6x Wide Angle Shipping

Jonas Nystrom · December 8th, 2006, 09:28 AM

Lovely lens, new Possibilities (no, I'm not from Canon ;-). I really love the 6X, the missing part for camera, at last found. And the Macro is great, have look!

Pete Bauer · December 8th, 2006, 09:46 AM

Jonas, thanks again for posting. The only bad thing is that I assured (not really **promised**) my wife that I'm done spending big dollars on video stuff for a while. But this may have forced me to consider "a while" to have elapsed.

Just curious, as I wasn't clear from the previous several posts...are you shooting with or without a UV or other filter? From an optical standpoint it would be better not to, of course, but from a safety standpoint it might be a bit frightening to put that front element very close up to some subjects!

I'll have to also show our daughter the latest pictures so she knows what doing homework looks like (just kidding, she does fine).
;-)

Pekka Uotila · December 8th, 2006, 09:48 AM

Thank you very much for sharing your experiences with this "new tool" Jonas. It seems that these photos have no meta data or atleast I could not find the info. I wonder why ?

Jonas Nystrom · December 8th, 2006, 01:15 PM

I haven't recieved my B+W Skylight filter SLIM ;-) fit yet, so this last post without any filter. And it's frame grabs, so there isn't any meta data!

And Peter, this is actually a rare momen't; my doughter doing her math homework, without any threat, persuasion or reward ;-D

Tom Hardwick · December 8th, 2006, 01:50 PM

The distortion is enough to make me wary of using max wide-angle as I track through buildings, because door frames that bow outward as I pass through them do not look good to my clients. If you've got a flat-screen TV, try this: stand in front of the TV with your camera perfectly perpendicular to the screen. Zoom to wide-angle and move so that the TV frame fills your v'finder frame. I’ll bet the results surprise you. As you move further away though and zoom in, things begin to look better and the barrel distortion lessens. On the Z1 you've got to go to 12 on the 00>99 zoom scale to get zero distortion. All is not lost though. My single element Bolex aspheric (a 0.5x) actually cures the Sony’s barrel distortion to some extent. At full wide-angle it’s still barrel distorted, but zooming in a bit gives perfectly straight lines.

Jonas Nystrom · December 8th, 2006, 05:18 PM

As I show in the picture: Barrel Chart @ full wide.jpg, on page two in this thread, there is a obvious barrel distortion. I should have done the picture on a larger chart, so I could fix the cameras CCD really parallel with the chart, but it is there and you can see it.

Compared to the Z1 EVF picture (which have the widest focal lenght 32,5 mm in a 35 mm SLR camera comparison, the 6X zoom has 24,5 mm), I get the overall impression that the barrel distortion may be equivalent or less (I assume that there isn't any wide angle adapter mounted). Compared to wide adapters I have used mounted on the 20X the barrel distortion is far less!

Tom Hardwick · December 9th, 2006, 08:33 AM

''Compared to wide adapters I have used mounted on the 20X the barrel distortion is far less!'' ... as so it should be considering the price of this lens Jonas.

Yes, my shots show the Z1's 12x zoom at its widest angle and it's well known for its barrel distortion. But my Bolex Aspheron (a 0.52x converter lens that limits the Zeiss zoom to a 6x) doesan't add *any* barrel distortion, and that's filming at a 17 mm equivalent focal length.

tom.

Jonas Nystrom · December 9th, 2006, 10:02 AM

"I’ll bet the results surprise you." My post was an answer to your claim. What result should we experience (as you say in your post) as a surprise? Barrel distortion? And I don't know the Bolex, but adapters usually degenerate the overall quality as well, or? Sorry I don't follow...

Tom Hardwick · December 9th, 2006, 12:32 PM

You're quite right Jonas - anything placed in front of your front element will degrade the image quality to a greater or lesser degree. But folk fit softening filters, thick polarisors and so on - so absolute image quality isn't necessarily the only Holy Grail.

So it goes with the Aspheron. This is a single aspherical glass element made by Bolex in Switzerland, beautifully Zeiss T* multicoated and it costs. But the ace up its sleeve is the 17 mm (equiv) focal length and the fact that you can track room to room and not have the door frames bow outwards as you pass through them.

Anyway, if we make movies that have people watching the edges of the frame looking for chromatic aberations, then we're not really getting the audience effect we're after. The 17 mm focal length is wild, but at an actual 2.3 mm the lens must be absolutely *spotless*!

tom.

Tony Davies-Patrick · December 9th, 2006, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. J. deLange

You are absolutely right on that - best to try and see really but when I went into the local supplier's show room they laughed and said they couldn't remember the last time someone had asked for a filter as big as 82 mm. In the protective filter the difference in cost wasn't much but a "wide angle" polarizer, which can't be thin so they get wide by stepping up (the ring which mates with the lens is 82 mm but the front ring is 95) did cost me extra - a lot extra - and I'm not sure it's necessary. And it must weigh half a kg (a pound) but it is a beautifully made thing.

I've got two Nikon 122mm filters for the front of my telephoto Nikkors...

Dave F. Nelson · December 10th, 2006, 04:24 PM

Can someone post footage shot with this new lens? I have to admit that I have been one of the biggest complainers on this board of CA problems with the 20x lens, and I have been waiting anxiously for this new lens to come out.

The stills I have seen are very impressive. The fringing appears to have been reduced to what I consider to be negligable.

I have had high hopes for this lens and it appears that I won't be disappointed. But how the camera performs in motion rather than stills is the real test, IMHO.

I hope someone can post some clips with high contrast vertical lines with changes from dark to light, and hard edges at the outer edges of the frame.

This is, I feel the real test. But I love what I have seen so far.

Thanks, in advance, Dave.

Yi Fong Yu · December 10th, 2006, 08:51 PM

wow, will we get the updated comparo between all of the XL lenses? thx for sharing pix.

Will Johnson · February 3rd, 2007, 03:32 PM

Maybe I'm not looking in the right place, but does Zotz still sell the body only kit? I can't find it on the site at all.

Tom Roper · February 3rd, 2007, 08:39 PM

These are from Jona's grabs of the ISO 12233 resolution chart. I put all of the charts through the Imatest software. They are normalized to a standard sharpening 2 pixel radius. The best results are at the full telephoto end, posted below. Very impressive!

MTF50 Horizontal Resolution = 750.1 line widths per picture height
MTF50 Vertical Resolution = 720.8 line widths per picture height

http://vsdrives.com/graphics/resolut..._Horz_best.png
http://vsdrives.com/graphics/resolut..._Vert_best.png

John Richard · February 17th, 2007, 09:35 AM

Anyone find info on a new Chroziel barrel focus gear that fits the new 6X yet.

Searched around and no info is available. Chroziel's website is little light on info and email response.

Great matte box and follow focus setup though - just trying to get it set up for the 6X which has a different barrel outside diameter.

December 8th, 2006, 09:28 AM	#46
Jonas Nystrom Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Göteborg, Sweden Posts: 306	Lovely lens, new Possibilities (no, I'm not from Canon ;-). I really love the 6X, the missing part for camera, at last found. And the Macro is great, have look! Attached Thumbnails __________________ Jonas Nyström, DoP :: HOT SHOT® SWEDEN :: www.hotshot.nu :: RED #1567, RED 18-50mm T3 :: XL A1, Letus Extreme :: XL H1, 20X & 6X lens (for sale) :: www.vimeo.com/nystrom

December 8th, 2006, 09:46 AM	#47
Pete Bauer Wrangler Join Date: May 2003 Location: Eagle River, AK Posts: 4,100	Jonas, thanks again for posting. The only bad thing is that I assured (not really promised) my wife that I'm done spending big dollars on video stuff for a while. But this may have forced me to consider "a while" to have elapsed. Just curious, as I wasn't clear from the previous several posts...are you shooting with or without a UV or other filter? From an optical standpoint it would be better not to, of course, but from a safety standpoint it might be a bit frightening to put that front element very close up to some subjects! I'll have to also show our daughter the latest pictures so she knows what doing homework looks like (just kidding, she does fine). ;-) __________________ Pete Bauer The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. Albert Einstein Trying to solve a DV mystery? You may find the answer behind the SEARCH function ... or be able to join a discussion already in progress!

December 8th, 2006, 09:48 AM	#48
Pekka Uotila Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Helsinki, Finland Posts: 51	Thank you very much for sharing your experiences with this "new tool" Jonas. It seems that these photos have no meta data or atleast I could not find the info. I wonder why ? __________________ Pekka

December 8th, 2006, 01:15 PM	#49
Jonas Nystrom Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Göteborg, Sweden Posts: 306	I haven't recieved my B+W Skylight filter SLIM ;-) fit yet, so this last post without any filter. And it's frame grabs, so there isn't any meta data! And Peter, this is actually a rare momen't; my doughter doing her math homework, without any threat, persuasion or reward ;-D __________________ Jonas Nyström, DoP :: HOT SHOT® SWEDEN :: www.hotshot.nu :: RED #1567, RED 18-50mm T3 :: XL A1, Letus Extreme :: XL H1, 20X & 6X lens (for sale) :: www.vimeo.com/nystrom

December 8th, 2006, 01:50 PM	#50
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	The distortion is enough to make me wary of using max wide-angle as I track through buildings, because door frames that bow outward as I pass through them do not look good to my clients. If you've got a flat-screen TV, try this: stand in front of the TV with your camera perfectly perpendicular to the screen. Zoom to wide-angle and move so that the TV frame fills your v'finder frame. I’ll bet the results surprise you. As you move further away though and zoom in, things begin to look better and the barrel distortion lessens. On the Z1 you've got to go to 12 on the 00>99 zoom scale to get zero distortion. All is not lost though. My single element Bolex aspheric (a 0.5x) actually cures the Sony’s barrel distortion to some extent. At full wide-angle it’s still barrel distorted, but zooming in a bit gives perfectly straight lines. Attached Thumbnails

December 8th, 2006, 05:18 PM	#51
Jonas Nystrom Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Göteborg, Sweden Posts: 306	As I show in the picture: Barrel Chart @ full wide.jpg, on page two in this thread, there is a obvious barrel distortion. I should have done the picture on a larger chart, so I could fix the cameras CCD really parallel with the chart, but it is there and you can see it. Compared to the Z1 EVF picture (which have the widest focal lenght 32,5 mm in a 35 mm SLR camera comparison, the 6X zoom has 24,5 mm), I get the overall impression that the barrel distortion may be equivalent or less (I assume that there isn't any wide angle adapter mounted). Compared to wide adapters I have used mounted on the 20X the barrel distortion is far less! __________________ Jonas Nyström, DoP :: HOT SHOT® SWEDEN :: www.hotshot.nu :: RED #1567, RED 18-50mm T3 :: XL A1, Letus Extreme :: XL H1, 20X & 6X lens (for sale) :: www.vimeo.com/nystrom Last edited by Jonas Nystrom; December 8th, 2006 at 06:24 PM.

December 9th, 2006, 08:33 AM	#52
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	''Compared to wide adapters I have used mounted on the 20X the barrel distortion is far less!'' ... as so it should be considering the price of this lens Jonas. Yes, my shots show the Z1's 12x zoom at its widest angle and it's well known for its barrel distortion. But my Bolex Aspheron (a 0.52x converter lens that limits the Zeiss zoom to a 6x) doesan't add any barrel distortion, and that's filming at a 17 mm equivalent focal length. tom.

December 9th, 2006, 10:02 AM	#53
Jonas Nystrom Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Göteborg, Sweden Posts: 306	"I’ll bet the results surprise you." My post was an answer to your claim. What result should we experience (as you say in your post) as a surprise? Barrel distortion? And I don't know the Bolex, but adapters usually degenerate the overall quality as well, or? Sorry I don't follow... __________________ Jonas Nyström, DoP :: HOT SHOT® SWEDEN :: www.hotshot.nu :: RED #1567, RED 18-50mm T3 :: XL A1, Letus Extreme :: XL H1, 20X & 6X lens (for sale) :: www.vimeo.com/nystrom Last edited by Jonas Nystrom; December 9th, 2006 at 11:53 AM.

December 9th, 2006, 12:32 PM	#54
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	You're quite right Jonas - anything placed in front of your front element will degrade the image quality to a greater or lesser degree. But folk fit softening filters, thick polarisors and so on - so absolute image quality isn't necessarily the only Holy Grail. So it goes with the Aspheron. This is a single aspherical glass element made by Bolex in Switzerland, beautifully Zeiss T* multicoated and it costs. But the ace up its sleeve is the 17 mm (equiv) focal length and the fact that you can track room to room and not have the door frames bow outwards as you pass through them. Anyway, if we make movies that have people watching the edges of the frame looking for chromatic aberations, then we're not really getting the audience effect we're after. The 17 mm focal length is wild, but at an actual 2.3 mm the lens must be absolutely spotless! tom.

December 10th, 2006, 04:24 PM	#56
Dave F. Nelson Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 129	Can someone post footage shot with this new lens? I have to admit that I have been one of the biggest complainers on this board of CA problems with the 20x lens, and I have been waiting anxiously for this new lens to come out. The stills I have seen are very impressive. The fringing appears to have been reduced to what I consider to be negligable. I have had high hopes for this lens and it appears that I won't be disappointed. But how the camera performs in motion rather than stills is the real test, IMHO. I hope someone can post some clips with high contrast vertical lines with changes from dark to light, and hard edges at the outer edges of the frame. This is, I feel the real test. But I love what I have seen so far. Thanks, in advance, Dave.

December 10th, 2006, 08:51 PM	#57
Yi Fong Yu Trustee Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Vulcan Posts: 1,564	wow, will we get the updated comparo between all of the XL lenses? thx for sharing pix. __________________ bow wow wow

February 3rd, 2007, 03:32 PM	#58
Will Johnson New Boot Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Astoria, NY Posts: 7	Maybe I'm not looking in the right place, but does Zotz still sell the body only kit? I can't find it on the site at all.

February 3rd, 2007, 08:39 PM	#59
Tom Roper Trustee Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Denver, Colorado Posts: 1,891	Imatest MTF50/P SFR Resolution Test These are from Jona's grabs of the ISO 12233 resolution chart. I put all of the charts through the Imatest software. They are normalized to a standard sharpening 2 pixel radius. The best results are at the full telephoto end, posted below. Very impressive! MTF50 Horizontal Resolution = 750.1 line widths per picture height MTF50 Vertical Resolution = 720.8 line widths per picture height http://vsdrives.com/graphics/resolut..._Horz_best.png http://vsdrives.com/graphics/resolut..._Vert_best.png

February 17th, 2007, 09:35 AM	#60
John Richard Major Player Join Date: May 2006 Location: Incline Village, Nevada Posts: 604	Anyone find info on a new Chroziel barrel focus gear that fits the new 6X yet. Searched around and no info is available. Chroziel's website is little light on info and email response. Great matte box and follow focus setup though - just trying to get it set up for the 6X which has a different barrel outside diameter.