One last 4.0 beta.

Glenn Babcock · May 10th, 2009, 06:17 AM

Cameron,

Maybe it's an OS thing, but I actually get two crashes. First ImporterProcessServer crashes. That's the crash report I posted. Second Premiere hangs (it's waiting for ImporterProcessServer to respond). That looks like the crash report you posted.

Do you get a crash report for ImporterProcessServer?

Regards,
Glenn

Bruce Gruber · May 10th, 2009, 06:32 AM

Ok here is what I am trying now!! unfourtnatly I will not be home to see the outcome I have to leave in a few minuets and wont be back until 5. I did a system search for

IPPMPEGDecoder.dll

I found this in PP, ENCORE,Adobemedia encoder ect. What I did id take the one from PPCS4 and put in in Adobe media encoder folder over writing the one thats in ther now. Re booted and started.

export/media and Cinaform.avi 720x480. its been processing for over a hour now and no crashs I would have had one 30 min ago by now. I think it the AME not PPcs4

location of IPPMPEGDecoder.dll is x86/programliles adobe then what ever program like Premier Pro CS4
Encore CS4

I forgot to mention the system seems to be running very stable CPU abot 60% and ram about 50%

Cameron Smeal · May 10th, 2009, 06:37 AM

Glenn, yes that is what I just posted.

Also, can anyone confirm that these are right for the Adobe Common Plug-in's folder:

CFHD_AVI_Importer
CFHD_File_Exporter
CFHD_MOV_Importer
CFRenderProc

Cameron Smeal · May 10th, 2009, 07:16 AM

Call me crazy but just for fun I thought I would try pushing the raw .mt2 files around without any CF. Result - around 30 mins of pure editing joy at full 1080/25p, several transitions and effects, minimal rendering required, CPU at around 35% and RAM at 45%. No ImporterProcessServer crashes, no hangs, no problems. CS4 just screams along.

Tell me again why I've spent nearly 2 weeks out of action with CF or is that the dumbest statement this post has seen?

Bruce Gruber · May 10th, 2009, 08:56 AM

Hi Camron
Was that file captured with cf? Or is it captured thru pp?
Bruce

Glenn Babcock · May 10th, 2009, 10:06 AM

I've tried editing projects that didn't have any CF files in them, just HDV captured with Premiere and AVCHD files, PP4 runs like I uninstalled ProspectHD. About the same thing either way though, I still can't use CF.

I'm getting decent performance editing HD without CF as long as I don't mess around too much with effects. I can put three HD tracks into a multi-camera edit and it's real time. But where I was really looking at CF was for color correction.

CF has me spoiled already with the ability to apply color correction and preview it in real/near-real time, either with FirstLight or using PP CF color effects. I'm also impressed with the quality of the CF color correction. But I can't get through a workflow with it. :-(

Regards,
Glenn

Cameron Smeal · May 10th, 2009, 04:17 PM

Bruce - these were captured with PP. I've tried both clips from Compact Flash (I use an HVR-Z7P) and clips injected from tape. Taking CF out of the picture my system screams along merrily.

Glenn - Same result here. I haven't tried too many effects (that will be the next test). I'm with you in that I was looking to CF for maintaining a format and quality through the workflow, as well as being able to colour correct, break-out all my clips from tape into a nice package. The apparent performance gain was going to be a bonus really, and something to delay buying a new quad core or having to go down the Matrox route.

So far though, all CF has given me is a headache, system instability and real loss of productivity. My Proavio RAID 5 array has rebuilt itself 3 times now since installing CF and without it, it is now rock solid.

Guys, I really feel like I am missing the point here in a big way. This thread seems to have gone quite quiet too and it appears it's just us new boots struggling to find an answer.

Or it it just me....? Can either of you tell me if editing MPEG is really that bad if performance seems fine? I am losing quality doing this?

Matt Vanecek · May 10th, 2009, 08:34 PM

Cameron,
M2T was not intended to be a pro editing format. Perhaps it works well enough for hobbyists. And with hardware/software advances, and a little patience for rendering effects, most modern NLEs can handle editing M2T. But it's not an editing format.

Most of us are providing feedback and biding time, because we know the reputation and history of Cineform vs. Adobe. We are fully confident that Cineform will be able to adapt to the CS4 mess (really, you just DON'T change programming APIs without providing a compatibility layer!! That's just idiotic!). Patience is the key, and having a workflow that allows you to get work done in a reasonable manner while at the same time providing feedback to Cineform. If you have time-critical items, then you're probably better off editing in CS3/before, or not using Cineform (if you have CS4) until CS4 has been stabilized.

Thanks,
Matt

Cameron Smeal · May 10th, 2009, 08:44 PM

Matt, thank you for a great, straight answer. Apologies if these questions are stupid, but that is why I am on this forum - to learn from others and to contribute when I can.

This is largely what I thought, though can I ask if there is a degradation in quality when moving MPEG around?

Gil Reitsma · May 11th, 2009, 12:50 AM

Hello Cameron

I also use Mainconcept's Mpeg Pro Hd which does a very good with mt2 files. Infact comparing a first generation render with Cineform using some color correction ( Colorista- Magic Bullet) etc, to me it seems sharper.

It is not yet available for PPCS4

Gil

Bruce Gruber · May 11th, 2009, 03:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruce Gruber

Ok here is what I am trying now!! unfourtnatly I will not be home to see the outcome I have to leave in a few minuets and wont be back until 5. I did a system search for

IPPMPEGDecoder.dll

I found this in PP, ENCORE,Adobemedia encoder ect. What I did id take the one from PPCS4 and put in in Adobe media encoder folder over writing the one thats in ther now. Re booted and started.

export/media and Cinaform.avi 720x480. its been processing for over a hour now and no crashs I would have had one 30 min ago by now. I think it the AME not PPcs4

location of IPPMPEGDecoder.dll is x86/programliles adobe then what ever program like Premier Pro CS4
Encore CS4

I forgot to mention the system seems to be running very stable CPU abot 60% and ram about 50%

Ok my resaults:
this did process all the way!!! the exact same timeline that would not allow me to export before without getting importprocess error, before I swaped IPPMPEGDecoder.dll...... this was a 50 min timeline. But now the disapointing resaults. Encore would crash 2min into transcosding ( again I am trying to output to mpeg-2DVD) again I need to output to both BD and DVD mostly DVD right now!

Bruce Gruber · May 11th, 2009, 03:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cameron Smeal

Bruce - these were captured with PP. I've tried both clips from Compact Flash (I use an HVR-Z7P) and clips injected from tape. Taking CF out of the picture my system screams along merrily.

Hi Cameron thanks, I was just curious. I would expect that PP would scream along with the standard file. and I agree CF files are not running correctly right now. I susupect that part of the speed issue is that they do not have their excelerator operating in CS4.

Trust me when it comes to their compressor it is the best that I have found and Demoed? But the bigger underlying problem is what its the problem with the importer server crash is all about?

Cameron Smeal · May 11th, 2009, 04:06 PM

Thanks Gil. I've been looking at Mainconcept too, but as you note, it seems we are all waiting for CS4.

Bruce - Yes, until the importer server crash issue is sorted out, I certainly can't have CF in my workflow unfortunately.

Any Cineform people out there with an update?

David Taylor · May 11th, 2009, 04:19 PM

Fixing the CS4-PPro issues are our highest priority. We're working hard on it, but we haven't had new information to report yet. Stay tuned....

Bruce Gruber · May 11th, 2009, 04:26 PM

Thanks Dave!

I am trying build 209? I did not notice a new build was posted Friday. I ununstalled CS4 and re unstalled before I installed 209 build! I am giving it a go again!! Luckly I have a brand new computer and no time critical projects for antoher 2 weeks. If need be I will do another fresh install of Visat/64 because I have nothing else on my pc at the moment.

May 10th, 2009, 06:32 AM	#182
Bruce Gruber Major Player Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Lebanon, PA Posts: 221	Ok here is what I am trying now!! unfourtnatly I will not be home to see the outcome I have to leave in a few minuets and wont be back until 5. I did a system search for IPPMPEGDecoder.dll I found this in PP, ENCORE,Adobemedia encoder ect. What I did id take the one from PPCS4 and put in in Adobe media encoder folder over writing the one thats in ther now. Re booted and started. export/media and Cinaform.avi 720x480. its been processing for over a hour now and no crashs I would have had one 30 min ago by now. I think it the AME not PPcs4 location of IPPMPEGDecoder.dll is x86/programliles adobe then what ever program like Premier Pro CS4 Encore CS4 I forgot to mention the system seems to be running very stable CPU abot 60% and ram about 50% Last edited by Bruce Gruber; May 10th, 2009 at 06:36 AM. Reason: forgot to mention

May 10th, 2009, 06:37 AM	#183
Cameron Smeal New Boot Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 23	Glenn, yes that is what I just posted. Also, can anyone confirm that these are right for the Adobe Common Plug-in's folder: CFHD_AVI_Importer CFHD_File_Exporter CFHD_MOV_Importer CFRenderProc Last edited by Cameron Smeal; May 10th, 2009 at 06:40 AM. Reason: Additional question

May 10th, 2009, 08:44 PM	#189
Cameron Smeal New Boot Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 23	Matt, thank you for a great, straight answer. Apologies if these questions are stupid, but that is why I am on this forum - to learn from others and to contribute when I can. This is largely what I thought, though can I ask if there is a degradation in quality when moving MPEG around? Last edited by Cameron Smeal; May 10th, 2009 at 08:44 PM. Reason: Typo

May 10th, 2009, 06:17 AM	#181
Glenn Babcock Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Mooresville, NC Posts: 64	Cameron, Maybe it's an OS thing, but I actually get two crashes. First ImporterProcessServer crashes. That's the crash report I posted. Second Premiere hangs (it's waiting for ImporterProcessServer to respond). That looks like the crash report you posted. Do you get a crash report for ImporterProcessServer? Regards, Glenn

May 10th, 2009, 07:16 AM	#184
Cameron Smeal New Boot Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 23	Call me crazy but just for fun I thought I would try pushing the raw .mt2 files around without any CF. Result - around 30 mins of pure editing joy at full 1080/25p, several transitions and effects, minimal rendering required, CPU at around 35% and RAM at 45%. No ImporterProcessServer crashes, no hangs, no problems. CS4 just screams along. Tell me again why I've spent nearly 2 weeks out of action with CF or is that the dumbest statement this post has seen?

May 10th, 2009, 08:56 AM	#185
Bruce Gruber Major Player Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Lebanon, PA Posts: 221	Hi Camron Was that file captured with cf? Or is it captured thru pp? Bruce

May 10th, 2009, 10:06 AM	#186
Glenn Babcock Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Mooresville, NC Posts: 64	I've tried editing projects that didn't have any CF files in them, just HDV captured with Premiere and AVCHD files, PP4 runs like I uninstalled ProspectHD. About the same thing either way though, I still can't use CF. I'm getting decent performance editing HD without CF as long as I don't mess around too much with effects. I can put three HD tracks into a multi-camera edit and it's real time. But where I was really looking at CF was for color correction. CF has me spoiled already with the ability to apply color correction and preview it in real/near-real time, either with FirstLight or using PP CF color effects. I'm also impressed with the quality of the CF color correction. But I can't get through a workflow with it. :-( Regards, Glenn

May 10th, 2009, 04:17 PM	#187
Cameron Smeal New Boot Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 23	Bruce - these were captured with PP. I've tried both clips from Compact Flash (I use an HVR-Z7P) and clips injected from tape. Taking CF out of the picture my system screams along merrily. Glenn - Same result here. I haven't tried too many effects (that will be the next test). I'm with you in that I was looking to CF for maintaining a format and quality through the workflow, as well as being able to colour correct, break-out all my clips from tape into a nice package. The apparent performance gain was going to be a bonus really, and something to delay buying a new quad core or having to go down the Matrox route. So far though, all CF has given me is a headache, system instability and real loss of productivity. My Proavio RAID 5 array has rebuilt itself 3 times now since installing CF and without it, it is now rock solid. Guys, I really feel like I am missing the point here in a big way. This thread seems to have gone quite quiet too and it appears it's just us new boots struggling to find an answer. Or it it just me....? Can either of you tell me if editing MPEG is really that bad if performance seems fine? I am losing quality doing this?

May 10th, 2009, 08:34 PM	#188
Matt Vanecek Major Player Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Denton, TX Posts: 334	Cameron, M2T was not intended to be a pro editing format. Perhaps it works well enough for hobbyists. And with hardware/software advances, and a little patience for rendering effects, most modern NLEs can handle editing M2T. But it's not an editing format. Most of us are providing feedback and biding time, because we know the reputation and history of Cineform vs. Adobe. We are fully confident that Cineform will be able to adapt to the CS4 mess (really, you just DON'T change programming APIs without providing a compatibility layer!! That's just idiotic!). Patience is the key, and having a workflow that allows you to get work done in a reasonable manner while at the same time providing feedback to Cineform. If you have time-critical items, then you're probably better off editing in CS3/before, or not using Cineform (if you have CS4) until CS4 has been stabilized. Thanks, Matt

May 11th, 2009, 12:50 AM	#190
Gil Reitsma Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Caloundra Australia Posts: 29	Hello Cameron I also use Mainconcept's Mpeg Pro Hd which does a very good with mt2 files. Infact comparing a first generation render with Cineform using some color correction ( Colorista- Magic Bullet) etc, to me it seems sharper. It is not yet available for PPCS4 Gil

May 11th, 2009, 04:06 PM	#193
Cameron Smeal New Boot Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 23	Thanks Gil. I've been looking at Mainconcept too, but as you note, it seems we are all waiting for CS4. Bruce - Yes, until the importer server crash issue is sorted out, I certainly can't have CF in my workflow unfortunately. Any Cineform people out there with an update?

May 11th, 2009, 04:19 PM	#194
David Taylor Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Solana Beach, CA Posts: 853	Fixing the CS4-PPro issues are our highest priority. We're working hard on it, but we haven't had new information to report yet. Stay tuned....

May 11th, 2009, 04:26 PM	#195
Bruce Gruber Major Player Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Lebanon, PA Posts: 221	Thanks Dave! I am trying build 209? I did not notice a new build was posted Friday. I ununstalled CS4 and re unstalled before I installed 209 build! I am giving it a go again!! Luckly I have a brand new computer and no time critical projects for antoher 2 weeks. If need be I will do another fresh install of Visat/64 because I have nothing else on my pc at the moment.