Cineform NeoHD and Flash XDR at DVinfo.net

Bill Ravens · January 29th, 2009, 09:43 AM

David...

I took delivery of a Convergent-Design FlashXDR, last week; and, have been doing testing with the device. C-D now has recording working for both .mov and .mxf file types. My testing is principally on a PC, so the .mxf file type is my preference. The mxf record imports into all my NLE's, including Avid Media Composer.

Unfortunately, NeoHD is unable to read these files to do a conversion to CFHD.avi. I've filed a trouble ticket with Cineform for the .mov file format, which also fails to convert. I'm pretty sure Jake is working the .mov issues, but, I thought I'd elevate my problem to you in this forum, as regards the mxf format.

The C-D file records are done with a Sony MPEG2 codec working at 50-100mbps, as I'm sure you are aware.

Thanx for giving this your attention.
Best

David Taylor · January 29th, 2009, 02:46 PM

Bill, in general CineForm doesn't support MXF file types. We have made exceptions for specific cameras, but in general MXF won't be supported unless we do work to enable it.

At one time we tested compatibility with some Flash XDR files (don't remember whether they were MOV or AVI) and they were compatible with HD Link, so something must have changed.

Dan Keaton · January 29th, 2009, 05:53 PM

Dear David,

If the testing was more than a week or two ago, the tests were probably of our Quicktime, ".mov", files.

We now have our MXF files working in Sony Vegas 8.0(c), Avid, and Edius.

At this time, while our MXF files are still fairly new, we do have confidience in them. They have been reviewed by engineers at Avid and others. Also, since they work well in three different NLE's, we feel that they are likely in conformance with the MXF standard.

We will be happy to supply you with sample files for your testing and development.

David Taylor · January 31st, 2009, 10:40 AM

We (CineForm) will need a QuickTime file from Flash XDR to investigate why it is incompatible. When we tested a few months the files were compatible, so something might have changed in the biststream. If somebody can either point us to a file on an FTP site, or can email an MOV file to us using a service like YouSendIT to support at cineform dot com, we will take a look at it.

Dan Keaton · January 31st, 2009, 10:45 AM

Dear David,

I will arrange for sample files to be sent to you.

Bill Ravens · January 31st, 2009, 10:56 AM

I provided Jake Seagraves, at Cineform tech support, a sample .mov file about a week ago.

David Newman · January 31st, 2009, 11:04 AM

No harm in extra samples.

Bill Ravens · February 10th, 2009, 09:32 PM

Over 10 days ago I posted this question concerning the ability of Cineform to handle the Sony XDCAM HD codec encoded files from a Convergent_Design FLASH XDR. I've not heard one word concerning the outcome of my question. Is this issue being fixed, or has it been dropped?

Enquiring minds want to know.

David Newman · February 10th, 2009, 10:40 PM

Follow up with support, I'm not following this project.

John Richard · February 11th, 2009, 09:34 AM

For the many using Premiere CS3/4 and Cineform codec plugins as their NLE workflow, would this allow XDR files to be used once Cineform/C-D sort this out?

This as opposed to going thru the added expense of the Main Concept costs. Know many folks he use the fine Cineform products already.

Bill Ravens · February 11th, 2009, 09:41 AM

One would hope so.

David Taylor · February 12th, 2009, 09:38 PM

Just as follow-up. The original files we tested from Flash XDR last summer were compatible with CineForm conversion software. The latest files we tested were not compatible, so something change in the Convergent file syntax.

We can put this on the list to look at further, but to be honest we have a huge number of tasks on our plate right now so we can't commit to a schedule for this task.

Tim Bucklin · May 11th, 2009, 03:22 PM

For those of you still following this subject...

It looks like we'll be able to utilize the components of the latest Sony XDCam viewer software to enable full support for MXF-based Convergent Design Flash XDR source in HDLink.

It doesn't look like we'll have Quicktime support on the PC side, but we'll be testing it on the Mac side shortly.

We hope to have the integration into HDLink by the end of the month!

Step 1 is to download the latest XDCam viewer software (v220) from Sony's site here: https://servicesplus.us.sony.biz/Sof...eDownload.aspx

Bill Ravens · May 11th, 2009, 03:23 PM

Great News!!!
Thanx, Tim

Tim Bucklin · May 21st, 2009, 05:48 PM

Unfortunately we've run into some trouble with this development process, as the Sony components aren't as plug-and-play as initial testing led us to believe.

However, we are working with Sony on the issue of supporting all MXF-based XDCAM formats. So, while support may not come as quickly as we had hoped, we are making progress! It's good to have all three pieces of the puzzle (CineForm, Sony, Convergent Design) working together for a solution.

January 29th, 2009, 09:43 AM	#1
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	Cineform NeoHD and Flash XDR David... I took delivery of a Convergent-Design FlashXDR, last week; and, have been doing testing with the device. C-D now has recording working for both .mov and .mxf file types. My testing is principally on a PC, so the .mxf file type is my preference. The mxf record imports into all my NLE's, including Avid Media Composer. Unfortunately, NeoHD is unable to read these files to do a conversion to CFHD.avi. I've filed a trouble ticket with Cineform for the .mov file format, which also fails to convert. I'm pretty sure Jake is working the .mov issues, but, I thought I'd elevate my problem to you in this forum, as regards the mxf format. The C-D file records are done with a Sony MPEG2 codec working at 50-100mbps, as I'm sure you are aware. Thanx for giving this your attention. Best

January 29th, 2009, 05:53 PM	#3
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear David, If the testing was more than a week or two ago, the tests were probably of our Quicktime, ".mov", files. We now have our MXF files working in Sony Vegas 8.0(c), Avid, and Edius. At this time, while our MXF files are still fairly new, we do have confidience in them. They have been reviewed by engineers at Avid and others. Also, since they work well in three different NLE's, we feel that they are likely in conformance with the MXF standard. We will be happy to supply you with sample files for your testing and development. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

January 31st, 2009, 10:45 AM	#5
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear David, I will arrange for sample files to be sent to you. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

January 31st, 2009, 11:04 AM	#7
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	No harm in extra samples. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

February 10th, 2009, 10:40 PM	#9
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Follow up with support, I'm not following this project. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

January 29th, 2009, 02:46 PM	#2
David Taylor Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Solana Beach, CA Posts: 853	Bill, in general CineForm doesn't support MXF file types. We have made exceptions for specific cameras, but in general MXF won't be supported unless we do work to enable it. At one time we tested compatibility with some Flash XDR files (don't remember whether they were MOV or AVI) and they were compatible with HD Link, so something must have changed.

January 31st, 2009, 10:40 AM	#4
David Taylor Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Solana Beach, CA Posts: 853	We (CineForm) will need a QuickTime file from Flash XDR to investigate why it is incompatible. When we tested a few months the files were compatible, so something might have changed in the biststream. If somebody can either point us to a file on an FTP site, or can email an MOV file to us using a service like YouSendIT to support at cineform dot com, we will take a look at it.

January 31st, 2009, 10:56 AM	#6
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	I provided Jake Seagraves, at Cineform tech support, a sample .mov file about a week ago.

February 10th, 2009, 09:32 PM	#8
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	Over 10 days ago I posted this question concerning the ability of Cineform to handle the Sony XDCAM HD codec encoded files from a Convergent_Design FLASH XDR. I've not heard one word concerning the outcome of my question. Is this issue being fixed, or has it been dropped? Enquiring minds want to know.

February 11th, 2009, 09:34 AM	#10
John Richard Major Player Join Date: May 2006 Location: Incline Village, Nevada Posts: 604	For the many using Premiere CS3/4 and Cineform codec plugins as their NLE workflow, would this allow XDR files to be used once Cineform/C-D sort this out? This as opposed to going thru the added expense of the Main Concept costs. Know many folks he use the fine Cineform products already.

February 11th, 2009, 09:41 AM	#11
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	One would hope so.

February 12th, 2009, 09:38 PM	#12
David Taylor Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Solana Beach, CA Posts: 853	Just as follow-up. The original files we tested from Flash XDR last summer were compatible with CineForm conversion software. The latest files we tested were not compatible, so something change in the Convergent file syntax. We can put this on the list to look at further, but to be honest we have a huge number of tasks on our plate right now so we can't commit to a schedule for this task.

May 11th, 2009, 03:22 PM	#13
Tim Bucklin Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Solana Beach, CA Posts: 112	For those of you still following this subject... It looks like we'll be able to utilize the components of the latest Sony XDCam viewer software to enable full support for MXF-based Convergent Design Flash XDR source in HDLink. It doesn't look like we'll have Quicktime support on the PC side, but we'll be testing it on the Mac side shortly. We hope to have the integration into HDLink by the end of the month! Step 1 is to download the latest XDCam viewer software (v220) from Sony's site here: https://servicesplus.us.sony.biz/Sof...eDownload.aspx __________________ Tim Bucklin CineForm Software Engineer

May 11th, 2009, 03:23 PM	#14
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	Great News!!! Thanx, Tim

May 21st, 2009, 05:48 PM	#15
Tim Bucklin Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Solana Beach, CA Posts: 112	Unfortunately we've run into some trouble with this development process, as the Sony components aren't as plug-and-play as initial testing led us to believe. However, we are working with Sony on the issue of supporting all MXF-based XDCAM formats. So, while support may not come as quickly as we had hoped, we are making progress! It's good to have all three pieces of the puzzle (CineForm, Sony, Convergent Design) working together for a solution. __________________ Tim Bucklin CineForm Software Engineer