XL1 firewire issues at DVinfo.net

Dylan Couper · December 9th, 2002, 07:08 PM

Is there anything at all on an XL1 camera that could affect how it works with your computer? I'm narrowing down my Firewire problem, and am looking at the camera as a possible problem source. Of course, neither of my cameras work, so I can't see it being likely, but could I have changed something on a menu that would affect it?

I've formatted and reinstalled my editing computer system and it still won't work.

Jeff Donald · December 9th, 2002, 07:29 PM

No, there are no internal or menu settings that affect FireWire.

Jeff

Paul Sedillo · December 9th, 2002, 09:24 PM

Dylan,

Have you tried hooking up your rig to another system? This will help identify if it is the camera or the computer.

Jeff Donald · December 9th, 2002, 09:37 PM

I don't want to scare you, but I will suggest this. It would be possible for a bad cable to short your FireWire connection on the camera end. Can you try you camera on Keith's system just to check that all is OK?

Jeff

Ken Tanaka · December 10th, 2002, 12:54 AM

Dylan,
It's also very possible for your computer's Firewire port to short, particularly if it's a 6-pin (powered) port. I had a PowerBook port blow early this year for no apparent reason. (You're using a PC, aren't you?)

Dylan Couper · December 10th, 2002, 01:46 AM

Yes, using a PC.
Paul, I'm going to try one of the cameras on a Mac later this week.

Ken, this is the second firewire card I've tried after the first one stopped working. Would you know how I could test this? Windows says it is working perfectly.

Jeff, that's a scary thought. I'll be testing the cameras shortly. I only used one of them for dumping to and printing from the PC. Once it stopped working, I tried the other. If this is the case, I probably don't want to know what it would cost to fix, do I?

Ken Tanaka · December 10th, 2002, 02:07 AM

Short of doing what you're doing, no I really don't know how to test it. Did it come with any diagnostic software? My PowerBook's problem was pretty easy to diagnose. Apple includes a utility called System Profiler which inventories everything on the computer, including all hardware. It told me that Firewire be bye-bye. Windows' general harware diagnostics are (obviously) not terribly reliable since they only really look for the address and interrupts to respond.

Honestly, this was one of the situations that finally made me decide to try a Mac. After working in the Windows environment since its creation my video editing hobby was continually confounded by Premiere inexplicably blowing-up in the middle of an edit or one of a seemingly endless string of 1394 cards suddenly failing to operate on the most powerful workstations (dual processor Dell Precisions) I could buy. Since I was working at the time I didn't have much time or desire to devote myself to continually being a PC technician; I just wanted to edit. When I was ready to retire I decided that life was too short for this. Five Macs later I couldn't be happier.

I really don't mean to use your frustrating predicament to editorialize. I know that the Windows environment can provide a stable platform for video editing. But it really does require ongoing diligence. I hope you can track this bugaboo down. I know how maddening this can be.

Simon Plissi · December 10th, 2002, 02:33 AM

Whilst we're on the subject of FW I'll ask a quick question. Ever since I used FW on a B&W G3 connected to my XL1 I noticed some slight "sparking" when connecting the FW cable to the camera. I was told at the time that this was quite common, and 4 years down the line I've had no ill effects. But, it's not just me, is it?

Ken Tanaka · December 10th, 2002, 02:46 AM

Simon,
It could be static discharge. Since the camera uses a 4-pin (signal-only) connection there isn't any power transferred from the computer to the camera. If it is static I would imagine that it's being harmlesssly grounded through the cable's internal sleeve to your G3's chassis. Still, it's a bit rattling. It's never happened to me, at least that I've noticed.

Simon Plissi · December 10th, 2002, 03:03 AM

Ken,
Yes, it must be static as the 4-pin carries no power. Yet, it scarred the hell out of me when I first saw it. I got on the phone straight away and was told not worry as it can happen.
I never see it on my 6-pin to 6-pin cable when connecting the burner. Must be because this one is a powered cable and the burner is also plugged into the mains.

Oh well, just an observation on the wonders of the Emmy award winning FireWire. ;-)

Dylan Couper · December 16th, 2002, 04:04 PM

Someone suggested that I just hook one of my cameras up to the other directly using a DV to DV cable. So I did, put them in VCR mode, and still nothing happened. The "DV IN" still blinked in each VF. I tried setting it into record mode and the big red "CHECK CONNECTION..." message blinked.
Did I miss something while hooking them up, or is this a pretty good bet that my DV ports on each camera are fried?

Jeff Donald · December 16th, 2002, 08:10 PM

Yes, it seems to be looking that way. I would be sending one of the cameras off to Canon at this point and see what they say. A final test would be to use a known good cable and computer and see if it recognizes the camera.

Jeff

Dylan Couper · December 16th, 2002, 08:34 PM

Argh.

Anyone have the number of Canon Canada, or the best place for me to send one to? I don't suppose Vancouver has a repair center?

I'm thinking that repairs to both cameras will have to be at least $250 each (up to who knows how much). For that money I can buy a miniDV camera to use as a deck. I'll probably go this way instead of getting the DV ports fixed if it turns out to be more expensive than that. What do you guys think?

Jeff Donald · December 16th, 2002, 08:43 PM

I agree, put the money towards a new deck. If and when you do decide to get one fixed I'd do the XL1S. It will have the best resale value should you ever decide to sell one.

Jeff

Dylan Couper · December 16th, 2002, 08:59 PM

Can't wait to tell my fiancee the good news that I get to buy a new toy. I'm SURE (sarcasm) she'll believe the reasons why. :)
Both my cameras are XL1's, not XL1s's. Typo on my part in a previous post.

I'm going to post a new topic in the business section on who is responsible for killing my cameras.

December 9th, 2002, 07:08 PM	#1
Dylan Couper Wrangler Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia Posts: 8,314	XL1 firewire issues Is there anything at all on an XL1 camera that could affect how it works with your computer? I'm narrowing down my Firewire problem, and am looking at the camera as a possible problem source. Of course, neither of my cameras work, so I can't see it being likely, but could I have changed something on a menu that would affect it? I've formatted and reinstalled my editing computer system and it still won't work.

December 9th, 2002, 09:24 PM	#3
Paul Sedillo Major Player Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 607	Dylan, Have you tried hooking up your rig to another system? This will help identify if it is the camera or the computer. __________________ Paul Sedillo Image::Studio http://www.image-studio.com Houston, Texas

December 10th, 2002, 12:54 AM	#5
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Dylan, It's also very possible for your computer's Firewire port to short, particularly if it's a 6-pin (powered) port. I had a PowerBook port blow early this year for no apparent reason. (You're using a PC, aren't you?) __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

December 10th, 2002, 02:07 AM	#7
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Short of doing what you're doing, no I really don't know how to test it. Did it come with any diagnostic software? My PowerBook's problem was pretty easy to diagnose. Apple includes a utility called System Profiler which inventories everything on the computer, including all hardware. It told me that Firewire be bye-bye. Windows' general harware diagnostics are (obviously) not terribly reliable since they only really look for the address and interrupts to respond. Honestly, this was one of the situations that finally made me decide to try a Mac. After working in the Windows environment since its creation my video editing hobby was continually confounded by Premiere inexplicably blowing-up in the middle of an edit or one of a seemingly endless string of 1394 cards suddenly failing to operate on the most powerful workstations (dual processor Dell Precisions) I could buy. Since I was working at the time I didn't have much time or desire to devote myself to continually being a PC technician; I just wanted to edit. When I was ready to retire I decided that life was too short for this. Five Macs later I couldn't be happier. I really don't mean to use your frustrating predicament to editorialize. I know that the Windows environment can provide a stable platform for video editing. But it really does require ongoing diligence. I hope you can track this bugaboo down. I know how maddening this can be. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

December 10th, 2002, 02:46 AM	#9
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Simon, It could be static discharge. Since the camera uses a 4-pin (signal-only) connection there isn't any power transferred from the computer to the camera. If it is static I would imagine that it's being harmlesssly grounded through the cable's internal sleeve to your G3's chassis. Still, it's a bit rattling. It's never happened to me, at least that I've noticed. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

December 9th, 2002, 07:29 PM	#2
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	No, there are no internal or menu settings that affect FireWire. Jeff

December 9th, 2002, 09:37 PM	#4
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	I don't want to scare you, but I will suggest this. It would be possible for a bad cable to short your FireWire connection on the camera end. Can you try you camera on Keith's system just to check that all is OK? Jeff

December 10th, 2002, 01:46 AM	#6
Dylan Couper Wrangler Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia Posts: 8,314	Yes, using a PC. Paul, I'm going to try one of the cameras on a Mac later this week. Ken, this is the second firewire card I've tried after the first one stopped working. Would you know how I could test this? Windows says it is working perfectly. Jeff, that's a scary thought. I'll be testing the cameras shortly. I only used one of them for dumping to and printing from the PC. Once it stopped working, I tried the other. If this is the case, I probably don't want to know what it would cost to fix, do I?

December 10th, 2002, 02:33 AM	#8
Simon Plissi Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London, UK Posts: 105	Whilst we're on the subject of FW I'll ask a quick question. Ever since I used FW on a B&W G3 connected to my XL1 I noticed some slight "sparking" when connecting the FW cable to the camera. I was told at the time that this was quite common, and 4 years down the line I've had no ill effects. But, it's not just me, is it?

December 10th, 2002, 03:03 AM	#10
Simon Plissi Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London, UK Posts: 105	Ken, Yes, it must be static as the 4-pin carries no power. Yet, it scarred the hell out of me when I first saw it. I got on the phone straight away and was told not worry as it can happen. I never see it on my 6-pin to 6-pin cable when connecting the burner. Must be because this one is a powered cable and the burner is also plugged into the mains. Oh well, just an observation on the wonders of the Emmy award winning FireWire. ;-)

December 16th, 2002, 04:04 PM	#11
Dylan Couper Wrangler Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia Posts: 8,314	pain pain pain Someone suggested that I just hook one of my cameras up to the other directly using a DV to DV cable. So I did, put them in VCR mode, and still nothing happened. The "DV IN" still blinked in each VF. I tried setting it into record mode and the big red "CHECK CONNECTION..." message blinked. Did I miss something while hooking them up, or is this a pretty good bet that my DV ports on each camera are fried?

December 16th, 2002, 08:10 PM	#12
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	Yes, it seems to be looking that way. I would be sending one of the cameras off to Canon at this point and see what they say. A final test would be to use a known good cable and computer and see if it recognizes the camera. Jeff

December 16th, 2002, 08:34 PM	#13
Dylan Couper Wrangler Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia Posts: 8,314	Argh. Anyone have the number of Canon Canada, or the best place for me to send one to? I don't suppose Vancouver has a repair center? I'm thinking that repairs to both cameras will have to be at least $250 each (up to who knows how much). For that money I can buy a miniDV camera to use as a deck. I'll probably go this way instead of getting the DV ports fixed if it turns out to be more expensive than that. What do you guys think?

December 16th, 2002, 08:43 PM	#14
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	I agree, put the money towards a new deck. If and when you do decide to get one fixed I'd do the XL1S. It will have the best resale value should you ever decide to sell one. Jeff

December 16th, 2002, 08:59 PM	#15
Dylan Couper Wrangler Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia Posts: 8,314	Can't wait to tell my fiancee the good news that I get to buy a new toy. I'm SURE (sarcasm) she'll believe the reasons why. :) Both my cameras are XL1's, not XL1s's. Typo on my part in a previous post. I'm going to post a new topic in the business section on who is responsible for killing my cameras.