Colors suddenly invert to a negative image!! (XL1) at DVinfo.net

Jeff Pelletier · October 16th, 2002, 05:53 PM

The colors on my XL1 have twice now, after several hours of shooting, suddenly inverted. At least I think they invert - they dramatically change anyway, to look like a negative image. I then had to turn off my camera, wait a few seconds, and turn it back on. When I turn it back on everything's fine, and the white balance goes right back to normal..

My camera generally has no problem holding on to a manual white balance setting. What's most curious is that I don't have to re-white balance after turning my camera off and on again. This leads me to believe that whatever it is that controls white balance is not involved, but perhaps a more serious problem with the CCDs themselves - Unless of course it has in fact lost the white balance in this case and defaulted to the indoor preset which happens to look exactly the same; haven't had a chance to really experiment.. Sorry, don't mean to confuse.

A little more background: The camera's about 2 years old now, warranty is up, and I've never had it serviced (although I plan on doing so with the immediately close of my current contract!). The problem has so far been less of an inconvenience than being cameraless for 6-8 weeks would be (to send it from Vancouver, BC, out East for service).

Not sure if this issue has ever been addressed (I hope I'm not alone), couldn't find it anywhere. Please help my baby!

Jeff

Ken Tanaka · October 16th, 2002, 06:07 PM

Hello Jeff,

I really don't know what's going on but perhaps by asking a few questions the community here can help track it down.

When this phenomenon occurs does it only appear in the viewfinder or is the funky image also recorded to tape?

Are you using the standard or b&w viewfinder?

Are you running off standard battery power during long shoots or are you using another power source?

This smells like either a heat or power chain issue, but mine is certainly not a qualified engineering opinion.

Regardless of what we can surmise you might as well get the cam serviced pronto and make sure Canon service is aware of this issue.

Chris Hurd · October 16th, 2002, 07:08 PM

Surely the turnaround for Canon Canada is less than six or eight weeks?

If the anamoly is recorded to tape, your only recourse is factory service. Should be sent in at least once per year anyway. Be sure to include a tape showing the problem.

Jeff Donald · October 16th, 2002, 09:36 PM

I had that happen to an old favorite 2/3 inch CCD camera, Panasonic 200CLE. I ended up sending it to Panasonic after in did it twice. I don't think it recorded to tape in my instance. It was heat related, cracked circuit board. When the camera got hot enough the crack around a sodier would expand and break a connection. How long is your camera on before it happens?

Jeff

Andre De Clercq · October 17th, 2002, 03:14 AM

Chris' question is very important to verify (recorded to tape). But keep in mind to playback the tape on another DV VCR or output it through 1394 to a NLE. "Color inversion" is often reported when the luma (Y) signal fails. This often happens in your Y/C encoder. In that case the viewfinder will still be OK, the 1394 output will be OK, the recorded data will be OK.

Jeff Pelletier · October 24th, 2002, 10:44 PM

Wel, let's see...

Ken:
Yes, this occurs in the viewfinder as well - I have the stock color one. I'm not sure if it records to DV tape or not, at least it's never happened while I've been shooting to DV. My job requires me to shoot directly to VHS (via RCA out), which I view on a monitor. I've always been running off A/C when it happened.

Jeff:
Over-heating was my first thought as well, but today (coincidentally) it happened again, and after only about 10 minutes of being on.

Dre:
You raise a a good point.. maybe it's just in the output of the video - both RCA and viewfinder. But that doesn't solve my problem cause I rarely shoot right to DV.

Any other ideas? Thanks all.

Jeff

Jeff Donald · October 25th, 2002, 05:35 AM

It sounds like it's getting worse. Time to send it in.

Jeff

Jeff Pelletier · October 25th, 2002, 07:40 PM

Yea.. I think I'll just buy an XL1s body and then fix and sell this one.

Thanks for all the help.
Jeff

October 16th, 2002, 05:53 PM	#1
Jeff Pelletier Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 25	Colors suddenly invert to a negative image!! (XL1) The colors on my XL1 have twice now, after several hours of shooting, suddenly inverted. At least I think they invert - they dramatically change anyway, to look like a negative image. I then had to turn off my camera, wait a few seconds, and turn it back on. When I turn it back on everything's fine, and the white balance goes right back to normal.. My camera generally has no problem holding on to a manual white balance setting. What's most curious is that I don't have to re-white balance after turning my camera off and on again. This leads me to believe that whatever it is that controls white balance is not involved, but perhaps a more serious problem with the CCDs themselves - Unless of course it has in fact lost the white balance in this case and defaulted to the indoor preset which happens to look exactly the same; haven't had a chance to really experiment.. Sorry, don't mean to confuse. A little more background: The camera's about 2 years old now, warranty is up, and I've never had it serviced (although I plan on doing so with the immediately close of my current contract!). The problem has so far been less of an inconvenience than being cameraless for 6-8 weeks would be (to send it from Vancouver, BC, out East for service). Not sure if this issue has ever been addressed (I hope I'm not alone), couldn't find it anywhere. Please help my baby! Jeff

October 16th, 2002, 06:07 PM	#2
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Hello Jeff, I really don't know what's going on but perhaps by asking a few questions the community here can help track it down. When this phenomenon occurs does it only appear in the viewfinder or is the funky image also recorded to tape? Are you using the standard or b&w viewfinder? Are you running off standard battery power during long shoots or are you using another power source? This smells like either a heat or power chain issue, but mine is certainly not a qualified engineering opinion. Regardless of what we can surmise you might as well get the cam serviced pronto and make sure Canon service is aware of this issue. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

October 16th, 2002, 07:08 PM	#3
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	Surely the turnaround for Canon Canada is less than six or eight weeks? If the anamoly is recorded to tape, your only recourse is factory service. Should be sent in at least once per year anyway. Be sure to include a tape showing the problem. __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

October 16th, 2002, 09:36 PM	#4
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	I had that happen to an old favorite 2/3 inch CCD camera, Panasonic 200CLE. I ended up sending it to Panasonic after in did it twice. I don't think it recorded to tape in my instance. It was heat related, cracked circuit board. When the camera got hot enough the crack around a sodier would expand and break a connection. How long is your camera on before it happens? Jeff

October 17th, 2002, 03:14 AM	#5
Andre De Clercq Major Player Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 804	Chris' question is very important to verify (recorded to tape). But keep in mind to playback the tape on another DV VCR or output it through 1394 to a NLE. "Color inversion" is often reported when the luma (Y) signal fails. This often happens in your Y/C encoder. In that case the viewfinder will still be OK, the 1394 output will be OK, the recorded data will be OK.

October 24th, 2002, 10:44 PM	#6
Jeff Pelletier Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 25	Wel, let's see... Ken: Yes, this occurs in the viewfinder as well - I have the stock color one. I'm not sure if it records to DV tape or not, at least it's never happened while I've been shooting to DV. My job requires me to shoot directly to VHS (via RCA out), which I view on a monitor. I've always been running off A/C when it happened. Jeff: Over-heating was my first thought as well, but today (coincidentally) it happened again, and after only about 10 minutes of being on. Dre: You raise a a good point.. maybe it's just in the output of the video - both RCA and viewfinder. But that doesn't solve my problem cause I rarely shoot right to DV. Any other ideas? Thanks all. Jeff

October 25th, 2002, 05:35 AM	#7
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	It sounds like it's getting worse. Time to send it in. Jeff

October 25th, 2002, 07:40 PM	#8
Jeff Pelletier Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 25	Yea.. I think I'll just buy an XL1s body and then fix and sell this one. Thanks for all the help. Jeff