Slow pan up

Nathan Quattrini · February 21st, 2007, 11:36 AM

I am about to cry. My $300 consumer cam could pan like this no problems...but the H1 looks like a first generation QuickTime VR of a 3d model, all jumpy and horrible looking. Whats the deal? Why can`t I just pan up smoothly?

http://www.kiukle.com/temp/testedgemere.wmv

can you see what i mean?

Benjamin Richardson · February 21st, 2007, 11:56 AM

I wouldn't say that this is being caused by the camera itself.

What settings for frame rate, resolution, and shutter are you using?

what NLE are you using (i know that with PPro, i was getting a very slight stuttering out of my 24F mode until i installed the presets that i got from their site)?

what are your capture settings?

what encoder are you using?

Tony Davies-Patrick · February 21st, 2007, 12:20 PM

It looks like either you've left it on autofocus instead of manual focus, or you've left your finger grip on the lens barrel (so slightly moving the rings) during the pan.

Nathan Quattrini · February 21st, 2007, 12:23 PM

recorded at 60i HDV 1440x1080, as far as I remember i didn`t touch the shutter as I haven`t learned how to use those settings yet. If anything at some point the AE shift i think was at -.5 by accident. Is there anyway to check?
I`m recording straight onto a Firestore 4 pro and using PPro 2.0

the wmv was encoded with premieres built in encoder, it looks exactly like that in premiere as well, as well as exported uncompressed. It all has that effect like it was only getting the perspective every 2 seconds. I tried putting it back on the hard drive and plugging it in to the camera, played it back and it looks fine in the EVF, but every shot from that angle in PPro looks like the file i posted....what if anything can i do? Theres even a hand held shot very similar that came out fine in PPro....

Daniel Epstein · February 23rd, 2007, 06:47 PM

I don't know what the issue is but few things can cause grabbing like this. Slow pans and tilts on tripods should be done with the image stabilizer off. It will try and grab the image on slow moves. Your hand held shot might be better since the little shake you give the camera gives the stabilizer something to do

Pete Bauer · February 23rd, 2007, 06:58 PM

Just off the cuff, that looks like an encoding issue to me. The WMV is encoded at a low bit rate and reduced resolution, so I'd be surprised if there were NOT compression artifacts. Try exporting to a much higher bitrate, full 1440x1080 WMV from the timeline. I'm going to guess it won't look jumpy...but if it does, then I'm with Daniel that the image stabilizer was accidentally left on.

Lee Wilson · February 23rd, 2007, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan Quattrini

I am about to cry. My $300 consumer cam could pan like this no problems...but the H1 looks like a first generation QuickTime VR of a 3d model, all jumpy and horrible looking. Whats the deal? Why can`t I just pan up smoothly?

http://www.kiukle.com/temp/testedgemere.wmv

can you see what i mean?

Switch off the image stabilizer!

Tony Davies-Patrick · February 24th, 2007, 08:10 AM

Yes, Lee may be also right on this one Nathan...did you have IS turned on? This is a big no-no when panning on a tripod, although you can sometimes get away with it on extremely slow pans it is much better to leave it turned off. Even handheld pans are normally best with the IS off.

Nathan Quattrini · February 26th, 2007, 09:18 AM

hmmm to be honest i`m not sure when i turned it on. I remember shutting it off for some of the tight zooms because I noticed even when the tripod was still the image was slightly moving around....not sure if i had it on when doing the pans. It may have been one contributing factor.
The other....something with Premiere. The pans look fine in the camera viewfinder, yet have the weird jumpy perspective thing in Premiere...and exports through the Adobe media encoder that way. Again I ended up using DebugMode Frameserver to export to Tmpgenc and it looked fine through that. So it may be a combo of premiere and the image stabilizer, i`ll have to do some more tests to see how it works.

So, image stabilizer only when doing handheld?

Benjamin Richardson · February 26th, 2007, 01:44 PM

Yes, try not to use the IS when the camera is locked down. There are all kinds of little things that will get "glitchy", some you might not even realize until you're viewing it on a large monitor.

February 21st, 2007, 11:36 AM	#1
Nathan Quattrini Major Player Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Warwick, Rhode Island Posts: 740	Slow pan up - perspective glitches I am about to cry. My $300 consumer cam could pan like this no problems...but the H1 looks like a first generation QuickTime VR of a 3d model, all jumpy and horrible looking. Whats the deal? Why can`t I just pan up smoothly? http://www.kiukle.com/temp/testedgemere.wmv can you see what i mean? __________________ Cinematography Site

February 21st, 2007, 12:20 PM	#3
Tony Davies-Patrick Trustee Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Worldwide Posts: 1,589	It looks like either you've left it on autofocus instead of manual focus, or you've left your finger grip on the lens barrel (so slightly moving the rings) during the pan. __________________ www.WILDCARP.com www.NIKON.me.uk

February 21st, 2007, 12:23 PM	#4
Nathan Quattrini Major Player Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Warwick, Rhode Island Posts: 740	recorded at 60i HDV 1440x1080, as far as I remember i didn`t touch the shutter as I haven`t learned how to use those settings yet. If anything at some point the AE shift i think was at -.5 by accident. Is there anyway to check? I`m recording straight onto a Firestore 4 pro and using PPro 2.0 the wmv was encoded with premieres built in encoder, it looks exactly like that in premiere as well, as well as exported uncompressed. It all has that effect like it was only getting the perspective every 2 seconds. I tried putting it back on the hard drive and plugging it in to the camera, played it back and it looks fine in the EVF, but every shot from that angle in PPro looks like the file i posted....what if anything can i do? Theres even a hand held shot very similar that came out fine in PPro.... __________________ Cinematography Site

February 23rd, 2007, 06:58 PM	#6
Pete Bauer Wrangler Join Date: May 2003 Location: Eagle River, AK Posts: 4,100	Just off the cuff, that looks like an encoding issue to me. The WMV is encoded at a low bit rate and reduced resolution, so I'd be surprised if there were NOT compression artifacts. Try exporting to a much higher bitrate, full 1440x1080 WMV from the timeline. I'm going to guess it won't look jumpy...but if it does, then I'm with Daniel that the image stabilizer was accidentally left on. __________________ Pete Bauer The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. Albert Einstein Trying to solve a DV mystery? You may find the answer behind the SEARCH function ... or be able to join a discussion already in progress!

February 24th, 2007, 08:10 AM	#8
Tony Davies-Patrick Trustee Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Worldwide Posts: 1,589	Yes, Lee may be also right on this one Nathan...did you have IS turned on? This is a big no-no when panning on a tripod, although you can sometimes get away with it on extremely slow pans it is much better to leave it turned off. Even handheld pans are normally best with the IS off. __________________ www.WILDCARP.com www.NIKON.me.uk

February 21st, 2007, 11:56 AM	#2
Benjamin Richardson Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Syracuse, NY Posts: 143	I wouldn't say that this is being caused by the camera itself. What settings for frame rate, resolution, and shutter are you using? what NLE are you using (i know that with PPro, i was getting a very slight stuttering out of my 24F mode until i installed the presets that i got from their site)? what are your capture settings? what encoder are you using?

February 23rd, 2007, 06:47 PM	#5
Daniel Epstein Trustee Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: New York, NY Posts: 1,267	I don't know what the issue is but few things can cause grabbing like this. Slow pans and tilts on tripods should be done with the image stabilizer off. It will try and grab the image on slow moves. Your hand held shot might be better since the little shake you give the camera gives the stabilizer something to do

February 26th, 2007, 09:18 AM	#9
Nathan Quattrini Major Player Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Warwick, Rhode Island Posts: 740	hmmm to be honest i`m not sure when i turned it on. I remember shutting it off for some of the tight zooms because I noticed even when the tripod was still the image was slightly moving around....not sure if i had it on when doing the pans. It may have been one contributing factor. The other....something with Premiere. The pans look fine in the camera viewfinder, yet have the weird jumpy perspective thing in Premiere...and exports through the Adobe media encoder that way. Again I ended up using DebugMode Frameserver to export to Tmpgenc and it looked fine through that. So it may be a combo of premiere and the image stabilizer, i`ll have to do some more tests to see how it works. So, image stabilizer only when doing handheld? __________________ Cinematography Site

February 26th, 2007, 01:44 PM	#10
Benjamin Richardson Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Syracuse, NY Posts: 143	Yes, try not to use the IS when the camera is locked down. There are all kinds of little things that will get "glitchy", some you might not even realize until you're viewing it on a large monitor.