Let's talk about the "CONSOLE" program from Canon....

Shannon Rawls · December 28th, 2005, 05:49 PM

Petey! You got TWO Canon XL-H1's?? awwww man, i'm envious. I need another one badly as well. I was saving the money for the HVX200, but I may as well go ahead and get another XL-H1.

Have you tested any of the timecode sync stuff yet? Let me know.

oh yea,
remember, Firewire is only 15feet max for transfer speeds of 400mbps.
Digital Video is about 100mbps, so that's why its no problem to do runs of about 150 feet and everything works fine. I personally have a 75-foot firewire cable that handles DV/HDV no problem for long runs and crane shots.

- ShannonRawls.com

Pete Bauer · December 28th, 2005, 06:07 PM

Yeah, to make a short story very long:

The originally ordered camera was mistakenly sent by FedEx Ground, which was going to take a whole week, instead of Overnight as intended. So the retailer kindly said to just refuse that one when it arrived and got another one sent out immediately by Overnight. I've been happily using that camera since Dec 5th.

After sending the refused Ground-shipped camera ALMOST all the way back to the retailer, FedEx screwed up and rerouted it back to me. And even worse, the BAD, BAD FedEx delivery guy, just left it at our front door without signature. I'm sure Santa didn't leave HIM any presents! ;-) Fortunately, none of the neighborhood urchins got to it before I just happened to look out the front door and see this huge box. Of course, as soon as I opened the door I recognized the box and knew the score.

Discussed it with the retailer (has adequate stock so didn't need it back to fill any orders), and, oh by the way, my wife. We figure that if we just don't turn out to do two-camera shoots, well, it'll have very good re-sale value for some time yet, especially as a REALLY low-hour camera. Hey, we've already seen a slightly used H1 go for $8500 on DVinfo, eh?

So, yeah, I'm two-fisting it at present. I had considered that IF I was going to get a second camera, I'd try out the HVX200, but since opportunity has knocked at my door with this second H1 (or I guess, DIDN'T knock) my camera-buying days are suspended for a while!

Shannon, appreciate the real-world info on the Firewire. Are you able to find longer cables, or are you actually daisy-chaining a bunch of them togetther with dumb connectors or repeaters?

Pete Bauer · December 28th, 2005, 06:08 PM

Oh, and NOBODY gets away with calling me "Petey" except my mom. ;-)~

I was going to try some timecode stuff tonight as well as check back on CONSOLE, but I didn't get to the local store to get some BNC stuff. Probably tomorrow.

Mathieu Ghekiere · December 28th, 2005, 06:29 PM

Pete, I only understand you story half... did you now got 2 cameras for the price of one?

Pete Bauer · December 28th, 2005, 06:56 PM

No, sadly, two cameras for the price of two!

Yes, OUCH! I guess I'd better quite goofing off and start making some money with all these dang "toys."

Shannon Rawls · December 28th, 2005, 06:57 PM

(clearing throat) Mr. Bauer *smile*,

No...it's one single seventy five foot firewire cable with 4 pin connectors on both ends. You can get the same cable in 154-foot length as well. www.markertek.com

- ShannonRawls.com

Christopher Glaeser · December 28th, 2005, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Bauer

1394 has a 4.5m cable length limit unless you go to the hassle of daisy-chaining

I suspect you may be confusing USB cable limits. Firewire supports considerably longer lengths than USB.

Best,
Christopher

Pete Bauer · December 28th, 2005, 07:09 PM

Thanks Shannon, I'm pretty amazed that it'll work over such a long stretch. But good news for the practicality of it.

I did just a quick check here with the CONSOLE trial software on my 2nd XL H1 (not the one used to install the software), and as I learn my way around the program, it seems to work properly, albeit with the annoying but normal one second delay.

Another potential hassle is that many of us using this camera will be using Cineform products and the CONSOLE only captures in standard HDV MPEG, so it means allotting extra time for converting files to Cineform AVI format after the capture.

If only it was 1/10th the price and I could use it on whichever of my computers it was most convenient to capture to, I might bite. But I think I'll be shooting and capturing the old fashioned way for a while.

EDIT:
Christopher,
No, I wasn't confusing the spec limits, except that it is possible that the 2.0 version of the 1394a spec limit may have caveats...I'm not a hardware tech guy so don't really know that level of detail. With that caveat, 1394a cables, per spec, aren't supposed to be more than 4.5m, but obviously people have found that well engineered cables will, in fact, work at much longer cable lengths and are making use of that.

Joe Brockert · December 28th, 2005, 11:15 PM

Pete,
I've shot hundreds of green screen events with the basic coated firewire from your basic computer stores. They worked fine for awhile but always broke down inside the sheathing. So, I went to a store the actucually makes the firewire in a braided form that was industrial. It has never broke!

As far as length, well Shannon is correct, but if you feel a little uneasy you could try a repeater.

Good Luck, Joe

December 28th, 2005, 05:49 PM	#31
Shannon Rawls Major Player Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Los Angeles, California Posts: 853	Petey! You got TWO Canon XL-H1's?? awwww man, i'm envious. I need another one badly as well. I was saving the money for the HVX200, but I may as well go ahead and get another XL-H1. Have you tested any of the timecode sync stuff yet? Let me know. oh yea, remember, Firewire is only 15feet max for transfer speeds of 400mbps. Digital Video is about 100mbps, so that's why its no problem to do runs of about 150 feet and everything works fine. I personally have a 75-foot firewire cable that handles DV/HDV no problem for long runs and crane shots. - ShannonRawls.com __________________ Shannon W. Rawls ~ Motion Picture Producer & huge advocate of Digital Acquisition.

December 28th, 2005, 06:07 PM	#32
Pete Bauer Wrangler Join Date: May 2003 Location: Eagle River, AK Posts: 4,100	Yeah, to make a short story very long: The originally ordered camera was mistakenly sent by FedEx Ground, which was going to take a whole week, instead of Overnight as intended. So the retailer kindly said to just refuse that one when it arrived and got another one sent out immediately by Overnight. I've been happily using that camera since Dec 5th. After sending the refused Ground-shipped camera ALMOST all the way back to the retailer, FedEx screwed up and rerouted it back to me. And even worse, the BAD, BAD FedEx delivery guy, just left it at our front door without signature. I'm sure Santa didn't leave HIM any presents! ;-) Fortunately, none of the neighborhood urchins got to it before I just happened to look out the front door and see this huge box. Of course, as soon as I opened the door I recognized the box and knew the score. Discussed it with the retailer (has adequate stock so didn't need it back to fill any orders), and, oh by the way, my wife. We figure that if we just don't turn out to do two-camera shoots, well, it'll have very good re-sale value for some time yet, especially as a REALLY low-hour camera. Hey, we've already seen a slightly used H1 go for $8500 on DVinfo, eh? So, yeah, I'm two-fisting it at present. I had considered that IF I was going to get a second camera, I'd try out the HVX200, but since opportunity has knocked at my door with this second H1 (or I guess, DIDN'T knock) my camera-buying days are suspended for a while! Shannon, appreciate the real-world info on the Firewire. Are you able to find longer cables, or are you actually daisy-chaining a bunch of them togetther with dumb connectors or repeaters? __________________ Pete Bauer The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. Albert Einstein Trying to solve a DV mystery? You may find the answer behind the SEARCH function ... or be able to join a discussion already in progress!

December 28th, 2005, 06:08 PM	#33
Pete Bauer Wrangler Join Date: May 2003 Location: Eagle River, AK Posts: 4,100	Oh, and NOBODY gets away with calling me "Petey" except my mom. ;-)~ I was going to try some timecode stuff tonight as well as check back on CONSOLE, but I didn't get to the local store to get some BNC stuff. Probably tomorrow. __________________ Pete Bauer The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. Albert Einstein Trying to solve a DV mystery? You may find the answer behind the SEARCH function ... or be able to join a discussion already in progress!

December 28th, 2005, 06:56 PM	#35
Pete Bauer Wrangler Join Date: May 2003 Location: Eagle River, AK Posts: 4,100	No, sadly, two cameras for the price of two! Yes, OUCH! I guess I'd better quite goofing off and start making some money with all these dang "toys." __________________ Pete Bauer The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. Albert Einstein Trying to solve a DV mystery? You may find the answer behind the SEARCH function ... or be able to join a discussion already in progress!

December 28th, 2005, 06:57 PM	#36
Shannon Rawls Major Player Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Los Angeles, California Posts: 853	(clearing throat) Mr. Bauer smile, No...it's one single seventy five foot firewire cable with 4 pin connectors on both ends. You can get the same cable in 154-foot length as well. www.markertek.com - ShannonRawls.com __________________ Shannon W. Rawls ~ Motion Picture Producer & huge advocate of Digital Acquisition.

December 28th, 2005, 06:29 PM	#34
Mathieu Ghekiere Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Belgium Posts: 2,195	Pete, I only understand you story half... did you now got 2 cameras for the price of one?

December 28th, 2005, 07:09 PM	#38
Pete Bauer Wrangler Join Date: May 2003 Location: Eagle River, AK Posts: 4,100	Thanks Shannon, I'm pretty amazed that it'll work over such a long stretch. But good news for the practicality of it. I did just a quick check here with the CONSOLE trial software on my 2nd XL H1 (not the one used to install the software), and as I learn my way around the program, it seems to work properly, albeit with the annoying but normal one second delay. Another potential hassle is that many of us using this camera will be using Cineform products and the CONSOLE only captures in standard HDV MPEG, so it means allotting extra time for converting files to Cineform AVI format after the capture. If only it was 1/10th the price and I could use it on whichever of my computers it was most convenient to capture to, I might bite. But I think I'll be shooting and capturing the old fashioned way for a while. EDIT: Christopher, No, I wasn't confusing the spec limits, except that it is possible that the 2.0 version of the 1394a spec limit may have caveats...I'm not a hardware tech guy so don't really know that level of detail. With that caveat, 1394a cables, per spec, aren't supposed to be more than 4.5m, but obviously people have found that well engineered cables will, in fact, work at much longer cable lengths and are making use of that. __________________ Pete Bauer The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. Albert Einstein Trying to solve a DV mystery? You may find the answer behind the SEARCH function ... or be able to join a discussion already in progress!

December 28th, 2005, 11:15 PM	#39
Joe Brockert New Boot Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bellevue, Washington, United States Posts: 13	Pete, I've shot hundreds of green screen events with the basic coated firewire from your basic computer stores. They worked fine for awhile but always broke down inside the sheathing. So, I went to a store the actucually makes the firewire in a braided form that was industrial. It has never broke! As far as length, well Shannon is correct, but if you feel a little uneasy you could try a repeater. Good Luck, Joe