A Color Editing Monitor

[Andrew J Hall]

I still have not come to grips with the question of monitoring HD for the purposes of editing and color correction. I'm sorry to be re-asking this newbie question but I am stuck and I need to get unstuck. I have read quite a lot on the subject but I do not seem to be able to come to a clear conclusion.

It seems to me you need to decide first what you are monitoring for. In my case my primary (long term - looking to the future) use of footage will be for use with an HD projector (I don't yet have one). Also I am more in the line of creating video art than straight video - quality does need to be of a reasonably high standard, especially visual quality. Most probably my secondary use will end up being LCD TV and LCD PC output and my least common long term use will be CRT TV (since CRT will soon be history even if the color is better). Am I right in thinking this is relevant to the decision on editing monitor?

Next, it seems there is a difference in color rendering (color space?) between PC's and (HD) TV's independent of the issue of CRT vs LCD.

So what is the right monitor type / approach for my intended use described above. Is TV LCD panel out of a VIVO/TV Out connector from my video card the story, or is an ordinary PC LCD panel from my DVI connector OK, or is some special overlay setting for my video card for my main PC monitor (a good CRT)... or what? My issue is not do I need a second monitor (I don't), it is that I feel I cannot do any sensible editing until I have an accurate take on the output color (and dynamic range).

On the 'how much do you want to spend' isssue, well I am very hard up so not too much but not so little that I end up producing garbage out.Sorry if this comes over a bit fraught - I wasted so much time in years gone by with inadequate color management (for both video and also photography), that I do understand now that it is something that has to be got right.

Andrew

[David Newman]

There is no correct answer to this other than calibration. For color accuracy a broadcast SD CRT works well, even for HD color correction work (709 to 601 conversion is handled through Aspect HD to support the SD 601 ouptut.) LCD screen can work also, you just need to calibrate their output. CineForm is doing the digital intermediate on another feature film intended for 35mm distribution, on this project a 23" LCD panel with be calibrated to match the filmout look. I'm going to be learning how this can be done during the process. So you can calibrate most output devices for nearly any purpose.

[Andrew J Hall]

OK calibration.

With photography (and any generalised PC use) there is hardware (colorimeter) and software (eg Colorvision Spyder) that create an ICC profile for a PC monitor. ICC profiles can also be created for scanners, printers, digital cameras etc, so that consistent color can be achieved between devices. I have done all that on my PC and I now get consistent color between my monitor and my printer, and indeed between my monitor and other ICC calibrated monitors. In all cases these calibrations use the hardware to measure color and then the software to apply those measurements to return an international standard color (ICC profile).

However, with video and these 709, and 601 specs, these would appear to be a quite different system. Also, you have mentioned before differences in the way YUV scales luminence from the way RBG does.

So is there either a usable methodology whereby one arrives at a standardised color profile for video use or are video designed output devices standardised to these different specs, so one should choose the appropriate device and use that for monitoring.

For example is an LCD designed for TV/ video use calibrated differently, ie to a different standard, than an LCD designed for PC use?

To be clear, I am not looking for some mythical perfection, or even broadcast standard heaven, just a sensible consistent approach to choosing a system to monitor / edit video as presumably all other video producers must be doing.

Andrew

[David Newman]

Calibration can be done the same way. 601 and 709 are not anything weird other than curves that map YUV to RGB (or visa versa.) 601 vs 709 is handled by your display card and editing software then you no longer need to concerned with these issues. The displays are typically RGB anyway. If you are using DVI that is 8bit RGB. So it the end you are setting levels of color and brightness, and adjusting gamma curves, the original colorspace is not an issue. So you can use the same tools to calibrate a monitor at that when 50% grey is output 50% is preceived (although I know is it much more complex that that -- but you get to idea.) Pages like these might help http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...=Google+Search

[Andrew J Hall]

Thanks David, that google listing looks very helpful - should keep me quiet for a couple of hours :-)

You wrote "For color accuracy a broadcast SD CRT works well, even for HD color correction work (709 to 601 conversion is handled through Aspect HD to support the SD 601 ouptut.)"

Does this mean if I hook a SD tv up to my video card Premiere can be persuaded to send the monitor window playback to it? I've managed to get a second PC monitor to do that but so far have not cracked it with a TV (my video card has component out and video out and HDTV support).

And, as your statement above seems to imply, will that also work for editing an HD timeline but using a SD tv - sounds too good to be true but I will keep my fingers crossed.

Andrew

[Andrew J Hall]

I just did an encouraging test. I exported a small segment of edited HD back to my Z1p and played it on my SD TV. The color match was good and the luminence match was good. Interestingly, the match with the Z1p LCD was less good, in particular the highlights were overbright on the LCD - perhaps that reflects the way Sony designed the LCD to be visible outdoors (currently I am inside and it is pretty dark).

[Of course the other interpretation is that it is a fluke that my TV and PC are matching and both are wrong and the LCD is right lol.]

Andrew