Focus at DVinfo.net

Jed Stone · January 4th, 2004, 12:17 AM

Hi
Doing some surf footage this weekend for the first time and focusing was a b1tch, The light levels here in the UK are not that good this time of year, which happens to correspond with the best surf. I can't afford the cost of the FU1000 and was thinking of trying some other method to allow precise focusing. I have the MA200 and was wondering if using a small external CRT TV would be any good, I know powering & setting up etc would be a bit more complicated, but has anyone else done anything like this?

Jed Stone · January 4th, 2004, 02:59 AM

OK, I think I did not put enough information on my post, when looking through the viewfinder it was really hard to focus correctly, the sea was grey, the sky was grey (typical English wintertime). Being short sighted and wearing glasses doesn't help much either. The resultant footage was constanty blurring out as I couldn't see the focus that well when shooting. so now thinking of something larger to view whilst shooting. I looked at some threads and they mentioned the verizoom external camera mounted TFT screen, cool, but they are not available outside the USA. Does anyone know of a similar item that is available for UK residents?

G. Randy Brown · January 4th, 2004, 11:13 AM

I too can not see well enough to focus with the viewfinder. However I've learned to trust the XL1s' auto focus button. I run everything manually but when I frame my shot I push the (temporary) auto focus button and have always been happy with the results (in post). As far as your question about using a small TV as a monitor...I used to but then I bought a (cheap $300) shoe mount LCD monitor off of Ebay and it works fine for framing shots but I plan on buying a "real" one before too long. I would search this site for, say, "shoe mount" or "camera mount monitor" for reccomendations.
Good luck,
Randy

Ken Tanaka · January 4th, 2004, 01:04 PM

Indeed, Jed, you are certainly not alone in your difficulty. The standard color viewfinder is just too coarse to facilitate consistently crisp focus by eye alone.

Randy's suggestion is a good one when using the standard 16x Auto lens in manual focus mode.

1. Frame your subject.
2. Zoom in to the main portion of the subject.
3. Press the auto focus button on the lens' barrel to snap focus (not to change from manual focus)
4. Zoom back out to reframe your subject.

As Wayne Orr, a fellow member here, often notes in his signature, "If it was easy they'd get a relative to do it.".

Jed Stone · January 4th, 2004, 02:39 PM

Thank you kind sirs for your recommedations, will try that out next time the surf picks up (If it ever does)

Regards

Jed

P.S
shot a Christening tonight and had the lens in manual and focused in on the Vicar, really clear, but maybe it was the low light in the Church, or are my eyes getting too bad? but it did seem to drift in and out slightly. Maybe it was my eyes? will let you know when I get it into final cut Pro

TTFN

P.P.S
This is a truly magnificent forum, have been searching for an XL one for quite some time, stumbled upon it accidentaly :-))

Ken Tanaka · January 4th, 2004, 03:23 PM

Quote:

shot a Christening tonight and had the lens in manual and focused in on the Vicar, really clear, but maybe it was the low light in the Church, or are my eyes getting too bad? but it did seem to drift in and out slightly. Maybe it was my eyes? will let you know when I get it into final cut Pro

One additional remark here, Jed. Your eyes may not be fooling you. If you do not also have the camera's exposure in Manual mode the focus may, indeed, be drifting even though the lens is in manual focus.

Realize that if you are using the shutter speed-priority (Tv) program the camera will be adjusting the iris to compensate for the speed you've set. Your depth of field will vary slightly as that iris opens and closes. Consequently the crispness of focus will appear to drift even though the lens is in manual focus mode.

For complete control, be sure to keep the camera's exposure mode in Manual, if you're not already doing so.

Jed Stone · January 5th, 2004, 02:58 AM

Ken
I had the camera set to M (as I always do) and did notice something as well, you know in the top left hand corner of the viewfinder there is the bar that I have always thought of as the zoom iindicator, (well it moves between W & T when I am zooming), last night it was moving itself??? the overall birghtness seemed to change occaisionaly?? I was not touching any off the controls at the time, but anyway I have just woken up and once the effects of the large quantity of Bacardi I consumed have worn off, I will look at the footage (I being the Great Uncle and Godafather it was my duty to purchase alcohol for everyone) Again thanks for the advice Sirs

Regards

Jed

BCNU

P.S
Found a 7" LCD Monitor on E-Bay for £70 (Not sure how many of those green backs that is) basicallly it is a screen for in car entertainment, will modify it and let you know if it does the job, the Neblek ones are over £400 ARGGHHHH being a self employed wannabe camerman I can't afford those sort of prices!!

Jed Stone · January 5th, 2004, 01:50 PM

well the bacardi has worn off and I have started editing, in final Cut Pro the footage is absolutely perfect (to the eyes of a non professional camerman / editor) and the focus issue I think is due to a combination of my eyes and the small viewfinder. I am still amazed at that warm fuzzy film type look of shooting in frame mmmmmmm!
Thanks for all the advice and will carry out 2 important steps

1) visit my Optician
2) when the external TFT LCD turns up will use that to frame everything

Regards

Jed

P.S
Does anyone know why the top left indicator bar moves? I wasn't zooming honest!!

G. Randy Brown · January 5th, 2004, 02:49 PM

>>and the focus issue I think is due to a combination of my eyes and the small viewfinder<<

I've found that the Bacardi can be an issue too : )
Randy

Ken Tanaka · January 5th, 2004, 03:51 PM

Jed,
Are you sure that the bar is not indicating your exposure, dark to light (as mine does)? There is a small inverted triangle in the center indicating "correct" exposure. The indicator will slide as the frame changes.

Jed Stone · January 6th, 2004, 07:19 AM

Silly me, guess it is exposure

Thanks

Jed "so much to learn" Stone

Greg Boston · January 6th, 2004, 08:15 AM

Jed,

Yes, that is what you are seeing. The exposure bar only shows up when you have the camera in full manual (M). It will disappear and be replaced by the W/T bar while zooming but will reappear shortly after you stop zooming.

You have to be careful though, as on my XL-1 you will have blown out highlights in a high contrast scene by the time the exposure meter is centered. Of course, this gets back to the basic rule of proper lighting, especially in digital video which doesn't handle high contrast ratios very well.

That being said, you might want to strive to keep the exposure a little to the left of center. And, it you haven't already done so, turn on the zebra bars to show you those hot spots in your frame.

Good luck,

January 4th, 2004, 12:17 AM	#1
Jed Stone New Boot Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 13	Focus Hi Doing some surf footage this weekend for the first time and focusing was a b1tch, The light levels here in the UK are not that good this time of year, which happens to correspond with the best surf. I can't afford the cost of the FU1000 and was thinking of trying some other method to allow precise focusing. I have the MA200 and was wondering if using a small external CRT TV would be any good, I know powering & setting up etc would be a bit more complicated, but has anyone else done anything like this?

January 4th, 2004, 02:59 AM	#2
Jed Stone New Boot Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 13	Focus OK, I think I did not put enough information on my post, when looking through the viewfinder it was really hard to focus correctly, the sea was grey, the sky was grey (typical English wintertime). Being short sighted and wearing glasses doesn't help much either. The resultant footage was constanty blurring out as I couldn't see the focus that well when shooting. so now thinking of something larger to view whilst shooting. I looked at some threads and they mentioned the verizoom external camera mounted TFT screen, cool, but they are not available outside the USA. Does anyone know of a similar item that is available for UK residents?

January 4th, 2004, 01:04 PM	#4
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Indeed, Jed, you are certainly not alone in your difficulty. The standard color viewfinder is just too coarse to facilitate consistently crisp focus by eye alone. Randy's suggestion is a good one when using the standard 16x Auto lens in manual focus mode. 1. Frame your subject. 2. Zoom in to the main portion of the subject. 3. Press the auto focus button on the lens' barrel to snap focus (not to change from manual focus) 4. Zoom back out to reframe your subject. As Wayne Orr, a fellow member here, often notes in his signature, "If it was easy they'd get a relative to do it.". __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

January 5th, 2004, 03:51 PM	#10
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Jed, Are you sure that the bar is not indicating your exposure, dark to light (as mine does)? There is a small inverted triangle in the center indicating "correct" exposure. The indicator will slide as the frame changes. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

January 6th, 2004, 08:15 AM	#12
Greg Boston Wrangler Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: DFW area, TX Posts: 6,117 Images: 1	exposure bar Jed, Yes, that is what you are seeing. The exposure bar only shows up when you have the camera in full manual (M). It will disappear and be replaced by the W/T bar while zooming but will reappear shortly after you stop zooming. You have to be careful though, as on my XL-1 you will have blown out highlights in a high contrast scene by the time the exposure meter is centered. Of course, this gets back to the basic rule of proper lighting, especially in digital video which doesn't handle high contrast ratios very well. That being said, you might want to strive to keep the exposure a little to the left of center. And, it you haven't already done so, turn on the zebra bars to show you those hot spots in your frame. Good luck,

January 4th, 2004, 11:13 AM	#3
G. Randy Brown Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Las Cruces, NM Posts: 288	I too can not see well enough to focus with the viewfinder. However I've learned to trust the XL1s' auto focus button. I run everything manually but when I frame my shot I push the (temporary) auto focus button and have always been happy with the results (in post). As far as your question about using a small TV as a monitor...I used to but then I bought a (cheap $300) shoe mount LCD monitor off of Ebay and it works fine for framing shots but I plan on buying a "real" one before too long. I would search this site for, say, "shoe mount" or "camera mount monitor" for reccomendations. Good luck, Randy

January 4th, 2004, 02:39 PM	#5
Jed Stone New Boot Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 13	Thank you kind sirs for your recommedations, will try that out next time the surf picks up (If it ever does) Regards Jed P.S shot a Christening tonight and had the lens in manual and focused in on the Vicar, really clear, but maybe it was the low light in the Church, or are my eyes getting too bad? but it did seem to drift in and out slightly. Maybe it was my eyes? will let you know when I get it into final cut Pro TTFN P.P.S This is a truly magnificent forum, have been searching for an XL one for quite some time, stumbled upon it accidentaly :-))

January 5th, 2004, 02:58 AM	#7
Jed Stone New Boot Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 13	Ken I had the camera set to M (as I always do) and did notice something as well, you know in the top left hand corner of the viewfinder there is the bar that I have always thought of as the zoom iindicator, (well it moves between W & T when I am zooming), last night it was moving itself??? the overall birghtness seemed to change occaisionaly?? I was not touching any off the controls at the time, but anyway I have just woken up and once the effects of the large quantity of Bacardi I consumed have worn off, I will look at the footage (I being the Great Uncle and Godafather it was my duty to purchase alcohol for everyone) Again thanks for the advice Sirs Regards Jed BCNU P.S Found a 7" LCD Monitor on E-Bay for £70 (Not sure how many of those green backs that is) basicallly it is a screen for in car entertainment, will modify it and let you know if it does the job, the Neblek ones are over £400 ARGGHHHH being a self employed wannabe camerman I can't afford those sort of prices!!

January 5th, 2004, 01:50 PM	#8
Jed Stone New Boot Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 13	well the bacardi has worn off and I have started editing, in final Cut Pro the footage is absolutely perfect (to the eyes of a non professional camerman / editor) and the focus issue I think is due to a combination of my eyes and the small viewfinder. I am still amazed at that warm fuzzy film type look of shooting in frame mmmmmmm! Thanks for all the advice and will carry out 2 important steps 1) visit my Optician 2) when the external TFT LCD turns up will use that to frame everything Regards Jed P.S Does anyone know why the top left indicator bar moves? I wasn't zooming honest!!

January 5th, 2004, 02:49 PM	#9
G. Randy Brown Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Las Cruces, NM Posts: 288	>>and the focus issue I think is due to a combination of my eyes and the small viewfinder<< I've found that the Bacardi can be an issue too : ) Randy

January 6th, 2004, 07:19 AM	#11
Jed Stone New Boot Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 13	Silly me, guess it is exposure Thanks Jed "so much to learn" Stone