MA-100 XLR audio adapter questions

Don Palomaki · April 13th, 2003, 06:50 PM

You wrote: "I have plugged into the MA-100 which is plugging into the Audio 2 RCA jacks on the back of the handle. "

From the bahavior you describe and your note above, sounds to me like you have the MA100 connected to the Audio 1 input, which is on the back of the handle near the video output jacks (see page 11 of the manual).

The Audio 2 input is on the side of the handle, see page 10 of the manual, not the back, under a rubber cover that may be marked "Audio 2".

Kevin Burnfield · April 13th, 2003, 07:30 PM

UUUUGGGGGGGG ------

Don, I bow before your genius....

My fault was following the directions included in with the MA-100 which obviously were for the XL1 unit.

Gratitude abounds in your direction !!!!

I don't think I even noticed that jack on the side.

Yes, I now look in the XL1S manual and see the jacks shown in plain sight.

You da' man, Don.

Don Palomaki · April 14th, 2003, 03:53 AM

FWIW: The Audio RCA jack locations are the same on the XL1. I suspect that the MA-100 shows the Audio 1 conection beacuse that is the more common configuration.

Christopher Hughes · April 14th, 2003, 02:02 PM

Glad to see you have finally got it figured out. You had me stumped, until the Eagle Eye Don spotted the BACK of handle.
I guessed you was trying to put different mic sources through Audio 1. Nice to see you have found audio 2.

So I guess you should have no problems, until you come to try and capture 4 tracks!

Kevin Burnfield · April 14th, 2003, 03:02 PM

LOL! actually, it worked out fine that we didn't have 4 tracks...

We were hired to shoot part of a documentary which covered the art gallery opening of an artist. We did pre-opening interviews and we shot during the opening.

The Sennheiser we used did a great job of capturing the surrounding sound and the subject that was talking since we weren't far from them.

I can now say that I have a better understanding of the setting up of the Audio 1 and 2 systems of the XL1S then I ever thought possible.

Yes, Eagle Eye Don is the man of the hour. I hope his mom gives him an extra big slice of cake for desert all week long!

I would like to see someone add that little detail about where the AUDIO 2 jacks are located on the XL1 and XL1S to the pages here that have the instructions on how to set-up the sound in the menus and such.

Ed Frazier · April 14th, 2003, 05:49 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Kevin Burnfield :
I would like to see someone add that little detail about where the AUDIO 2 jacks are located on the XL1 and XL1S to the pages here that have the instructions on how to set-up the sound in the menus and such. -->>>

Kevin, detailed audio configurations are explained on this site. Take a look here http://www.dvinfo.net/canon/articles.php#audio

Kevin Burnfield · April 15th, 2003, 07:42 AM

Thanks Ed.

My brain is shot this week... we shot interviews till 2am last night.

That's my story--- I'm sticking with it.

Steve Vandergriff · April 21st, 2003, 08:06 AM

I just bought an MA-100 second hand, and don't have any documentation for it. I've searched the web but can't find any; I'm not sure if any documentation for the MA-100 even exists...

My question though is this: I noticed a power cable that connects from the MA-100 into the back of the XL1-s; what exactly is this for? Does this provide phantom power to the XLR connectors, or does it serve some other purpose?

Regards,

-Steve Vandergriff

Don Palomaki · April 21st, 2003, 05:33 PM

The power cable plugs in to the 5 VDC jack on the back of the handle. it provides power for the electronics in the MA-100. It must be plugged in for the MA-100 to work. Also, the MA-100 must be pluggerd in to the RCA audio jacks.

The MA-100 does NOT provide phantom power for a microphone.

Also, the MA-100 should be limited to MIC level inputs. It starts to clip at around -10 dBV inpout signal. DO NOT use it with line level signals.

Robert Castiglione · April 22nd, 2003, 04:04 AM

Can I just say that I completely agree that you cant really use the MA100 for a line level signal.

I tried this recently and needless to say the sound is not really usable.

I admit that I have pretty much given up on recording to the XL1 and use a DAT to record my sound.

Rob Castiglione

Robert Castiglione · April 22nd, 2003, 04:09 AM

The last posting concerning the MA 100 prompts me to ask the following question.

Is it possible to record to the XL1 at all using a line level source and get broadcast quality sound? Is this just a problem for the MA100?

I now record to DAT and only use the camera as a guide track as suggested by Jay Rose in one of his excellent books (and eventually will buy one of those amazing nifty looking Sound Devices Hard Drives which is coming out soon).

Rob Castiglione

Don Palomaki · April 22nd, 2003, 04:23 AM

One can use an in-line attenuator to reduce line level signals to around -35 dBV and then use the MIC ATT setting. However, many mixers and wireless system do have MIC level output capability that works with the MA-100.

While not a prefessional DAT-quality record section, the XL1 audio is quite good (overall better that other camcorders in its price range) and easy to use - once one learns it. And it certainly can reduces the amount of gear one has to haul in the field.

It all depends on the details of the audio requirement for the shoot.

Jeff Donald · April 22nd, 2003, 04:27 AM

The MA-100 and MA-200 are intended for microphone inputs. The power supply is needed for the mic preamps in the MA-100/200. If you need to record line levels, bypass the MA-100/200 and input directly into the RCA inputs. I do this fairly often with good results. As always I monitor the audio levels to avoid peaks, using the built-in record level indicators.

Don Palomaki · April 22nd, 2003, 04:41 AM

Two options for line level input with the MA-100:

Use an inline attenuator to reduce the line level to around -35 dBV and use MIC ATT setting on the Audio 1 input. Shure and AT offer these devices as does Markertek. (Use MIC ATT setting for lower noise floor.)

Alternatively with line level output, you could use a balancd to unbalanced adapter then also can pad the signal down to about -10 dBV and connect directly to the Audio 1 (or Audio 2 for 12-bit recording) input. You can mount these barrel adapters on the MA-100. Markertek carries these products, as will most professional music/audio dealers.

"Broadcasty quality" is a nearly maningless term given that virtually anything can be broadcast - consider the average used car dealer ad on late night TV.

Steve Vandergriff · April 22nd, 2003, 07:03 AM

I'm still trying to figure out exactly what's inside the MA-100 that requires power from the camera in the first place.

-Steve Vandergriff

April 14th, 2003, 05:49 PM	#141
Ed Frazier Major Player Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Las Cruces, NM Posts: 343	<<<-- Originally posted by Kevin Burnfield : I would like to see someone add that little detail about where the AUDIO 2 jacks are located on the XL1 and XL1S to the pages here that have the instructions on how to set-up the sound in the menus and such. -->>> Kevin, detailed audio configurations are explained on this site. Take a look here http://www.dvinfo.net/canon/articles.php#audio __________________ Ed Frazier

April 21st, 2003, 08:06 AM	#143
Steve Vandergriff New Boot Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 5	MA-100 question I just bought an MA-100 second hand, and don't have any documentation for it. I've searched the web but can't find any; I'm not sure if any documentation for the MA-100 even exists... My question though is this: I noticed a power cable that connects from the MA-100 into the back of the XL1-s; what exactly is this for? Does this provide phantom power to the XLR connectors, or does it serve some other purpose? Regards, -Steve Vandergriff

April 22nd, 2003, 04:04 AM	#145
Robert Castiglione Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Fremantle, Western Australia Posts: 253	MA 100 for line level source Can I just say that I completely agree that you cant really use the MA100 for a line level signal. I tried this recently and needless to say the sound is not really usable. I admit that I have pretty much given up on recording to the XL1 and use a DAT to record my sound. Rob Castiglione

April 22nd, 2003, 04:09 AM	#146
Robert Castiglione Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Fremantle, Western Australia Posts: 253	Using Xl1 for line level source The last posting concerning the MA 100 prompts me to ask the following question. Is it possible to record to the XL1 at all using a line level source and get broadcast quality sound? Is this just a problem for the MA100? I now record to DAT and only use the camera as a guide track as suggested by Jay Rose in one of his excellent books (and eventually will buy one of those amazing nifty looking Sound Devices Hard Drives which is coming out soon). Rob Castiglione

April 22nd, 2003, 04:27 AM	#148
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	The MA-100 and MA-200 are intended for microphone inputs. The power supply is needed for the mic preamps in the MA-100/200. If you need to record line levels, bypass the MA-100/200 and input directly into the RCA inputs. I do this fairly often with good results. As always I monitor the audio levels to avoid peaks, using the built-in record level indicators. __________________ Jeff Donald Carpe Diem Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Where to Buy? From the best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

April 13th, 2003, 06:50 PM	#136
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,487	You wrote: "I have plugged into the MA-100 which is plugging into the Audio 2 RCA jacks on the back of the handle. " From the bahavior you describe and your note above, sounds to me like you have the MA100 connected to the Audio 1 input, which is on the back of the handle near the video output jacks (see page 11 of the manual). The Audio 2 input is on the side of the handle, see page 10 of the manual, not the back, under a rubber cover that may be marked "Audio 2".

April 13th, 2003, 07:30 PM	#137
Kevin Burnfield Major Player Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Princeton, NJ Posts: 363	UUUUGGGGGGGG ------ Don, I bow before your genius.... My fault was following the directions included in with the MA-100 which obviously were for the XL1 unit. Gratitude abounds in your direction !!!! I don't think I even noticed that jack on the side. Yes, I now look in the XL1S manual and see the jacks shown in plain sight. You da' man, Don.

April 14th, 2003, 03:53 AM	#138
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,487	FWIW: The Audio RCA jack locations are the same on the XL1. I suspect that the MA-100 shows the Audio 1 conection beacuse that is the more common configuration.

April 14th, 2003, 02:02 PM	#139
Christopher Hughes Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Sunderland, England (y Merida, Mexico) Posts: 269	Glad to see you have finally got it figured out. You had me stumped, until the Eagle Eye Don spotted the BACK of handle. I guessed you was trying to put different mic sources through Audio 1. Nice to see you have found audio 2. So I guess you should have no problems, until you come to try and capture 4 tracks!

April 14th, 2003, 03:02 PM	#140
Kevin Burnfield Major Player Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Princeton, NJ Posts: 363	LOL! actually, it worked out fine that we didn't have 4 tracks... We were hired to shoot part of a documentary which covered the art gallery opening of an artist. We did pre-opening interviews and we shot during the opening. The Sennheiser we used did a great job of capturing the surrounding sound and the subject that was talking since we weren't far from them. I can now say that I have a better understanding of the setting up of the Audio 1 and 2 systems of the XL1S then I ever thought possible. Yes, Eagle Eye Don is the man of the hour. I hope his mom gives him an extra big slice of cake for desert all week long! I would like to see someone add that little detail about where the AUDIO 2 jacks are located on the XL1 and XL1S to the pages here that have the instructions on how to set-up the sound in the menus and such.

April 15th, 2003, 07:42 AM	#142
Kevin Burnfield Major Player Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Princeton, NJ Posts: 363	Thanks Ed. My brain is shot this week... we shot interviews till 2am last night. That's my story--- I'm sticking with it.

April 21st, 2003, 05:33 PM	#144
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,487	The power cable plugs in to the 5 VDC jack on the back of the handle. it provides power for the electronics in the MA-100. It must be plugged in for the MA-100 to work. Also, the MA-100 must be pluggerd in to the RCA audio jacks. The MA-100 does NOT provide phantom power for a microphone. Also, the MA-100 should be limited to MIC level inputs. It starts to clip at around -10 dBV inpout signal. DO NOT use it with line level signals.

April 22nd, 2003, 04:23 AM	#147
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,487	One can use an in-line attenuator to reduce line level signals to around -35 dBV and then use the MIC ATT setting. However, many mixers and wireless system do have MIC level output capability that works with the MA-100. While not a prefessional DAT-quality record section, the XL1 audio is quite good (overall better that other camcorders in its price range) and easy to use - once one learns it. And it certainly can reduces the amount of gear one has to haul in the field. It all depends on the details of the audio requirement for the shoot.

April 22nd, 2003, 04:41 AM	#149
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,487	Two options for line level input with the MA-100: Use an inline attenuator to reduce the line level to around -35 dBV and use MIC ATT setting on the Audio 1 input. Shure and AT offer these devices as does Markertek. (Use MIC ATT setting for lower noise floor.) Alternatively with line level output, you could use a balancd to unbalanced adapter then also can pad the signal down to about -10 dBV and connect directly to the Audio 1 (or Audio 2 for 12-bit recording) input. You can mount these barrel adapters on the MA-100. Markertek carries these products, as will most professional music/audio dealers. "Broadcasty quality" is a nearly maningless term given that virtually anything can be broadcast - consider the average used car dealer ad on late night TV.

April 22nd, 2003, 07:03 AM	#150
Steve Vandergriff New Boot Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 5	I'm still trying to figure out exactly what's inside the MA-100 that requires power from the camera in the first place. -Steve Vandergriff