Export Prospect HD project to DVD at DVinfo.net

Ulli Grunow · May 20th, 2008, 12:26 AM

Good morning,
I am testing Prospect HD for use with CS3 and my new EX1 camera on 1080p25 footage (1920x1080).
I have read on the Cineform website an article about how to correctly export to DVD to keep best quality. It is mentioned not to use the CS3 Exporter from Premiere, but use the menu point "export movie" using the Cineform HD codec.

When I do this, unfortunately the export is much slower than using the Adobe exporter.

What is the background, I should use the Cineform HD codec to export to DVD ? I understood, that the original Premiere timeline is replaced by a sort of Cineform timeline, which uses the Cineform intermediate codec anyway. Why using a different export mode then, rather than the well working Adobe exporter ?

So far, I tried some test Prospect HD footage to write on DVD with no problem using the standard Adobe exporter (DVD MPEG 2 export with high quality).
Also I tried the Adobe export to Encore from the Premiere menu without any problems.

But may be I missed image quality, as I didn't use the Cineform method ?
May be I miss some technical background here ?
Thanks for some advice about how this thing works.

Ulli

Robert Young · May 20th, 2008, 02:11 AM

Ulli
This is a very big topic with many different workflow possibilities and many different opinions. I couldn't begin to do justice to all of that, but I can give some basic examples from my own modest experience.
There are 2 categories of possibilities:
1) HDV (1080x1440, non square pixel) to DVD and
2) EX1 1080 HQ (1080x1920 square pixel) to DVD
The first- HDV>DVD- is the most problematic and seems to have caused the most discussion. Transcoding the Cineform 1080 avi codec directly to 480x720 mpeg for DVD authoring does not produce the best possible DVD image. It is best to downsize the Cineform 1080 par 1.33 avi to 480 par 1.2 avi (basically the Cineform version of 16x9 DV). One of the best ways to do this is to Export Movie from the Cineform 1080 timeline using the Cineform compressor (as opposed to Adobe, or other compressors), setting the output parameters to 480x720 par 1.2, and deinterlace if desired. This produces a standard def DV movie in the Cineform avi codec. Many, including myself (ProCoder 3), will then use third party compression software to transcode the down scaled avi to DVD compliant mpeg.
The second situation- Cineform 1080x1920 square pixel avi> DVD seems much simpler. I haven't done a full production in this format yet, only a 4 min. video short, and some test routines, but when I transcode (with ProCoder 3) the Cineform 1080x1920 square pixel HD avi directly (from the timeline) to DVD mpeg, burn it, and watch it on a 50" Sony HDTV, it looks absolutely terrific- probably better image quality than I have ever obtained from any HDV>DVD workflow I've tried. If I play the DVD on an HDMI "upscaling" DVD player, the images look as good as a commercial (read Hollywood) hardware encoded DVD.
My theory is that it's the full raster HD with square pixels that makes such a big difference. The EX1 1080 HQ @ 35 mbs provides such a superior, relatively uncompromised image, and then transcoding to 10 bit, 4:2:2 avi in Cineform Prospect, and it's looking like you can then take it wherever you want: DVD, Flash, QT, broadcast, or even film and get great image quality. I suspect it's all of the pixel shifting, pixel stretching in the HDV format that prevents it from travelling as well as 1080HQ.
Anyway, if you are shooting 1080 HQ and editing in Prospect HD, you are on the top and should have a smooth simple trip to get to DVD or anywhere else.

Ulli Grunow · May 20th, 2008, 01:11 PM

Thanks very much Robert for your information. Well, since I have the EX1 now for several weeks, I stopped shooting HDV - the EX1 is a different world when it comes to picture quality.
The only thing is, that I found out, that my Pentium D is really old and I better try to build a new PC with faster processors, if I really want to get all the benefits of Cineform codec...

Ulli

Robert Young · May 20th, 2008, 05:49 PM

Ulli
Yes! For any flavor of HD editing it will be best to have the latest, greatest system.

May 20th, 2008, 12:26 AM	#1
Ulli Grunow Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Lauwe Belgium Posts: 39	Export Prospect HD project to DVD Good morning, I am testing Prospect HD for use with CS3 and my new EX1 camera on 1080p25 footage (1920x1080). I have read on the Cineform website an article about how to correctly export to DVD to keep best quality. It is mentioned not to use the CS3 Exporter from Premiere, but use the menu point "export movie" using the Cineform HD codec. When I do this, unfortunately the export is much slower than using the Adobe exporter. What is the background, I should use the Cineform HD codec to export to DVD ? I understood, that the original Premiere timeline is replaced by a sort of Cineform timeline, which uses the Cineform intermediate codec anyway. Why using a different export mode then, rather than the well working Adobe exporter ? So far, I tried some test Prospect HD footage to write on DVD with no problem using the standard Adobe exporter (DVD MPEG 2 export with high quality). Also I tried the Adobe export to Encore from the Premiere menu without any problems. But may be I missed image quality, as I didn't use the Cineform method ? May be I miss some technical background here ? Thanks for some advice about how this thing works. Ulli

May 20th, 2008, 01:11 PM	#3
Ulli Grunow Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Lauwe Belgium Posts: 39	EX1 to DVD workflow Thanks very much Robert for your information. Well, since I have the EX1 now for several weeks, I stopped shooting HDV - the EX1 is a different world when it comes to picture quality. The only thing is, that I found out, that my Pentium D is really old and I better try to build a new PC with faster processors, if I really want to get all the benefits of Cineform codec... Ulli

May 20th, 2008, 02:11 AM	#2
Robert Young Trustee Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Coronado Island Posts: 1,472	Ulli This is a very big topic with many different workflow possibilities and many different opinions. I couldn't begin to do justice to all of that, but I can give some basic examples from my own modest experience. There are 2 categories of possibilities: 1) HDV (1080x1440, non square pixel) to DVD and 2) EX1 1080 HQ (1080x1920 square pixel) to DVD The first- HDV>DVD- is the most problematic and seems to have caused the most discussion. Transcoding the Cineform 1080 avi codec directly to 480x720 mpeg for DVD authoring does not produce the best possible DVD image. It is best to downsize the Cineform 1080 par 1.33 avi to 480 par 1.2 avi (basically the Cineform version of 16x9 DV). One of the best ways to do this is to Export Movie from the Cineform 1080 timeline using the Cineform compressor (as opposed to Adobe, or other compressors), setting the output parameters to 480x720 par 1.2, and deinterlace if desired. This produces a standard def DV movie in the Cineform avi codec. Many, including myself (ProCoder 3), will then use third party compression software to transcode the down scaled avi to DVD compliant mpeg. The second situation- Cineform 1080x1920 square pixel avi> DVD seems much simpler. I haven't done a full production in this format yet, only a 4 min. video short, and some test routines, but when I transcode (with ProCoder 3) the Cineform 1080x1920 square pixel HD avi directly (from the timeline) to DVD mpeg, burn it, and watch it on a 50" Sony HDTV, it looks absolutely terrific- probably better image quality than I have ever obtained from any HDV>DVD workflow I've tried. If I play the DVD on an HDMI "upscaling" DVD player, the images look as good as a commercial (read Hollywood) hardware encoded DVD. My theory is that it's the full raster HD with square pixels that makes such a big difference. The EX1 1080 HQ @ 35 mbs provides such a superior, relatively uncompromised image, and then transcoding to 10 bit, 4:2:2 avi in Cineform Prospect, and it's looking like you can then take it wherever you want: DVD, Flash, QT, broadcast, or even film and get great image quality. I suspect it's all of the pixel shifting, pixel stretching in the HDV format that prevents it from travelling as well as 1080HQ. Anyway, if you are shooting 1080 HQ and editing in Prospect HD, you are on the top and should have a smooth simple trip to get to DVD or anywhere else.

May 20th, 2008, 05:49 PM	#4
Robert Young Trustee Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Coronado Island Posts: 1,472	Ulli Yes! For any flavor of HD editing it will be best to have the latest, greatest system.