Workflow HDV CS3 and Encore Export oNce at DVinfo.net

Phil Green · July 20th, 2009, 12:39 PM

Can you tell me

what is the best workflow for me

I am using Adobe Premiere CS3 and Sony FX7E Camera

Up to now I have been working in mostly DV Mode with the Camera and the Exporting to MPEG DVD and mastering with Encore for the Final DVD.

I need to switch to an effient workflow so that I can Film In HDV, edit in Premiere and export to DVD and Bluray with encore.

I have just purchased the cineform neoscene and have been experiementing

I have captured footage with the HDLink Program and then imported it into Premiere

I used the flowing settings

1.33 HD Anaformic
1440x1080i
upper field first

desktop mode

is that the correct settings to use?

after editing a basic sequence I exported to one of the BluRay presents again with upper field first, then as a test I muxed together the audio and video streams using ts muxer
and then burnt off on a blank dvd in bluray format which plays ok on my LG 370 player.
I did this to save blueray media.

What I am aiming for is to take use of the master once feature in Encore
however I know that the downsizing feature from HDV to Mpeg DVD is not good and results in wavey lines

Also I am confused about field order I know that HDV is upper, when I export to HD Mpeg then I stay upper that I know, but then when encoding to DVD Mpeg then the default is lower field, I have been changing it back to upper field, though I ready mixed views on this.

Also what about deinterlacing, should I be doing that or not?

As I say I would like to keep it similar to my current workflow.

Capture
Edit in Premiere
Export to Mpeg
Import to Encore, make menus, preview final then export
to both with minimum ease.

Sorry if this is abit long winded

Thanks for reading
Phil

David Newman · July 20th, 2009, 01:07 PM

To deinterlace or not depends on your source -- whether spatial resolution to temporal resolution in more important to you.

This is what I do and recommend.

1) Edit in HD (always -- never use DV)
2) Export to a CineForm AVI HD Master at the timeline resolution. (optionally deinterlace here.)
3) Load that in HDLink and scale to you target. If you set a interlaced frame format HDLink will convert HD upper field first to lower field first, and preserves you temporal resolution. In Progressive mode it favours spatial.
4) Load that new SD AVI in Premiere or Encore to make you DVD

Phil Green · July 20th, 2009, 07:55 PM

right I see so how would this work with neo scene?
I am using build 1.3.4

I don't think those options are in there being the basic HD Link

thanks

phil

David Newman · July 20th, 2009, 09:27 PM

Sorry I missed that detail (Neo Scene doesn't include batch scaling.)

Take the HD output back into Premiere and scale to SD AVI from there. I can only assume Adobe will get the field down scale correctly, as I don't use that method. If you deinterlace it will not matter if Adobe gets that step correct or not.

Phil Green · July 22nd, 2009, 02:15 PM

Hi

I am still somewhat confused though

If capture HDV as 1080i
edit in Premiere CS3
then export to Cineform AVI

Well in the cineform docs, is says to resize
to 720x576 then select upper field first.

Now when I fetch the file into Encore and choose SD DVD then the preset
seems to be default lower field first, should that be changed back to upper?
or has the cineform export done some under the hood tricks.

Then read this from a search of on the internet, as below:-

When converting from HD to SD, you'll have to de-interlace before scaling and to re-interlace after that (if you want a video look). Otherwise you'd get horrible artefacts, since 1080 is not evenly divided by 480 (neither by 576 in PAL). Normally, any good editing system is taking care of this automatically. I get pretty good pictures when throwing HDV into an SD sequence in Final Cut Pro.

So, the original field order doesn't matter at all. Just define the sequence for what you want and tell the MPEG compression software what you decided. The encoded stream will tell the decoder which field comes first.

-------------
Therefore is this what the cineform export is doing delinteracing, resizing to AVI

also whould it be possible to just exort cineform from the CS3 timeline direct to Abobe Media Encoder as DVD Setting or will that be no good, if so using the upper field setting again or would I need to leave it lowerfield default.

Please bear with me on this, lot I really need to get a clear understanding of it and the best workflow for my work capture edit and export, encore menu design, once if possible and the export.

I appolise if I appear unknowledgeable

thanks again

Phil

Phil Green · July 28th, 2009, 08:31 PM

hello again

just wondering if anyone can give me a quick answer to this question

in short if I export to cineform avi after editing
and choose upper field first, then I bring this avi into encore

what setting do I choose in the field order or do I just leave the field order as lower field first, I guess what I am saying is that when I export to avi cineform and resize from 1440x1080i to 720x576 does cineform deinterlace the footage upon export or is the field order retained?

July 20th, 2009, 12:39 PM	#1
Phil Green New Boot Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 12	Workflow HDV CS3 and Encore Export oNce Can you tell me what is the best workflow for me I am using Adobe Premiere CS3 and Sony FX7E Camera Up to now I have been working in mostly DV Mode with the Camera and the Exporting to MPEG DVD and mastering with Encore for the Final DVD. I need to switch to an effient workflow so that I can Film In HDV, edit in Premiere and export to DVD and Bluray with encore. I have just purchased the cineform neoscene and have been experiementing I have captured footage with the HDLink Program and then imported it into Premiere I used the flowing settings 1.33 HD Anaformic 1440x1080i upper field first desktop mode is that the correct settings to use? after editing a basic sequence I exported to one of the BluRay presents again with upper field first, then as a test I muxed together the audio and video streams using ts muxer and then burnt off on a blank dvd in bluray format which plays ok on my LG 370 player. I did this to save blueray media. What I am aiming for is to take use of the master once feature in Encore however I know that the downsizing feature from HDV to Mpeg DVD is not good and results in wavey lines Also I am confused about field order I know that HDV is upper, when I export to HD Mpeg then I stay upper that I know, but then when encoding to DVD Mpeg then the default is lower field, I have been changing it back to upper field, though I ready mixed views on this. Also what about deinterlacing, should I be doing that or not? As I say I would like to keep it similar to my current workflow. Capture Edit in Premiere Export to Mpeg Import to Encore, make menus, preview final then export to both with minimum ease. Sorry if this is abit long winded Thanks for reading Phil

July 20th, 2009, 01:07 PM	#2
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	To deinterlace or not depends on your source -- whether spatial resolution to temporal resolution in more important to you. This is what I do and recommend. 1) Edit in HD (always -- never use DV) 2) Export to a CineForm AVI HD Master at the timeline resolution. (optionally deinterlace here.) 3) Load that in HDLink and scale to you target. If you set a interlaced frame format HDLink will convert HD upper field first to lower field first, and preserves you temporal resolution. In Progressive mode it favours spatial. 4) Load that new SD AVI in Premiere or Encore to make you DVD __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

July 20th, 2009, 09:27 PM	#4
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Sorry I missed that detail (Neo Scene doesn't include batch scaling.) Take the HD output back into Premiere and scale to SD AVI from there. I can only assume Adobe will get the field down scale correctly, as I don't use that method. If you deinterlace it will not matter if Adobe gets that step correct or not. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

July 20th, 2009, 07:55 PM	#3
Phil Green New Boot Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 12	right I see so how would this work with neo scene? I am using build 1.3.4 I don't think those options are in there being the basic HD Link thanks phil

July 22nd, 2009, 02:15 PM	#5
Phil Green New Boot Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 12	Hi I am still somewhat confused though If capture HDV as 1080i edit in Premiere CS3 then export to Cineform AVI Well in the cineform docs, is says to resize to 720x576 then select upper field first. Now when I fetch the file into Encore and choose SD DVD then the preset seems to be default lower field first, should that be changed back to upper? or has the cineform export done some under the hood tricks. Then read this from a search of on the internet, as below:- When converting from HD to SD, you'll have to de-interlace before scaling and to re-interlace after that (if you want a video look). Otherwise you'd get horrible artefacts, since 1080 is not evenly divided by 480 (neither by 576 in PAL). Normally, any good editing system is taking care of this automatically. I get pretty good pictures when throwing HDV into an SD sequence in Final Cut Pro. So, the original field order doesn't matter at all. Just define the sequence for what you want and tell the MPEG compression software what you decided. The encoded stream will tell the decoder which field comes first. ------------- Therefore is this what the cineform export is doing delinteracing, resizing to AVI also whould it be possible to just exort cineform from the CS3 timeline direct to Abobe Media Encoder as DVD Setting or will that be no good, if so using the upper field setting again or would I need to leave it lowerfield default. Please bear with me on this, lot I really need to get a clear understanding of it and the best workflow for my work capture edit and export, encore menu design, once if possible and the export. I appolise if I appear unknowledgeable thanks again Phil

July 28th, 2009, 08:31 PM	#6
Phil Green New Boot Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 12	hello again just wondering if anyone can give me a quick answer to this question in short if I export to cineform avi after editing and choose upper field first, then I bring this avi into encore what setting do I choose in the field order or do I just leave the field order as lower field first, I guess what I am saying is that when I export to avi cineform and resize from 1440x1080i to 720x576 does cineform deinterlace the footage upon export or is the field order retained?