Spinning around in confusion. at DVinfo.net

Cory Moorehead · October 31st, 2004, 02:13 PM

Hey guys. Im thinking of purchasing a used XL1s for ENG work and short films I plan to do later on. Though reading through this forum im a litle worried about taking the plundge. I keep hearing about how the image is REALLY soft, and almost unusable.Then I hear other that it is fine. I need some sample video or some pics or something. Im realling edging off my seat to get one of these puppies. I mean they look great to go and do feild work, and I hear lots of good about them. Sure I could easily go with the PD150(used)...but if im going to get news or whatnot, I would not be taken seriously with a camera that small. Ya know ? If someone coul please explain this whole thing about the image being too soft and stuff...it would be much appreciated. Thanks for your time.

Sincerly,
Cory Moorehead.

Rob Lohman · October 31st, 2004, 02:15 PM

I don't think you should have to worry. The softness everyone is
referring to is usually in frame (emulated progressive) mode,
which I personally quite like for fictional work. For ENG work you
would probably want a "realistic" look, so you shoot in interlaced
which should have no problems for you in my opinion.

Cory Moorehead · October 31st, 2004, 02:24 PM

Ive heard stuff about it being a bit soft in the interlaced mode as well. That is my main thing holding me away from purchasing this camera. As well, the chips on the XL1 seem to be a lower resolution than the PD150/170. Is it really THAT big of a difference ? Is the Canon at least ant bit good for racking the focus on the fly ? Thanks for the help, much appreciated.

Scott Ellifritt · October 31st, 2004, 03:23 PM

Go to http://www.ladyxfilms.com/ and check out some of their shorts. It is an interesting concept, but they main thing is that they list the type of camera they used in their production. You can compare betweem the xl1, xl2, dvx100a, etc.

Rob Lohman · November 1st, 2004, 03:52 AM

Keep in mind though that those movies are all at webresolution
and progressive.

Cory: keep in mind that depth-of-field is a product of the imaging
size (the CCD chip size in this case) and your lens opening. I
never heard of ENG people worrying too much about that.

I have only frame mode (progressive) footage here, otherwise
I would've put some up for you in native DV. If I stumble across
some interlaced footage I'll let you know.

Cory Moorehead · November 1st, 2004, 06:09 AM

Any type of fotage would help Rob. Yeah, it depends on what we are shooting, to determine if I need to rack focus. For example we did a fundraiser on Friday and I was using the Hitachi Z2010 on my shoulder during entertainment. For example a shot I got was that I had the microphone in focus then I racked it so that the guitar platers hands on the strings were in focus. It was just beautiful.

K. Forman · November 1st, 2004, 06:22 AM

Cory- I had the XL1s, and never noticed the image being soft... unless it was due to a filter, or being slightly out of focus. If you really want to experience an XL1, try renting one. From all I have heard from others, it seems Ontario might have a few pro rental houses.

Cory Moorehead · November 1st, 2004, 03:14 PM

Unfortunatly Keith..my area is a small town and doesnt have a place to rent such expensive stuff.

K. Forman · November 1st, 2004, 03:47 PM

I feel your pain :(

Cory Moorehead · November 1st, 2004, 04:26 PM

Yeah. Plus even if I found a place to rent one, i need to save that money. Ive saved for about a year now..and im going to make a purchase..i just dont wanna choose the wrong thing..

K. Forman · November 1st, 2004, 05:27 PM

I'm in a similar area, sort of, I guess. The closest place to rent one, is about 60 miles or so, and they run about $100 a day. Sounds like a nice day excursion, if you have something to use as a test subject... we have Disney ;)

November 19th, 2004, 11:14 PM

I've been using the XL-1s for ENG for two years. I've never had an editor tell me my footage was "soft;" but I have a preset for ENG that sharpens the image to match Sony stuff. Also, and this is very important as far as I'm concerned, I use the manual servo lens and the FU/1000 EVF. I don't know how anyone can focus the manual servo lens without the B&W EVF.

October 31st, 2004, 02:13 PM	#1
Cory Moorehead Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 148	Spinning around in confusion. Hey guys. Im thinking of purchasing a used XL1s for ENG work and short films I plan to do later on. Though reading through this forum im a litle worried about taking the plundge. I keep hearing about how the image is REALLY soft, and almost unusable.Then I hear other that it is fine. I need some sample video or some pics or something. Im realling edging off my seat to get one of these puppies. I mean they look great to go and do feild work, and I hear lots of good about them. Sure I could easily go with the PD150(used)...but if im going to get news or whatnot, I would not be taken seriously with a camera that small. Ya know ? If someone coul please explain this whole thing about the image being too soft and stuff...it would be much appreciated. Thanks for your time. Sincerly, Cory Moorehead. __________________ Because im that...damn...good.

October 31st, 2004, 02:15 PM	#2
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	I don't think you should have to worry. The softness everyone is referring to is usually in frame (emulated progressive) mode, which I personally quite like for fictional work. For ENG work you would probably want a "realistic" look, so you shoot in interlaced which should have no problems for you in my opinion. __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

October 31st, 2004, 02:24 PM	#3
Cory Moorehead Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 148	Ive heard stuff about it being a bit soft in the interlaced mode as well. That is my main thing holding me away from purchasing this camera. As well, the chips on the XL1 seem to be a lower resolution than the PD150/170. Is it really THAT big of a difference ? Is the Canon at least ant bit good for racking the focus on the fly ? Thanks for the help, much appreciated. __________________ Because im that...damn...good.

November 1st, 2004, 03:52 AM	#5
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	Keep in mind though that those movies are all at webresolution and progressive. Cory: keep in mind that depth-of-field is a product of the imaging size (the CCD chip size in this case) and your lens opening. I never heard of ENG people worrying too much about that. I have only frame mode (progressive) footage here, otherwise I would've put some up for you in native DV. If I stumble across some interlaced footage I'll let you know. __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

November 1st, 2004, 06:09 AM	#6
Cory Moorehead Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 148	Any type of fotage would help Rob. Yeah, it depends on what we are shooting, to determine if I need to rack focus. For example we did a fundraiser on Friday and I was using the Hitachi Z2010 on my shoulder during entertainment. For example a shot I got was that I had the microphone in focus then I racked it so that the guitar platers hands on the strings were in focus. It was just beautiful. __________________ Because im that...damn...good.

October 31st, 2004, 03:23 PM	#4
Scott Ellifritt Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: MS Gulf Coast Posts: 146	Go to http://www.ladyxfilms.com/ and check out some of their shorts. It is an interesting concept, but they main thing is that they list the type of camera they used in their production. You can compare betweem the xl1, xl2, dvx100a, etc.

November 1st, 2004, 06:22 AM	#7
K. Forman Capt. Quirk Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Middle of the woods in Georgia Posts: 3,596	Cory- I had the XL1s, and never noticed the image being soft... unless it was due to a filter, or being slightly out of focus. If you really want to experience an XL1, try renting one. From all I have heard from others, it seems Ontario might have a few pro rental houses. __________________ www.SmokeWagonLeather.us

November 1st, 2004, 03:14 PM	#8
Cory Moorehead Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 148	Unfortunatly Keith..my area is a small town and doesnt have a place to rent such expensive stuff. __________________ Because im that...damn...good.

November 1st, 2004, 03:47 PM	#9
K. Forman Capt. Quirk Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Middle of the woods in Georgia Posts: 3,596	I feel your pain :( __________________ www.SmokeWagonLeather.us

November 1st, 2004, 04:26 PM	#10
Cory Moorehead Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 148	Yeah. Plus even if I found a place to rent one, i need to save that money. Ive saved for about a year now..and im going to make a purchase..i just dont wanna choose the wrong thing.. __________________ Because im that...damn...good.

November 1st, 2004, 05:27 PM	#11
K. Forman Capt. Quirk Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Middle of the woods in Georgia Posts: 3,596	I'm in a similar area, sort of, I guess. The closest place to rent one, is about 60 miles or so, and they run about $100 a day. Sounds like a nice day excursion, if you have something to use as a test subject... we have Disney ;) __________________ www.SmokeWagonLeather.us

November 19th, 2004, 11:14 PM	#12
Guest Posts: n/a	XL-1s for ENG I've been using the XL-1s for ENG for two years. I've never had an editor tell me my footage was "soft;" but I have a preset for ENG that sharpens the image to match Sony stuff. Also, and this is very important as far as I'm concerned, I use the manual servo lens and the FU/1000 EVF. I don't know how anyone can focus the manual servo lens without the B&W EVF.