A few more H1/HDV/DV100 FCP QT clips to peruse.

Barlow Elton · February 2nd, 2006, 12:20 AM

Cool. I would be interested to see what your findings are. How well do the two cameras intercut and what format, etc.

Keep us posted on your progress and your decision.

Barlow Elton · February 2nd, 2006, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shawn Alyasiri

Meanwhile, I'm playing around with some of the Carlos .m2t's on the timeline, applying YUV curves, some color, contrast, etc, just to play around - very compelling clips and capabilities.

I'm also putting these clips in various editor projects/frame rates (1440x1080 24p, 30p, 60i projects, and 1280x720 24p, 30p, 60p projects), just to see how they look, react in realtime in Edius, etc. Might have to combine HD100 24p/30p clips with H1 24F/60i clips some day on the same timeline, so I'm trying to learn what would be the best global timeline to combine, or find transcoding options to scale certain clips up/down to match certain timelines, etc.

So tell me more about your Edius system. It sounds like it's a pretty powerful system to work with HDV. You have realtime component monitoring, right? What kind of realtime performance do you get, and do you work in that NX HD codec they have too? I've found the Kona card does indeed accelerate HDV with FCP, but I'm still not all that enamored of HDV as an editing format. It's ok, but it feels like a slight step backwards performance wise, so I prefer converting to DVCPROHD, and I will soon look at other formats such as AIC and PhotoJPEG.

Happy tweaking...

Shawn Alyasiri · February 2nd, 2006, 01:02 AM

Just got the last two tube clips - thanks again.

I've been very happy with the Edius system. Exactly 53 weeks ago (to the day), my DVstorm system blew up - literally - on a tech's bench. He arc'ed across the power supply, fried the board, sparks, everything - it was a small trajedy and took me months to get back up.

So - I said heck with it, I'm going to get ready for HD and put some horsepower into the next machine, hopefully to get me through a couple years of whatever comes and however I expand.

Had Guy Graphics build this thing, and it turned into a monster - that's what they called it two. Dual Xeon 3.6, with a system drive, and 3 internal RAIDs - (13) 400 gig drives - 5.2TB, around the Canopus Edius SP card & breakout.

The new Edius 3.61 unlocked everything for the HD100 and other cameras with 24p, 30p, etc, and lets you view in realtime component for the HD settings, and both component and composite/S-Vid for the SD settings.

Seems to chunk through things very nicely - sometimes I need to hit Shift-Space to pre-buffer the playback, especially if there are filters/transitions, etc. The only time I've seen it choke are with tons of filters/streams, or if you're putting filters on clips that are outside the native project size (ie: putting a realtime filter on a 1440 60i clip inside a 1280 30p timeline). Sometimes it works hard to make that happen, but it'll do it!

I've just been dropping in the .m2t's that you've been putting on the net. If I ever want to create clips from the timeline, I export using the Canopus HQ codec, which I think is great. It captures to that too.

If you've got clips in the HQ codec, the system moves right along - it's optimized I guess. It seems like you can drop just about any clip/format you find directly on the timeline. Lastly, it has got to be the fastest SD machine I've ever seen. Took a couple of weeks to get used to it - can't do without it now...

Looking forward to the collaboration with Thomson/Grass Valley. I'm excited by the camera they are slated to come out with - could be a good thing from both side...

Thanks again for everything - pretty sure I'm going to grab one of these cams...

Barlow Elton · February 2nd, 2006, 01:28 AM

Wow, sounds like a kick arse system! I actually have a DVStorm2 card with a Dell that I bought over 3 years ago. Never used it as much as I thought I would, but I did enjoy the amazing real-time filters and transitions it offered.

Do they still have the "Old Movie" RT effect in the Edius HD system? I thought that was a pretty damn good effect, and amazingly you could put more filters on top of that one if you had a fairly fast P4.

Ahh, but I've learned that sometimes less is more.

Shawn Alyasiri · February 2nd, 2006, 01:34 AM

Yep - that filter and all the others seem to have made it over. I like the real-time curves and color-correction as well. Hip system.

Nikial Kabel · February 2nd, 2006, 02:26 AM

Barlow, is it just me or am I seeing lines all over the place when playing your clips? (clear lines that distort the image)

I'm viewing off a pc from wmp and vlc same thing on both.

Barlow Elton · February 2nd, 2006, 09:29 AM

Not sure what your problem is. Others haven't mentioned the issue.

Shawn Alyasiri · February 2nd, 2006, 10:00 AM

I haven't noticed any problems... You may want to check your project settings so that they're 1440x1080. I've placed them in 24p, 30p and 60i projects - they look good. Put them in a regular SD DV 4x3 timeline as well and it downconverts nicely - no probs...

Oh wait - are you trying the .m2t's? I had to work a little bit with the previous .264 clips, and then noticed noise in them - but I think that was because of all of the transcoding involved. The .m2t's should be clean.

Nikial Kabel · February 2nd, 2006, 03:02 PM

K all better, opened the clips up in Avid and all is good now. Seems the problem was windows media player and vlc, maybe i'm lacking a certain codec hmm who knows.

Beautiful clips by the way Barlow!

February 4th, 2006, 12:52 PM

I'm grateful for your clips, Barlow.

Is there cinegamma -- 1, 2 in these clips or not?

And about the sound, do you think 4-channel 16-bit 192kbps enough for 35mm film-out work to big screen?

Barlow Elton · February 5th, 2006, 03:23 AM

It was Cinegamma 2. That's the gamma curve that I like the best, but everything else was pretty much neutral. -3db 24F.

I wouldn't go with the 4 channel sound in the camera, unless it was somehow desperately needed. I haven't actually recorded to nor listened to the 4 channel 192 kbps sound, but if it's anywhere near the same quality of mp3 at that bit rate, it might be ok for dialog and the odd nat sounds you might need from a location.

If I'm making a movie with the H1, I would definitley do double-system sound. However, I have no qualms about acquiring in the H1's HDV 384 kbps sound. I've used it for broadcast TV and it's fine.

David Saraceno · February 5th, 2006, 11:17 AM

Stupid question.

Why can't I import the mt2 files into Final Cut Pro 5.0.x?

Barlow Elton · February 5th, 2006, 01:42 PM

You can't. You have to demux them in MPEG streamclip, but even then I'm not sure FCP will handle 24p Mpeg2.

You might try converting them in said program to DVCPROHD and then importing into a DVCPROHD timeline to play around with them. You can also convert to AIC and other codecs.

February 2nd, 2006, 02:26 AM	#36
Nikial Kabel Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 37	Barlow, is it just me or am I seeing lines all over the place when playing your clips? (clear lines that distort the image) I'm viewing off a pc from wmp and vlc same thing on both. Last edited by Nikial Kabel; February 2nd, 2006 at 03:48 AM.

February 2nd, 2006, 12:20 AM	#31
Barlow Elton Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UT Posts: 945	Cool. I would be interested to see what your findings are. How well do the two cameras intercut and what format, etc. Keep us posted on your progress and your decision.

February 2nd, 2006, 01:02 AM	#33
Shawn Alyasiri Major Player Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Bloomington, IL Posts: 256	Just got the last two tube clips - thanks again. I've been very happy with the Edius system. Exactly 53 weeks ago (to the day), my DVstorm system blew up - literally - on a tech's bench. He arc'ed across the power supply, fried the board, sparks, everything - it was a small trajedy and took me months to get back up. So - I said heck with it, I'm going to get ready for HD and put some horsepower into the next machine, hopefully to get me through a couple years of whatever comes and however I expand. Had Guy Graphics build this thing, and it turned into a monster - that's what they called it two. Dual Xeon 3.6, with a system drive, and 3 internal RAIDs - (13) 400 gig drives - 5.2TB, around the Canopus Edius SP card & breakout. The new Edius 3.61 unlocked everything for the HD100 and other cameras with 24p, 30p, etc, and lets you view in realtime component for the HD settings, and both component and composite/S-Vid for the SD settings. Seems to chunk through things very nicely - sometimes I need to hit Shift-Space to pre-buffer the playback, especially if there are filters/transitions, etc. The only time I've seen it choke are with tons of filters/streams, or if you're putting filters on clips that are outside the native project size (ie: putting a realtime filter on a 1440 60i clip inside a 1280 30p timeline). Sometimes it works hard to make that happen, but it'll do it! I've just been dropping in the .m2t's that you've been putting on the net. If I ever want to create clips from the timeline, I export using the Canopus HQ codec, which I think is great. It captures to that too. If you've got clips in the HQ codec, the system moves right along - it's optimized I guess. It seems like you can drop just about any clip/format you find directly on the timeline. Lastly, it has got to be the fastest SD machine I've ever seen. Took a couple of weeks to get used to it - can't do without it now... Looking forward to the collaboration with Thomson/Grass Valley. I'm excited by the camera they are slated to come out with - could be a good thing from both side... Thanks again for everything - pretty sure I'm going to grab one of these cams...

February 2nd, 2006, 01:28 AM	#34
Barlow Elton Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UT Posts: 945	Wow, sounds like a kick arse system! I actually have a DVStorm2 card with a Dell that I bought over 3 years ago. Never used it as much as I thought I would, but I did enjoy the amazing real-time filters and transitions it offered. Do they still have the "Old Movie" RT effect in the Edius HD system? I thought that was a pretty damn good effect, and amazingly you could put more filters on top of that one if you had a fairly fast P4. Ahh, but I've learned that sometimes less is more.

February 2nd, 2006, 01:34 AM	#35
Shawn Alyasiri Major Player Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Bloomington, IL Posts: 256	Yep - that filter and all the others seem to have made it over. I like the real-time curves and color-correction as well. Hip system.

February 2nd, 2006, 09:29 AM	#37
Barlow Elton Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UT Posts: 945	Not sure what your problem is. Others haven't mentioned the issue.

February 2nd, 2006, 10:00 AM	#38
Shawn Alyasiri Major Player Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Bloomington, IL Posts: 256	I haven't noticed any problems... You may want to check your project settings so that they're 1440x1080. I've placed them in 24p, 30p and 60i projects - they look good. Put them in a regular SD DV 4x3 timeline as well and it downconverts nicely - no probs... Oh wait - are you trying the .m2t's? I had to work a little bit with the previous .264 clips, and then noticed noise in them - but I think that was because of all of the transcoding involved. The .m2t's should be clean.

February 2nd, 2006, 03:02 PM	#39
Nikial Kabel Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 37	K all better, opened the clips up in Avid and all is good now. Seems the problem was windows media player and vlc, maybe i'm lacking a certain codec hmm who knows. Beautiful clips by the way Barlow!

February 4th, 2006, 12:52 PM	#40
Guest Posts: n/a	I'm grateful for your clips, Barlow. Is there cinegamma -- 1, 2 in these clips or not? And about the sound, do you think 4-channel 16-bit 192kbps enough for 35mm film-out work to big screen?

February 5th, 2006, 03:23 AM	#41
Barlow Elton Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UT Posts: 945	It was Cinegamma 2. That's the gamma curve that I like the best, but everything else was pretty much neutral. -3db 24F. I wouldn't go with the 4 channel sound in the camera, unless it was somehow desperately needed. I haven't actually recorded to nor listened to the 4 channel 192 kbps sound, but if it's anywhere near the same quality of mp3 at that bit rate, it might be ok for dialog and the odd nat sounds you might need from a location. If I'm making a movie with the H1, I would definitley do double-system sound. However, I have no qualms about acquiring in the H1's HDV 384 kbps sound. I've used it for broadcast TV and it's fine.

February 5th, 2006, 11:17 AM	#42
David Saraceno Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Inland Northwest Posts: 490	Stupid question. Why can't I import the mt2 files into Final Cut Pro 5.0.x?

February 5th, 2006, 01:42 PM	#43
Barlow Elton Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UT Posts: 945	You can't. You have to demux them in MPEG streamclip, but even then I'm not sure FCP will handle 24p Mpeg2. You might try converting them in said program to DVCPROHD and then importing into a DVCPROHD timeline to play around with them. You can also convert to AIC and other codecs.