Neo Scene -- various topics

Robert Gadsdon · February 7th, 2009, 05:29 AM

I have just installed Neo Scene (on WinXP SP2) and when selecting the "Split file on scene changes" option, the first clip is overwritten by the second, which has the _same_ filename ("xxxxx-001.avi").. All subsequent clips are named and captured correctly, in sequence. I have reinstalled the software, and updated to the latest version (which is '104b107' on the zip file, but states it is '1.0.3 build 106' in the logfile), and tested two different cameras - HV20 (60i) and HV30 (50i), with the same results.

David Newman · February 7th, 2009, 10:51 AM

Never heard of that, please file a report with CineForm Support so we can get it fixed.

John Rich · February 9th, 2009, 06:34 PM

Right now I have, what I consider a great system for editing HDV with Aspect HD and capturing with HDLink and editing in PremPro CS3.

I'm considering a new camera, which is AVCHD. I was thinking of just adding NeoScene to capture and convert the AVCHD files to CF.avi so I could edit in PremPRo CS3.
Are there any potential problems having both HDLink and NeoScene on the same computer?

Are there any known problems with audio capturing the AVCHD with NeoSCene?

This seems like an economical solution instead of updating to PremPro CS4.

Thanks in advance,
John Rich

Tim Bucklin · February 9th, 2009, 07:46 PM

Hi John,

Aspect HD doesn't allow for 1920x1080 material, but Neo Scene does. This is the only foreseeable problem as Neo Scene also does not offer any scaling.

Getting the two to co-exist will be trivial and really just require you to manually preserve the Premiere Pro real-time components when you uninstall Aspect HD.

However, while Neo Scene is only $129, you can upgrade your copy of Aspect HD to Prospect HD for $199, which would not only make the installation/upgrade process easier, but it would give you a number of benefits you otherwise wouldn't have.

For instance, you'd get full 1920x1080 inside of Premiere, as well as the AVCHD support in HD Link. Also, if you upgrade to Prospect HD 3.x now, you'll get a free upgrade to Prospect HD 4.0 when it's released, which will ensure compatibility if you do eventually upgrade to CS4.

If, for whatever reason, you decide to just add Neo Scene to Aspect, we'll still be happy to help you set that up.

John Rich · February 9th, 2009, 10:23 PM

Tim,

That's really helpful. Since I am a "rookie" at this, if you wouldn't mind I just want to be sure about a few things if I upgrade to prospect HD:
1. Will I be able to capture both HDV and AVCHD with HDLink with scene selection.
2. Is any extra program required for capture of the AVCHD like Haali splitter.
3. Can both HDV and AVCHD be simultaneously converted to the CF.avi on capture.
4. Does PremPro CS3 automatically put projects for both AVCHD and HDV in the opening project list.
5. If I export the AVCHD sequence out for BluRAy is it done through File -export -movie using the Cineform HD File type just as I do with HDV now or is there a separate file type for AVCHD.
6. If I want to export AVCHD to SD do I just reset the resolution to 720x480 as I do now with HDV.
7. If I want to create a title with an alpha channel in After Effects, will the Cineform project I create work ok with the alpha channel. Right now I have to use quicktime which for HDV , but would the quicktime alpha channel work with the AVCHD as well.
8. Will AE allow me to make 1920x1080 comps so I can output quicktime at 1920x1080.
from AE. (I may already have that with Aspect's HDTV 1080 29.97 as preset).

Sorry to be so longwinded, but it would be great if you could help me out with the above.
Thanks in advance.
John Rich

Ed Kishel · February 9th, 2009, 10:52 PM

I use Premiere Pro and Vegas Pro and have started converting my AVCHD footage for a higher quality post workflow.

Does anyone have suggestions re: project settings in either NLE that maximizes playback or cutting performance when using Neo Scene avi files?

I am noticing that in both Vegas and Premiere I get much smoother playback when using the raw avchd compared to the Neo Scene clips. I would love to create a preset for each app just for editing Neo clips effectively.

Thanks,
Ed

Cliff Etzel · February 9th, 2009, 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Kishel

I use Premiere Pro and Vegas Pro and have started converting my AVCHD footage for a higher quality post workflow.

Does anyone have suggestions re: project settings in either NLE that maximizes playback or cutting performance when using Neo Scene avi files?

I am noticing that in both Vegas and Premiere I get much smoother playback when using the raw avchd compared to the Neo Scene clips. I would love to create a preset for each app just for editing Neo clips effectively.

Thanks,
Ed

My understanding is native files require less demands on hard drive transfer, but eat more CPU cycles, the opposite is true for frame based AVI files. I just purchased Neo Scene today after having lock up issues with editing native m2t files when embedding multiple veg files in a master timeline - cost me half a nights sleep but barely made the deadline.

One this I remember editing SD footage was that all files were ingested as AVI's in Vegas and PPro 1.5.1 - and I never had issues - I would say you need to find the bottle neck for your drives - this is where someone will probably chime in about using a RAID array to get better throughput, but I don't know for sure.

I'd rather sacrifice some playback speed for better efficiency in cc'ing and less issues around rendering. Cineform appears to provide that - although I won't know for sure until I do some actual testing.

Not sure if I answered your question or not

Ed Kishel · February 10th, 2009, 12:01 AM

good info...

there are so many HD presets in each app and since I am new to cineform, I want to make sure I am using the most effecient

thanks

Cliff Etzel · February 11th, 2009, 05:46 PM

I just purchased Cineform Neo Scene this week. My understanding is that native m2t files require less overhead on hard drive throughput and more demands on the CPU, where as Cineform frame based AVI's are more hard drive intensive for throughput - am I correct in this?

If so, is it advisable to look at some sort of a RAID setup for editing with Cineform files in Vegas Pro 8? I currently use separate single sata drives for editing and rendering - all 7200 RPM drives.

Any advice greatly appreciated.

David Newman · February 11th, 2009, 05:51 PM

Fast SATA drives should be plent fast enough. RAID 0 is optional.

Cliff Etzel · February 11th, 2009, 05:58 PM

Thanks David :)

Andy Urtusuastegui · February 11th, 2009, 07:48 PM

One more thing. Right now Cineform files are NOT optimized for CS4. They work, but very slowly as they use the Vfw (video for windows) interface.

Cineform will be releasing an updated version that will work better with CS4.

It should be comming out in about a week.

David Newman · February 15th, 2009, 11:12 PM

Some are have issues with explorer.exe not liking Neo Scene 1.1. If you are one of those users, please try this build :

http://www.miscdata.com/cineform/Neo...108a-Setup.zip

Let me know if that solves the crash with explorer.

P.S. If all is working, there nothing new here in this download, just a small change to the licensing software.

Charles W. Hull · February 15th, 2009, 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Newman

Let me know if that solves the crash with explorer.

Yes that seems to have solved it, at least for me. Thanks for the quick work (on Sunday!)

Jon Carr · February 16th, 2009, 11:07 AM

I just purchased Neo Scene to work with my 5d Mark 2 files on my Mac Book Pro. The trouble I am having is when I go into After Effects 7 and try to use the files, I get no picture. I can import the files and play them. I hear the audio but the picture isn't there, just a blank screen of white.

I will upgrade to CS4 eventually but want to wait until CS4 is supported.

Any help would be really appreciated.

February 7th, 2009, 05:29 AM	#31
Robert Gadsdon New Boot Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Aylesbury. UK. Posts: 12	Neo Scene - second clip overwrites first I have just installed Neo Scene (on WinXP SP2) and when selecting the "Split file on scene changes" option, the first clip is overwritten by the second, which has the _same_ filename ("xxxxx-001.avi").. All subsequent clips are named and captured correctly, in sequence. I have reinstalled the software, and updated to the latest version (which is '104b107' on the zip file, but states it is '1.0.3 build 106' in the logfile), and tested two different cameras - HV20 (60i) and HV30 (50i), with the same results.

February 7th, 2009, 10:51 AM	#32
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Never heard of that, please file a report with CineForm Support so we can get it fixed. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

February 9th, 2009, 06:34 PM	#33
John Rich Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Dayton, Ohio Posts: 80	HD Link, Neo Scenes and Prem Pro CS3 Right now I have, what I consider a great system for editing HDV with Aspect HD and capturing with HDLink and editing in PremPro CS3. I'm considering a new camera, which is AVCHD. I was thinking of just adding NeoScene to capture and convert the AVCHD files to CF.avi so I could edit in PremPRo CS3. Are there any potential problems having both HDLink and NeoScene on the same computer? Are there any known problems with audio capturing the AVCHD with NeoSCene? This seems like an economical solution instead of updating to PremPro CS4. Thanks in advance, John Rich

February 9th, 2009, 07:46 PM	#34
Tim Bucklin Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Solana Beach, CA Posts: 112	Hi John, Aspect HD doesn't allow for 1920x1080 material, but Neo Scene does. This is the only foreseeable problem as Neo Scene also does not offer any scaling. Getting the two to co-exist will be trivial and really just require you to manually preserve the Premiere Pro real-time components when you uninstall Aspect HD. However, while Neo Scene is only $129, you can upgrade your copy of Aspect HD to Prospect HD for $199, which would not only make the installation/upgrade process easier, but it would give you a number of benefits you otherwise wouldn't have. For instance, you'd get full 1920x1080 inside of Premiere, as well as the AVCHD support in HD Link. Also, if you upgrade to Prospect HD 3.x now, you'll get a free upgrade to Prospect HD 4.0 when it's released, which will ensure compatibility if you do eventually upgrade to CS4. If, for whatever reason, you decide to just add Neo Scene to Aspect, we'll still be happy to help you set that up. __________________ Tim Bucklin CineForm Software Engineer

February 9th, 2009, 10:52 PM	#36
Ed Kishel Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 80	Vegas and/or Premiere Pro Project settings for Neo Scene clips I use Premiere Pro and Vegas Pro and have started converting my AVCHD footage for a higher quality post workflow. Does anyone have suggestions re: project settings in either NLE that maximizes playback or cutting performance when using Neo Scene avi files? I am noticing that in both Vegas and Premiere I get much smoother playback when using the raw avchd compared to the Neo Scene clips. I would love to create a preset for each app just for editing Neo clips effectively. Thanks, Ed

February 9th, 2009, 10:23 PM	#35
John Rich Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Dayton, Ohio Posts: 80	Tim, That's really helpful. Since I am a "rookie" at this, if you wouldn't mind I just want to be sure about a few things if I upgrade to prospect HD: 1. Will I be able to capture both HDV and AVCHD with HDLink with scene selection. 2. Is any extra program required for capture of the AVCHD like Haali splitter. 3. Can both HDV and AVCHD be simultaneously converted to the CF.avi on capture. 4. Does PremPro CS3 automatically put projects for both AVCHD and HDV in the opening project list. 5. If I export the AVCHD sequence out for BluRAy is it done through File -export -movie using the Cineform HD File type just as I do with HDV now or is there a separate file type for AVCHD. 6. If I want to export AVCHD to SD do I just reset the resolution to 720x480 as I do now with HDV. 7. If I want to create a title with an alpha channel in After Effects, will the Cineform project I create work ok with the alpha channel. Right now I have to use quicktime which for HDV , but would the quicktime alpha channel work with the AVCHD as well. 8. Will AE allow me to make 1920x1080 comps so I can output quicktime at 1920x1080. from AE. (I may already have that with Aspect's HDTV 1080 29.97 as preset). Sorry to be so longwinded, but it would be great if you could help me out with the above. Thanks in advance. John Rich

February 10th, 2009, 12:01 AM	#38
Ed Kishel Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 80	good info... there are so many HD presets in each app and since I am new to cineform, I want to make sure I am using the most effecient thanks

February 11th, 2009, 05:46 PM	#39
Cliff Etzel Major Player Join Date: May 2006 Location: Eugene, Oregon Posts: 325	Is a RAID recommended for Cineform Neo Scene and Vegas Pro 8? I just purchased Cineform Neo Scene this week. My understanding is that native m2t files require less overhead on hard drive throughput and more demands on the CPU, where as Cineform frame based AVI's are more hard drive intensive for throughput - am I correct in this? If so, is it advisable to look at some sort of a RAID setup for editing with Cineform files in Vegas Pro 8? I currently use separate single sata drives for editing and rendering - all 7200 RPM drives. Any advice greatly appreciated. __________________ Cliff Etzel - Photographer Website \| Blog

February 11th, 2009, 05:51 PM	#40
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Fast SATA drives should be plent fast enough. RAID 0 is optional. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

February 11th, 2009, 05:58 PM	#41
Cliff Etzel Major Player Join Date: May 2006 Location: Eugene, Oregon Posts: 325	Thanks David :) __________________ Cliff Etzel - Photographer Website \| Blog

February 11th, 2009, 07:48 PM	#42
Andy Urtusuastegui Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Foothill Ranch, CA Posts: 166	One more thing. Right now Cineform files are NOT optimized for CS4. They work, but very slowly as they use the Vfw (video for windows) interface. Cineform will be releasing an updated version that will work better with CS4. It should be comming out in about a week.

February 15th, 2009, 11:12 PM	#43
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Neo Scene 1.1 and explorer Some are have issues with explorer.exe not liking Neo Scene 1.1. If you are one of those users, please try this build : http://www.miscdata.com/cineform/Neo...108a-Setup.zip Let me know if that solves the crash with explorer. P.S. If all is working, there nothing new here in this download, just a small change to the licensing software. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

February 16th, 2009, 11:07 AM	#45
Jon Carr Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: San Francisco Posts: 35	Neo Scene and AE7 on a Mac Issue I just purchased Neo Scene to work with my 5d Mark 2 files on my Mac Book Pro. The trouble I am having is when I go into After Effects 7 and try to use the files, I get no picture. I can import the files and play them. I hear the audio but the picture isn't there, just a blank screen of white. I will upgrade to CS4 eventually but want to wait until CS4 is supported. Any help would be really appreciated.