Why does it work? at DVinfo.net

Brad Tyrrell · December 19th, 2007, 08:50 AM

I thought I'd try pan & scan reduction to DV without the extra step of editing in a Cineform preset outputing an HD avi and resizing in an SD project.

I captured HDV with OnLocation, transcoded with HDlink then brought the CFHD avis into CS3 in a standard resolution project. I edited, resized, pan & scanned frameserved to Tmpgenc express output files for Encore and burned my DVDs. It worked.

Shouldn't I have had problems with field order? or problems using the CFHD in a SD project? Waiting for the other shoe to drop.

Marty Baggen · December 19th, 2007, 10:54 AM

Brad... please forgive me for sidetracking your thread.

Can you explain the function and advantages of the frameserve process you use?

A quick thought on your question at hand... did you output to a progressive or interlaced frame? If interlaced, on closer inspection, you may have an interlacing issue with your HDV content... but that may be difficult to spot after rescaling down to SD?

I've mixed SD and HDV materials in Premiere 2.0 without any problems...that's with a progressive output though... haven't tried the same to DVD.

David Newman · December 19th, 2007, 10:54 AM

No problems if you do it all correctly. Clearly you have.

Marty Baggen · December 19th, 2007, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Newman

Not if you it all correctly. Clearly you have.

I don't have my decoder ring... what does this mean?

Carl Middleton · December 19th, 2007, 11:37 AM

It means he didn't have problems because he didn't screw up. ;)

David Newman · December 19th, 2007, 12:24 PM

Sorry about my cryptic response. :)

Brad Tyrrell · December 19th, 2007, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Baggen

Brad... please forgive me for sidetracking your thread.

Can you explain the function and advantages of the frameserve process you use?

I find that Debugmode (free) framserves nicely to Tmpgenc using a form of YUV. It saves time and space. I see that Cineform has incorporated some of the Tsunami stuff so I guess I'll have to try that for encoding. CS3's media encoder just isn't good enough. Better than CS2, but not enough better.

I used to use Tmpgenc for resizing, but now I'm kinda hooked on pan & scan resizing in an SD project. I just thought you couldn't edit with CFHD in an SD project. I guess you can.

I'm still confused about the field order though. I take a upper first HDV, encode to a upper first CFHD, import it into a lower first DV timeline and it works. I think one of the programs is fixing it for me but I don't know which one. If I don't know, I'm afraid I'm going to mess up later.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Baggen

A quick thought on your question at hand... did you output to a progressive or interlaced frame? If interlaced, on closer inspection, you may have an interlacing issue with your HDV content... but that may be difficult to spot after rescaling down to SD?

I've mixed SD and HDV materials in Premiere 2.0 without any problems...that's with a progressive output though... haven't tried the same to DVD.

That's what I thought too. I'm not using progressive so ???

Marty Baggen · December 19th, 2007, 12:51 PM

Brad... probably the only way to reveal any field issues is to view a DVD on a CRT.

Have you tried reversing the field dominance of your HDV clip in your timeline... notice any change? Is there a lot of movement in the shot?

TMPGenc rules.... It's great for rescaling, deinterlacing, etc... I love it.

I still don't understand the frameserve process... I guess I need to do some research to learn about it.

For the pan and scan capability, After Effects is my first choice.

David: I love to harass your typing..... My theory is that you Think @ 300wpm, and Type @ 60wpm! Your presence here is invaluable, I hope you don't mind an occasional jab.

Brad Tyrrell · December 19th, 2007, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Baggen

Brad... probably the only way to reveal any field issues is to view a DVD on a CRT.

Actually, one of the nice things about editing HD in a DV timeline is that I can preview on a standard monitor with the 1394 out.

But, - what started all this was that I made a bunch of DVDs for a client. I previewed the DVDs on a standalone player and crt, didn't see any problems, and sent them out. It was later that I started thinking that something wasn't right and was going to come back and bite me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Baggen

Have you tried reversing the field dominance of your HDV clip in your timeline... notice any change? Is there a lot of movement in the shot?

Yep, It actually looks worse when I open in a upper first DV project, - well in preview anyway. No stuttering, but the resolution is down, - strange.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Baggen

TMPGenc rules.... It's great for rescaling, deinterlacing, etc... I love it.

Agreed. Now I have to find out how much TMPGenc is in ApectHD It'd be nice to output to Encore from Premiere again.

December 19th, 2007, 08:50 AM	#1
Brad Tyrrell Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Morristown, New Jersey Posts: 249	Why does it work? I thought I'd try pan & scan reduction to DV without the extra step of editing in a Cineform preset outputing an HD avi and resizing in an SD project. I captured HDV with OnLocation, transcoded with HDlink then brought the CFHD avis into CS3 in a standard resolution project. I edited, resized, pan & scanned frameserved to Tmpgenc express output files for Encore and burned my DVDs. It worked. Shouldn't I have had problems with field order? or problems using the CFHD in a SD project? Waiting for the other shoe to drop.

December 19th, 2007, 10:54 AM	#3
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	No problems if you do it all correctly. Clearly you have. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman Last edited by David Newman; December 19th, 2007 at 12:24 PM.

December 19th, 2007, 11:37 AM	#5
Carl Middleton Major Player Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Fernandina Beach, FL Posts: 562	It means he didn't have problems because he didn't screw up. ;) __________________ Carl Middleton Whizkid Mediaworks

December 19th, 2007, 12:24 PM	#6
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Sorry about my cryptic response. :) __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

December 19th, 2007, 10:54 AM	#2
Marty Baggen Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: monroe, or Posts: 572	Brad... please forgive me for sidetracking your thread. Can you explain the function and advantages of the frameserve process you use? A quick thought on your question at hand... did you output to a progressive or interlaced frame? If interlaced, on closer inspection, you may have an interlacing issue with your HDV content... but that may be difficult to spot after rescaling down to SD? I've mixed SD and HDV materials in Premiere 2.0 without any problems...that's with a progressive output though... haven't tried the same to DVD.

December 19th, 2007, 12:51 PM	#8
Marty Baggen Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: monroe, or Posts: 572	Brad... probably the only way to reveal any field issues is to view a DVD on a CRT. Have you tried reversing the field dominance of your HDV clip in your timeline... notice any change? Is there a lot of movement in the shot? TMPGenc rules.... It's great for rescaling, deinterlacing, etc... I love it. I still don't understand the frameserve process... I guess I need to do some research to learn about it. For the pan and scan capability, After Effects is my first choice. David: I love to harass your typing..... My theory is that you Think @ 300wpm, and Type @ 60wpm! Your presence here is invaluable, I hope you don't mind an occasional jab.