background lighter than subject at DVinfo.net

Matthew Jackson · April 16th, 2007, 10:12 PM

Hello All,

I'm trying to get a shot of a dark subject with a very sunny background... I've seen the Canon Xl2 demo video on their website, and they sort of advertise as this is something that can be done quite well... does anyone have any suggestions for settings?

thanks!

Jonathan Kirsch · April 17th, 2007, 08:19 AM

It's been a while since I've seen the XL2 tour video (and dvcreators won't put it out there as a download), but you can always use an on-camera light (frezzi, anton bauer, PAG) to throw some illumination on their face.

Jonathan

Don Bloom · April 17th, 2007, 09:01 AM

zoom tight to the subject to get the exposure for the subject, lock the iris zoom out and frame. You will more than likely blow out the background but in most backlit situations you really don't have much choice. You can adjust the iris by perhaps 1/2 to 1 full stop to tone down the background but keep in mind that you would now be underexposing the subject therefore losing detail so be very careful.
Don

Richard Hunter · April 17th, 2007, 04:01 PM

In addition to what Don and Jonathan said, you could also use a reflector
board to bounce some light back onto the subject and reduce the contrast of the scene.

Richard

Jack Barker · April 18th, 2007, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonathan Kirsch

It's been a while since I've seen the XL2 tour video (and dvcreators won't put it out there as a download)....

Jonathan

Notwithstanding, you can still watch it here.
http://www.dvcreators.net/canon-xl2/

Jonathan Kirsch · April 18th, 2007, 10:52 AM

Thanks Jack...

I went there yesterday to watch it again, but there was a "?" over the Q in the player (although my QT is the latest version). But I just went to it today and it works. Weird. Anyone figured a way to save it? Can't open it in QT it self (using "Open URL"). DV's javascript won't allow for saving/downloading either.

Jonathan

Jack Barker · April 18th, 2007, 11:05 AM

Jonathan – I downloaded it in '05 and still have it on my computer. I would happily send it to you via iChat or AOL Instant Messenger if you're on a PC. It's 118 MB, so that's about the only way I know to send it to you.

I am iJack33 (AIM).

Cheers

Jonathan Kirsch · April 18th, 2007, 01:45 PM

Thanks again, Jack. But I'm on a Mac and I don't have iChat or AIM. If I think of another way (or you do), let me know! I'd suggest something like yousendit.com or something, but they have 100MB limits.

Jonathan

Jack Barker · April 18th, 2007, 04:58 PM

Jonathan, if your Mac is newer than Summer of '03, then you already have iChat. It comes with OS X. Otherwise, you can sign up for an account (which you need to do with iChat as well) and download AIM - it's all free, by the way, both the account and the AIM software. If you do have a newer Mac then I would suggest using iChat, which you will find in your Applications folder. It's far superior to AIM software, even though you would still need to sign up for an account, unless you already have a .mac account.

If you have trepidations, email me at RogueCrew@Verizon.net, I'll send you my phone number and talk you through the process. It really is a fantastic way to send files, and the voice capabilities are outstanding. I talk hands-free to clients every day using iChat.

AIM for Mac
http://www.aim.com/

Matthew Jackson · April 18th, 2007, 10:29 PM

yea... I believe there's a scene in that video where 1 or 2 girls are talking on a balcony... and behind them is a skyline that is full on daylight and they are a bit in the shade. Well, I'm sort of doing the same shot except it's me inside a cabin of a boat... the mates are standing in front of me talking and cutting up and behind them is the wake of the boat and stern while we are running home... the shot in the video came out nice, and although the whitewater is going to be a huge blowout problem I thought maybe I could pull it off somehow... maybe I can....

Benjamin Richardson · April 19th, 2007, 09:02 AM

Matthew, as far as I can recall, what they are referring to in that video is the camera's ability to pull detail out of shadows. So if you were to stretch your blacks, turn up your master pedestal and setup levels, and use a light cine gamma, you can then correct contrast/luma in post to suit your needs.

Matthew Jackson · April 19th, 2007, 09:40 PM

ah! excellent... I will try that tomorrow and see how it works. thanks for the information.

Nic Smith · April 20th, 2007, 10:15 PM

To download the 118MB file for offline viewing, get a download manager and download the URL: http://syndicate.tentoe.com/canon/De..._demo_tour.mov

Jonathan Kirsch · April 22nd, 2007, 03:10 PM

THanks for the replies Jack and Nic.

Jack...I'll try the AIM thing and let you know when. I'm currently on a shoot in France for the next five days and I won't be able to work on it.

Nic...when you say download manager, are you talking PC or Mac? Don't remember a download manager on a Mac, so will it work?

Also, if you stretch the blacks, and raise the pedestal, etc., how do you know what the iris/f-stop is supposed to be to be able to fix it in post? The setting makes it look washed out as it is, how do you know how much is too much?

Jonathan

Nic Smith · April 23rd, 2007, 02:19 AM

You dont need a download manager, you can download it straight from your browser, but if you have a slow connection or will want to pause the download, then get a download manager. I would recommend DAP, it has a Windows and a mac version. Get the mac version here: http://www.speedbit.com/mac/
Then you can just drag the link into the DAP window and start downloading the file to your hard drive.

April 16th, 2007, 10:12 PM	#1
Matthew Jackson Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Fort Worth, Texas Posts: 92	background lighter than subject Hello All, I'm trying to get a shot of a dark subject with a very sunny background... I've seen the Canon Xl2 demo video on their website, and they sort of advertise as this is something that can be done quite well... does anyone have any suggestions for settings? thanks!

April 20th, 2007, 10:15 PM	#13
Nic Smith New Boot Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Hobart, Australia Posts: 17	To download the movie To download the 118MB file for offline viewing, get a download manager and download the URL: http://syndicate.tentoe.com/canon/De..._demo_tour.mov

April 23rd, 2007, 02:19 AM	#15
Nic Smith New Boot Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Hobart, Australia Posts: 17	Downloading file You dont need a download manager, you can download it straight from your browser, but if you have a slow connection or will want to pause the download, then get a download manager. I would recommend DAP, it has a Windows and a mac version. Get the mac version here: http://www.speedbit.com/mac/ Then you can just drag the link into the DAP window and start downloading the file to your hard drive.

April 17th, 2007, 08:19 AM	#2
Jonathan Kirsch Major Player Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Denver, Colorado Posts: 204	It's been a while since I've seen the XL2 tour video (and dvcreators won't put it out there as a download), but you can always use an on-camera light (frezzi, anton bauer, PAG) to throw some illumination on their face. Jonathan

April 17th, 2007, 09:01 AM	#3
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	zoom tight to the subject to get the exposure for the subject, lock the iris zoom out and frame. You will more than likely blow out the background but in most backlit situations you really don't have much choice. You can adjust the iris by perhaps 1/2 to 1 full stop to tone down the background but keep in mind that you would now be underexposing the subject therefore losing detail so be very careful. Don

April 17th, 2007, 04:01 PM	#4
Richard Hunter Trustee Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Lipa City Batangas, Philippines Posts: 1,110	In addition to what Don and Jonathan said, you could also use a reflector board to bounce some light back onto the subject and reduce the contrast of the scene. Richard

April 18th, 2007, 10:52 AM	#6
Jonathan Kirsch Major Player Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Denver, Colorado Posts: 204	Thanks Jack... I went there yesterday to watch it again, but there was a "?" over the Q in the player (although my QT is the latest version). But I just went to it today and it works. Weird. Anyone figured a way to save it? Can't open it in QT it self (using "Open URL"). DV's javascript won't allow for saving/downloading either. Jonathan

April 18th, 2007, 11:05 AM	#7
Jack Barker Major Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 342	Jonathan – I downloaded it in '05 and still have it on my computer. I would happily send it to you via iChat or AOL Instant Messenger if you're on a PC. It's 118 MB, so that's about the only way I know to send it to you. I am iJack33 (AIM). Cheers

April 18th, 2007, 01:45 PM	#8
Jonathan Kirsch Major Player Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Denver, Colorado Posts: 204	Thanks again, Jack. But I'm on a Mac and I don't have iChat or AIM. If I think of another way (or you do), let me know! I'd suggest something like yousendit.com or something, but they have 100MB limits. Jonathan

April 18th, 2007, 04:58 PM	#9
Jack Barker Major Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 342	Jonathan, if your Mac is newer than Summer of '03, then you already have iChat. It comes with OS X. Otherwise, you can sign up for an account (which you need to do with iChat as well) and download AIM - it's all free, by the way, both the account and the AIM software. If you do have a newer Mac then I would suggest using iChat, which you will find in your Applications folder. It's far superior to AIM software, even though you would still need to sign up for an account, unless you already have a .mac account. If you have trepidations, email me at RogueCrew@Verizon.net, I'll send you my phone number and talk you through the process. It really is a fantastic way to send files, and the voice capabilities are outstanding. I talk hands-free to clients every day using iChat. AIM for Mac http://www.aim.com/

April 18th, 2007, 10:29 PM	#10
Matthew Jackson Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Fort Worth, Texas Posts: 92	yea... I believe there's a scene in that video where 1 or 2 girls are talking on a balcony... and behind them is a skyline that is full on daylight and they are a bit in the shade. Well, I'm sort of doing the same shot except it's me inside a cabin of a boat... the mates are standing in front of me talking and cutting up and behind them is the wake of the boat and stern while we are running home... the shot in the video came out nice, and although the whitewater is going to be a huge blowout problem I thought maybe I could pull it off somehow... maybe I can....

April 19th, 2007, 09:02 AM	#11
Benjamin Richardson Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Syracuse, NY Posts: 143	Matthew, as far as I can recall, what they are referring to in that video is the camera's ability to pull detail out of shadows. So if you were to stretch your blacks, turn up your master pedestal and setup levels, and use a light cine gamma, you can then correct contrast/luma in post to suit your needs.

April 19th, 2007, 09:40 PM	#12
Matthew Jackson Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Fort Worth, Texas Posts: 92	ah! excellent... I will try that tomorrow and see how it works. thanks for the information.

April 22nd, 2007, 03:10 PM	#14
Jonathan Kirsch Major Player Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Denver, Colorado Posts: 204	THanks for the replies Jack and Nic. Jack...I'll try the AIM thing and let you know when. I'm currently on a shoot in France for the next five days and I won't be able to work on it. Nic...when you say download manager, are you talking PC or Mac? Don't remember a download manager on a Mac, so will it work? Also, if you stretch the blacks, and raise the pedestal, etc., how do you know what the iris/f-stop is supposed to be to be able to fix it in post? The setting makes it look washed out as it is, how do you know how much is too much? Jonathan