Update - CineForm Adobe CS4/CS5 Support

Stephen Armour · February 9th, 2010, 04:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Baggen

And if real time were the only need met by Cineform, many of us would move on as well.

Hey Marty, I used to be from GP, many years ago. I still miss that sweet, Oregon air. My younger brother went to OSU for a while, and I went to SOU (was SOC) for a while too.

Breathe some air for me...

Marty Baggen · February 9th, 2010, 09:20 AM

All the great "Flame-Throwers" come from the Pac NW.

Breathing some air for you right now my friend. It's much better than holding our collective breath for CS5 isn't it?

Stephen Armour · February 9th, 2010, 11:38 AM

Ha! It'll be well into the CS5 cycle before we buy into that new pain!

Some of that pure sea/evergreen/mountain air from you must have reached my brain...the bleeding edge is getting less attractive all the time...

Tim Kolb · February 9th, 2010, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen Armour

Having said all that, it works for the normal user, in non-production, non-complex workflow environments. Most probably it's due to their marketing decisions (so Adobe doesn't invade higher end solutions markets), but they should re-think that now that they seem to be wanting to take CS5 to "higher ground".

If Adobe does have that as their goal, they need to replace Encore with something better, bundle an updated version of Audition with CS5 (instead of their castrated Soundbooth), and make AME more powerful than TMPGEnc.

Then they might be entering "Production Premium" territory...

I think everyone's needs are different and whether or not a specific workflow constitutes 'high end' is subjective of course.

Encore is certainly not complex...I've not had any issues with it, but I don't do sophisticated DVD authoring, so I yield to your points made.

As far as PPro is concerned...it's not like I use something else to win awards and use PPro to do home video. I've done some fairly sophisticated work on PPro.

However, I understand the frustration level. Input is given to Adobe constantly about addressing many of the features you mention. I'm an Audition fan myself...

Anyone who knows me knows that there are features I've been requesting for multiple revs that aren't showing up. The issue for me is that I haven't found anything that i like better as of yet...

Ray Parkes · February 13th, 2010, 08:13 PM

Audition is a PC only package and is likely to disappear... sad as that is but it doesn't run particularly well on Vista or 7 anyway. I recently discovered Digital Performer which is an absolute must for 5.1.or above. It even manages to run full screen HD in RT on a separate monitor if you have a reasonable beast of a Mac. One problem solved. I can at least view my work properly again.

BUT Adobe is loosing hands down. Even the much vaunted Flash has plenty of bugs - try streaming audio and see what it does to memory allocation especially using AS3.
Nothing Adobe does ever gets better as they increase the release numbers. It just gets more clogged. I move from PC to Linux or Mac depending on the project but my money is definitely headed Macwards for the moment…

Stephen Armour · February 14th, 2010, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ray Parkes

Audition is a PC only package and is likely to disappear... sad as that is but it doesn't run particularly well on Vista or 7 anyway. I recently discovered Digital Performer which is an absolute must for 5.1.or above. It even manages to run full screen HD in RT on a separate monitor if you have a reasonable beast of a Mac. One problem solved. I can at least view my work properly again.

BUT Adobe is loosing hands down. Even the much vaunted Flash has plenty of bugs - try streaming audio and see what it does to memory allocation especially using AS3.
Nothing Adobe does ever gets better as they increase the release numbers. It just gets more clogged. I move from PC to Linux or Mac depending on the project but my money is definitely headed Macwards for the moment…

When no clear upgrade path showed up for Audition, that tolled it's death knell. For now, we're still using it in Win7, though as you stated, there are some issues.

Syntrillium made a good program...but good for 32 bit based 2003ware, not for "quickly-moving-to-64bit-2010ware. Since Adobe "buys-and-fries" many programs, I guess we can say goodbye to it pretty soon.

As to disappearing because of being PC based, the same thing could be said of Digital Performer...since it's MAC only. If they keep to that track, it could also go to the "Great Software Graveyard"... since we don't live in a OS specific workflow environment anymore. No matter how good a particular program is, it's very risky keeping things locked into single platforms.

Before jumping to anything else though, we'll be watching and waiting to see what CS5 has to offer. I certainly hope Soundbooth isn't their continuing solution. It doesn't cut it for more demanding productions, or finer control.

Come on Adobe, bring in something worthy of being called "Production Premium software"! Bundle something more professional!

Ray Parkes · February 15th, 2010, 02:31 PM

Very true but Mac OS is basicly now a UNIX system which won't be going away anytime soon.

Leo Baker · February 15th, 2010, 03:18 PM

Hello,

We just bought Adobe Audition 3.0 for PC I think it's optimisex for 64bit I'll need to check.

Leo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen Armour

When no clear upgrade path showed up for Audition, that tolled it's death knell. For now, we're still using it in Win7, though as you stated, there are some issues.

Syntrillium made a good program...but good for 32 bit based 2003ware, not for "quickly-moving-to-64bit-2010ware. Since Adobe "buys-and-fries" many programs, I guess we can say goodbye to it pretty soon.

As to disappearing because of being PC based, the same thing could be said of Digital Performer...since it's MAC only. If they keep to that track, it could also go to the "Great Software Graveyard"... since we don't live in a OS specific workflow environment anymore. No matter how good a particular program is, it's very risky keeping things locked into single platforms.

Before jumping to anything else though, we'll be watching and waiting to see what CS5 has to offer. I certainly hope Soundbooth isn't their continuing solution. It doesn't cut it for more demanding productions, or finer control.

Come on Adobe, bring in something worthy of being called "Production Premium software"! Bundle something more professional!

Stephen Armour · February 15th, 2010, 06:13 PM

Don't think so, sorry.

While I like it a lot, I'm very disappointed Adobe didn't update it, nor do they appear to have any plans to do so. Too bad, as it's a fine program. A 64bit version would have been a nice addition to CS5.

Maybe if enough people complain loudly enough, they'll relent from their lousy marketing decision and still give us an updated version?

Tim Kolb · February 15th, 2010, 06:30 PM

Well...hmmm...all I can say is that you may not want to count Audition out in the long run just yet...

Stephen Armour · February 16th, 2010, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Kolb

Well...hmmm...all I can say is that you may not want to count Audition out in the long run just yet...

I sincerely hope not. It's been good for us for a long time...long before Adobe ever bought it.

David H. Wilson · February 16th, 2010, 03:04 PM

Very happy to hear that there are so many Audition supporters. We, like Stephen, go back to the pre-Adobe Cool Edit days and love the program. There is an Audition window constantly open on my computer.

Robert Young · February 18th, 2010, 12:13 PM

I agree.
I've tried to fiddle with Soundbooth several times, but why wade through a non intuitive learning curve when Audition does absolutely everything I need, whether audio for video, or multitrack music editing.

Raymond Krystof · April 25th, 2010, 09:45 PM

I realize this is an older thread but the subject is still valid. Especially with the time lapse.

Can anyone (probably with the first name of David) offer more current updates as what a CS5 user running on Mac can expect from Cineform V5?

I first used Aspect HD with Ppro 6.0/6.5 back in 2003/2004. As a matter of fact, I purchased Aspect HD from David Newman on the spot after he demoed the product at a HDV (JVC HD10) class in North Hollywood. At that time it was the only way to edit HDV barring the software supplied with the camera, and I won't go there. Well my memories of that experience are great. However, when my PC had a melt down I decided to switch to a Mac Pro machine. Also since I already had a license for Premiere Pro a cross platform upgrade seemed to be the way to go. I also just plain like working with Premiere and Encore. Hence, CS4 on a Mac. Well I need not rehash all that's already been said. I'm looking back at the DVD's I made using Ppro 6.5 and Aspect in that time period and am convinced that they have less noise, less artifacts and better color than anything I've done on CS4 without Cinefore. The loss of scene detection alone seemed like a big step backwards.

Well I'll cut to the chase. I'm going to upgrade to CS5. If for no other reason, to get scene detection on HDV capture back. I have a "boat" load of old HDV material left to archive and publish and scene detection is a great plus for me. Also my next camera is likely to be AVCHD based. I'm going to upgrade to NeoHD V5. If for no other reason, to get back the color and clarity that I felt was a factor of the Aspect code. Plus from all I've read, First Light sounds like a great addition. However I'm wonder how well NeoHD V5 will be integrated into CS5 on Mac? The Cineform home page does state that V5 for Mac will be offered a "couple of months" after V5 for PC's. The Cineform site seems to say I can "upgrade" to NeoHD V4 from Aspect HD even if I'm updating to a Mac platform. I'm not likely to even use V4 but I'm not sure I'll be able to "upgrade" to NeoHD V5 from Aspect HD when the Mac version of V5 is available?

Any input on all this would be greatly appreciated. I believe in your products and would like to get back to the work flow I had so many years ago.

Best to all

David Taylor · April 25th, 2010, 11:07 PM

Hi Raymond, I'm sure we'll have an upgrade path from AHD to NeoHD without a new full-price purchase, but we just haven't published it yet. We expect excellent integration on Mac for CS5. Previously our CSx support on Mac was not very good because our Windows CSx implementation was not portable to Mac. This time, when we did the CS5 work on Windows we wrote it in a manner that was cross-platform compatible. So...expect all the good things you enjoyed about CineForm in the past to be available for CS5 on Mac within about two months after the Windows release.

In case you haven't seen it, following is a tech blog post that discusses the features for CS5, all of which should be available on Mac in the not-too-distant future: Cineform Tech Blog Blog Archive Announcing Neo Family Version 5.

February 9th, 2010, 11:38 AM	#93
Stephen Armour Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Natal, RN, Brasil Posts: 900	Ha! It'll be well into the CS5 cycle before we buy into that new pain! Some of that pure sea/evergreen/mountain air from you must have reached my brain...the bleeding edge is getting less attractive all the time... __________________ http://lightinaction.org "All in the view of the LION"

February 15th, 2010, 06:13 PM	#99
Stephen Armour Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Natal, RN, Brasil Posts: 900	Don't think so, sorry. While I like it a lot, I'm very disappointed Adobe didn't update it, nor do they appear to have any plans to do so. Too bad, as it's a fine program. A 64bit version would have been a nice addition to CS5. Maybe if enough people complain loudly enough, they'll relent from their lousy marketing decision and still give us an updated version? __________________ http://lightinaction.org "All in the view of the LION"

February 15th, 2010, 06:30 PM	#100
Tim Kolb Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Neenah, WI Posts: 547	Well...hmmm...all I can say is that you may not want to count Audition out in the long run just yet... __________________ TimK Kolb Productions

February 18th, 2010, 12:13 PM	#103
Robert Young Trustee Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Coronado Island Posts: 1,472	I agree. I've tried to fiddle with Soundbooth several times, but why wade through a non intuitive learning curve when Audition does absolutely everything I need, whether audio for video, or multitrack music editing. __________________ Bob

April 25th, 2010, 09:45 PM	#104
Raymond Krystof Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Santa Clarita, California Posts: 97	I realize this is an older thread but the subject is still valid. Especially with the time lapse. Can anyone (probably with the first name of David) offer more current updates as what a CS5 user running on Mac can expect from Cineform V5? I first used Aspect HD with Ppro 6.0/6.5 back in 2003/2004. As a matter of fact, I purchased Aspect HD from David Newman on the spot after he demoed the product at a HDV (JVC HD10) class in North Hollywood. At that time it was the only way to edit HDV barring the software supplied with the camera, and I won't go there. Well my memories of that experience are great. However, when my PC had a melt down I decided to switch to a Mac Pro machine. Also since I already had a license for Premiere Pro a cross platform upgrade seemed to be the way to go. I also just plain like working with Premiere and Encore. Hence, CS4 on a Mac. Well I need not rehash all that's already been said. I'm looking back at the DVD's I made using Ppro 6.5 and Aspect in that time period and am convinced that they have less noise, less artifacts and better color than anything I've done on CS4 without Cinefore. The loss of scene detection alone seemed like a big step backwards. Well I'll cut to the chase. I'm going to upgrade to CS5. If for no other reason, to get scene detection on HDV capture back. I have a "boat" load of old HDV material left to archive and publish and scene detection is a great plus for me. Also my next camera is likely to be AVCHD based. I'm going to upgrade to NeoHD V5. If for no other reason, to get back the color and clarity that I felt was a factor of the Aspect code. Plus from all I've read, First Light sounds like a great addition. However I'm wonder how well NeoHD V5 will be integrated into CS5 on Mac? The Cineform home page does state that V5 for Mac will be offered a "couple of months" after V5 for PC's. The Cineform site seems to say I can "upgrade" to NeoHD V4 from Aspect HD even if I'm updating to a Mac platform. I'm not likely to even use V4 but I'm not sure I'll be able to "upgrade" to NeoHD V5 from Aspect HD when the Mac version of V5 is available? Any input on all this would be greatly appreciated. I believe in your products and would like to get back to the work flow I had so many years ago. Best to all __________________ Ray

February 9th, 2010, 09:20 AM	#92
Marty Baggen Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: monroe, or Posts: 572	All the great "Flame-Throwers" come from the Pac NW. Breathing some air for you right now my friend. It's much better than holding our collective breath for CS5 isn't it?

February 13th, 2010, 08:13 PM	#95
Ray Parkes Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Golden Bay New Zealand Posts: 46	Audition is a PC only package and is likely to disappear... sad as that is but it doesn't run particularly well on Vista or 7 anyway. I recently discovered Digital Performer which is an absolute must for 5.1.or above. It even manages to run full screen HD in RT on a separate monitor if you have a reasonable beast of a Mac. One problem solved. I can at least view my work properly again. BUT Adobe is loosing hands down. Even the much vaunted Flash has plenty of bugs - try streaming audio and see what it does to memory allocation especially using AS3. Nothing Adobe does ever gets better as they increase the release numbers. It just gets more clogged. I move from PC to Linux or Mac depending on the project but my money is definitely headed Macwards for the moment…

February 15th, 2010, 02:31 PM	#97
Ray Parkes Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Golden Bay New Zealand Posts: 46	Very true but Mac OS is basicly now a UNIX system which won't be going away anytime soon.

February 16th, 2010, 03:04 PM	#102
David H. Wilson Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Culver City, CA Posts: 124	Very happy to hear that there are so many Audition supporters. We, like Stephen, go back to the pre-Adobe Cool Edit days and love the program. There is an Audition window constantly open on my computer.

April 25th, 2010, 11:07 PM	#105
David Taylor Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Solana Beach, CA Posts: 853	Hi Raymond, I'm sure we'll have an upgrade path from AHD to NeoHD without a new full-price purchase, but we just haven't published it yet. We expect excellent integration on Mac for CS5. Previously our CSx support on Mac was not very good because our Windows CSx implementation was not portable to Mac. This time, when we did the CS5 work on Windows we wrote it in a manner that was cross-platform compatible. So...expect all the good things you enjoyed about CineForm in the past to be available for CS5 on Mac within about two months after the Windows release. In case you haven't seen it, following is a tech blog post that discusses the features for CS5, all of which should be available on Mac in the not-too-distant future: Cineform Tech Blog Blog Archive Announcing Neo Family Version 5.