that like to AJA and BMD, both are CineForm 3D licensees. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

February 1st, 2011, 10:34 AM	#3
Carlo Macchiavello Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: italy Posts: 107	and what about hdlink control panel? remote is enable only for hdv camera? is not enable for professional tools like hd cam deck? timecode is very important for many people that work in mixed environment. under quicktime timecode is a text track that you can edit. Is a problem with avi wrapper? think about a medium production, where there is a mixed workflow, be cause director want to edit in 2D its prores files from alexa directly, and in the same time stereographer convert raw file of alexa to cineform, mux, and prepare for editing. if timecode is the same (with alexa cable, both eyes have exactly the same timecode), in avid or in every other editor, you relink media, editing software find timecode, and editing 2D did from director with editor is magically 3D and all people can continue to cineform 3D workflow. if director must attend the work of conversion in cineform, muxing, often not want to work in 3D with cineform, but prefer to use some other tools to edit 3D like vegas, avid or finalcut with some plugins that create virtual 3D tracks... i know that neo3D workflow is the best, but not everytimes in a production you can apply it. Serious questions A timecode copy from original shooting to cineform during conversion in cineform is in your schedule? Aja tool when capture in cineform capture also timecode info? my customer before to buy xxxx $ of neo3D, what to know if is right tool for him.

February 1st, 2011, 01:00 PM	#5
Carlo Macchiavello Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: italy Posts: 107	ehm i agree that hdlink is a prosumer tool, but in mov file, timecode is a simple text track... i did a simple copy and paste from original prores mov to cineform mov, and i have original time code. I think many people would like to see that hdlink add this small addition to their workflow, instead to do tons of "extract-select all-copy-goto to Cineform mov-add to movie" steps to have original timecode. and ... ehm... add timecode copying is a way to grab many people that stay in "prores valley" because they capture and ingest video file with final cut, and not use cineform be cause they miss timecode. it's a friendly suggest to increase sales ;-)

February 4th, 2011, 08:42 PM	#6
Ben Hickson Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: New York, NY Posts: 55	+1 for TC I don't use timecode I just own a T2i but I agree that would get people out of ProRes Valley. That, and making FirstLight defeat Apple Color. Bigger task of course, but since apple won't let outside codecs in to Color, lots of people still won't use CineForm for that holdout alone. At least here in Nashville.