Ideas about the metadata management at DVinfo.net

Kaspar Kallas · April 3rd, 2009, 10:55 AM

Hi

As I have been working with SI footage for more than 2 years now (so all the available time for metadata), some ideas and problems that still seem relevant.

1. Some way to keep the metadata inside the original file instead of the database.
I do understand some of the benefits of the metadata in database (Versioning, remote color decisions etc) but it can become a nightmare to keep the files up to date on all the computers one might use.
We currently use SAN system and have 3 primary editing suites and 2 FX suites plus Speedgrade suite for CC. So far I have come up with a script to update the databases on all computers. So edit metadata on one computer and the run the script when done, so all computers could see the same image. This in turn destroys the openness of a SAN system.
To archive original footage with the look+metadata is no way an easy task because things just keep changing and there is no way to make sure which GUID is attached to which file to filter out only one project.
NB! If there is no way to keep the look of the file the same when going from computer to computer no major production will not accept CF as good enough tool!

2. An option to disable metadata
I have a raw footage that I need to key in Nuke for example. It would be very helpful to have to possibility to read the file with meta and without meta data side by side. So I would not have to make and RGB flattened file and extra set of metadata.
PS! It would be helpful to get new GUID for the data if I so "save as" in QT so we could get a short term fix.

3. Better integration with Iridas
It would be more than cool if I could access the the "pre processing" plus look of CF in Iridas (even import button would be ok) and save button, this could actually even better than XML Color workflow, by just tuning the metadata in SG and rendering from PP or FCP just no shapes (maybe later)

Maybe there are other people here who use the metadata option day to day operations and can chime in or even argue some of the points that I made.

Thank You
-Kaspar

David Taylor · April 3rd, 2009, 11:16 AM

Kaspar,

We are about to introduce First Light on both Windows and Mac. Managing metadata will get easier, but metadata will remain outside the file - at least for now.

Through First Light you have options to enable or disable metadata when playing or accessing a CineForm file, but you cannot do both simultaneously - you can do one or the other (at a time) as the controls are global. This is also available using SetActiveMetadata which will go away shortly. Managing the color databases will get easier with First Light which will hopefully address some of your issues here. In fact perhaps you'd like to do some Mac Alpha testing for us as it relates to the database.

We fully support improving integration with Iridas. The good news is they have full access to CineForm files and Active Metadata through the CineForm SDK, and can process it anyway they choose. Feature improvements for using CineForm files with Active Metadata inside Speedgrade should go to Iridas.

Kaspar Kallas · April 6th, 2009, 08:33 AM

Hi

Could some people who use active metadata make some noise? Just to see how many are out there?
Maybe then we could start to see what is needed VS what is possible

Thank You
-Kaspar

David Taylor · April 6th, 2009, 08:56 AM

Everything changes when First Light is available, so I recommend we NOT have discussion about metadata now. First Light will represent the application and the architecture that we build upon, so any discussion in advance of that becomes mostly irrelevant.

April 3rd, 2009, 10:55 AM	#1
Kaspar Kallas Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Estonia Posts: 142	Ideas about the metadata management Hi As I have been working with SI footage for more than 2 years now (so all the available time for metadata), some ideas and problems that still seem relevant. 1. Some way to keep the metadata inside the original file instead of the database. I do understand some of the benefits of the metadata in database (Versioning, remote color decisions etc) but it can become a nightmare to keep the files up to date on all the computers one might use. We currently use SAN system and have 3 primary editing suites and 2 FX suites plus Speedgrade suite for CC. So far I have come up with a script to update the databases on all computers. So edit metadata on one computer and the run the script when done, so all computers could see the same image. This in turn destroys the openness of a SAN system. To archive original footage with the look+metadata is no way an easy task because things just keep changing and there is no way to make sure which GUID is attached to which file to filter out only one project. NB! If there is no way to keep the look of the file the same when going from computer to computer no major production will not accept CF as good enough tool! 2. An option to disable metadata I have a raw footage that I need to key in Nuke for example. It would be very helpful to have to possibility to read the file with meta and without meta data side by side. So I would not have to make and RGB flattened file and extra set of metadata. PS! It would be helpful to get new GUID for the data if I so "save as" in QT so we could get a short term fix. 3. Better integration with Iridas It would be more than cool if I could access the the "pre processing" plus look of CF in Iridas (even import button would be ok) and save button, this could actually even better than XML Color workflow, by just tuning the metadata in SG and rendering from PP or FCP just no shapes (maybe later) Maybe there are other people here who use the metadata option day to day operations and can chime in or even argue some of the points that I made. Thank You -Kaspar

April 3rd, 2009, 11:16 AM	#2
David Taylor Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Solana Beach, CA Posts: 853	Kaspar, We are about to introduce First Light on both Windows and Mac. Managing metadata will get easier, but metadata will remain outside the file - at least for now. Through First Light you have options to enable or disable metadata when playing or accessing a CineForm file, but you cannot do both simultaneously - you can do one or the other (at a time) as the controls are global. This is also available using SetActiveMetadata which will go away shortly. Managing the color databases will get easier with First Light which will hopefully address some of your issues here. In fact perhaps you'd like to do some Mac Alpha testing for us as it relates to the database. We fully support improving integration with Iridas. The good news is they have full access to CineForm files and Active Metadata through the CineForm SDK, and can process it anyway they choose. Feature improvements for using CineForm files with Active Metadata inside Speedgrade should go to Iridas.

April 6th, 2009, 08:33 AM	#3
Kaspar Kallas Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Estonia Posts: 142	Hi Could some people who use active metadata make some noise? Just to see how many are out there? Maybe then we could start to see what is needed VS what is possible Thank You -Kaspar

April 6th, 2009, 08:56 AM	#4
David Taylor Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Solana Beach, CA Posts: 853	Everything changes when First Light is available, so I recommend we NOT have discussion about metadata now. First Light will represent the application and the architecture that we build upon, so any discussion in advance of that becomes mostly irrelevant.