Rewinding & Fast Forwarding on the XL-1 at DVinfo.net

Dan Uneken · September 28th, 2002, 07:56 AM

Does anyone know whether the tape passes over the heads during rewinding & fast forwarding (without viewing the image), in other words does rewinding a tape cause wear on the heads? I know it does on certain Betacam cameras, where the tape is always in contact with the heads...

Thanks.

Josh Bass · September 28th, 2002, 08:41 AM

What I've heard is that some rewinding and fast forwarding is okay, but if you're doing it all day, every day, you should have a mini dv deck, or at least another camera. Your heads won't wear down from a moderate amount of usage, however.

Don Berube · September 28th, 2002, 12:40 PM

Hi Dan,

No, the XL1 does not keep the tape against the heads while in standard RW or FF, however, it does when you are searching back or forth in PlayBack Mode.

Don't forget that the XL1 is a very robust camera as far as electronics and tape transport.

Dan Uneken · September 28th, 2002, 12:46 PM

Brilliant! Thanks a lot!

Edward Troxel · September 29th, 2002, 01:43 PM

If it's not touching the heads somewhat, how does the counter change?

Jeff Donald · September 29th, 2002, 07:08 PM

I believe there are sensors that detect the position of the tape and sort of guesstimate the time remaining etc. It is not actually reading the data from the tape.

Jeff

Edward Troxel · September 30th, 2002, 09:31 AM

That can't be. How could it possibly know if the time-code was restarted at zero in the MIDDLE of the tape? It will go down to zero and then start at the time of the preceeding clip! It CAN'T know that based on amount of tape passed.

Don Berube · September 30th, 2002, 10:28 AM

oh geez, look what I started,,, ok guys, I regret that when I wrote my answer to this post it was like at 4am in the weeeeeee hours of the morning and I do believe that my brain was in "VCR Stop" Mode at that point in time... Let me clarify my answer, if you will.

When you are in Camera Mode, the tape is still somewhat against the heads during Rewind/ Fast Forward. If you are press VCR Stop, that causes the tape to lift off of the heads.

If you are in Playback Mode and press Stop, then either Rewind or Fast Forward, the tape is still somewhat against the heads - again, that is why you will see the TC decrease/ increase very quickly as the head that reads the TC is still somewhat against the heads.

If you are in Playback Mode and do not press Stop, but rather you press Rewind or Fast Forward, then the tapes obviously are still against the heads.

Jeff Donald · September 30th, 2002, 11:12 AM

There must be a set of sensors that detect tape position. If you put in a blank tape, the time remaining still indicates. Or a sensor for capstan movement that counts revolutions.

You can hear the tape unloading and loading from around the drum if you leave the outer door open in VCR mode and FF/RR etc.

Jeff

Mike Butler · October 9th, 2002, 06:08 PM

Right, Jeff. It will show tape remaining even on a totally blank tape with no time code; obviously it does not use time code to get this info (and it is also not precise, but it will give you an idea if you are at the beginning, end or middle of the tape)

September 28th, 2002, 07:56 AM	#1
Dan Uneken Major Player Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Andalucia, Spain Posts: 301	Rewinding & Fast Forwarding on the XL-1 Does anyone know whether the tape passes over the heads during rewinding & fast forwarding (without viewing the image), in other words does rewinding a tape cause wear on the heads? I know it does on certain Betacam cameras, where the tape is always in contact with the heads... Thanks. __________________ Film & TV locations & production Spain http://www.fotofilmvideo.com/

September 28th, 2002, 08:41 AM	#2
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	What I've heard is that some rewinding and fast forwarding is okay, but if you're doing it all day, every day, you should have a mini dv deck, or at least another camera. Your heads won't wear down from a moderate amount of usage, however. __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

September 28th, 2002, 12:40 PM	#3
Don Berube Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Boston, MA (travel frequently) Posts: 837	Hi Dan, No, the XL1 does not keep the tape against the heads while in standard RW or FF, however, it does when you are searching back or forth in PlayBack Mode. Don't forget that the XL1 is a very robust camera as far as electronics and tape transport. __________________ DONALD BERUBE - noisybrain. Productions, LLC Director Of Photography/ Producer/ Consultant http://noisybrain.com/donbio.html CREATE and NETWORK with http://www.bosfcpug.org and also http://fcpugnetwork.org

September 28th, 2002, 12:46 PM	#4
Dan Uneken Major Player Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Andalucia, Spain Posts: 301	Brilliant! Thanks a lot! __________________ Film & TV locations & production Spain http://www.fotofilmvideo.com/

September 30th, 2002, 10:28 AM	#8
Don Berube Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Boston, MA (travel frequently) Posts: 837	uggggghhhhh oh geez, look what I started,,, ok guys, I regret that when I wrote my answer to this post it was like at 4am in the weeeeeee hours of the morning and I do believe that my brain was in "VCR Stop" Mode at that point in time... Let me clarify my answer, if you will. When you are in Camera Mode, the tape is still somewhat against the heads during Rewind/ Fast Forward. If you are press VCR Stop, that causes the tape to lift off of the heads. If you are in Playback Mode and press Stop, then either Rewind or Fast Forward, the tape is still somewhat against the heads - again, that is why you will see the TC decrease/ increase very quickly as the head that reads the TC is still somewhat against the heads. If you are in Playback Mode and do not press Stop, but rather you press Rewind or Fast Forward, then the tapes obviously are still against the heads. __________________ DONALD BERUBE - noisybrain. Productions, LLC Director Of Photography/ Producer/ Consultant http://noisybrain.com/donbio.html CREATE and NETWORK with http://www.bosfcpug.org and also http://fcpugnetwork.org

September 29th, 2002, 01:43 PM	#5
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	If it's not touching the heads somewhat, how does the counter change?

September 29th, 2002, 07:08 PM	#6
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	I believe there are sensors that detect the position of the tape and sort of guesstimate the time remaining etc. It is not actually reading the data from the tape. Jeff

September 30th, 2002, 09:31 AM	#7
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	That can't be. How could it possibly know if the time-code was restarted at zero in the MIDDLE of the tape? It will go down to zero and then start at the time of the preceeding clip! It CAN'T know that based on amount of tape passed.

September 30th, 2002, 11:12 AM	#9
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	There must be a set of sensors that detect tape position. If you put in a blank tape, the time remaining still indicates. Or a sensor for capstan movement that counts revolutions. You can hear the tape unloading and loading from around the drum if you leave the outer door open in VCR mode and FF/RR etc. Jeff

October 9th, 2002, 06:08 PM	#10
Mike Butler Machinist Mate Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Southern Connecticut Posts: 644	Right, Jeff. It will show tape remaining even on a totally blank tape with no time code; obviously it does not use time code to get this info (and it is also not precise, but it will give you an idea if you are at the beginning, end or middle of the tape) __________________ I ain't straight outta Compton, I'm straight out the trailer. Cuss like a sailor, drink like a Mc. My only words of wisdom are just, "Radio Edit."