Preset for working in dark environment

Tim Bickford · November 3rd, 2006, 07:17 PM

I see what you mean. I think it is a copy and paste issue. Sorry... I'll do the experiment again and repost the shots... sorry.

Tim

Richard Hunter · November 3rd, 2006, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Bickford

If the band does not have stage lights then you could be in for a rough go. The VL 10LI light works great in run and gun dark situations.

Hi Tim. I was a bit too far away for a camera light to have much effect, but the stage had all sorts of coloured and flashing lights going, so it worked out fine. I had to use +18dB gain (so no progressive scan) and 1/25s shutter to get enough exposure, and I pushed up coring and used NR to try to reduce the resulting video noise. I also pushed up the colour saturation and ended up with some very oversaturated colours due to the stage lighting. That sounds bad but the overall effect is very cool. The slow shutter gave some great looking motion blur on the drummer's sticks too. I'll try to post a grab tomorrow if I get time.

Richard

Richard Hunter · November 4th, 2006, 08:06 PM

Tim Bickford · November 4th, 2006, 09:02 PM

Richard-

Cool shots... Shooting bands in dark locations is always a nightmare when you have zero control over light. Here is a link to a short interview that I did at night using my haunt-1 setting.

gain = 6dB
24P
1/48 shutter
Manual white balance
Aperture = wide open
Distance from camera 15 feet
VL 10LI light

My first time interviewing people. The guy that was suppose to do the interviewing could not make it. I set-up the camera and handed to a buddy that just pointed it at who ever I interviewed.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...36175620006535

Did you use the on-board mic to capture the audio? Can you post some of the video to goodle video or youtube?

Tim

Richard Hunter · November 6th, 2006, 03:37 AM

Hi Tim. Saw your interview, everything comes across fine and it is pretty clean so the light really helps.

I did use the on-camera mic, but will only be using the recorded sound to sychronise the video to an existing CD audio track released by the band. Anyway, I was moving around and getting very variable sound depending on where the nearest speakers happened to be. (And at some locations, the wind from the bass cabinets was blowing my trouser legs around like mad, it was so loud.)

Don't know if I can post anything on the web yet, need to check with the band because the music is copyright.

Richard

Jarrod Whaley · November 6th, 2006, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Hunter

I did use the on-camera mic, but will only be using the recorded sound to sychronise the video to an existing CD audio track released by the band.

You might have some trouble with that if you're talking about a recording done on a separate occasion. It's doubtful that the band played their music exactly at the same tempo as they did when they recorded, for one thing. And even if they did, there will be slight speed-ups and slow-downs here and there that will throw off the sync. What you're describing sounds almost impossible to pull off. Good luck with it. :)

I shot a band the other night in very dark conditions, with varying levels of stage lighting. I was able to create a preset for the situation because I arrived early enough to ask the lighting technician to do a little run-through of the lighting when the band did their sound check. I crushed the blacks, gained up to +6, maxed out the coring, and backed off on the sharpness, among other things. I also went with the tungsten WB setting, because the different colors of the gelled stage lighting made it impossible to get a neutral WB. I was able to tweak the exposure during that sound check until I had found settings that worked on average in the changing lighting conditions--as such, I didn't have to make any changes to the gain or aperture during the show. The resulting video looks really, really good, I think.

The moral: get there early if you can, and try to do a dry run if at all possible. If it's not possible, then you can at least try to set up a preset that will work well with high-contrast stage lighting.

Tim Bickford · November 6th, 2006, 06:42 PM

Jarrod,

Good point about the audio sync. I think we may now be off the original topic. Anyway, if you are crafty enough you can match pre-recorded audio to live video. A lot of the 70's rock bands did it. I.E. Led Zeppelin's "The Song Remains The Same" is a good example. There are many live shot's that simply do not match up with the audio. You have to pay close attention, or in some cases be a guitarist. It helps to have lots of footage of the live performance. Bottom line, you can pull it off.

As for the dark conditions... I agree, any chance to set up early and get the preset down is time well spent.

Richard Hunter · November 6th, 2006, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jarrod Whaley

You might have some trouble with that if you're talking about a recording done on a separate occasion. It's doubtful that the band played their music exactly at the same tempo as they did when they recorded, for one thing. And even if they did, there will be slight speed-ups and slow-downs here and there that will throw off the sync. What you're describing sounds almost impossible to pull off. Good luck with it. :)

Hi Jarrod. Actually I do this all the time. Sometimes it's tricky as you say, but many times it is not hard at all. In this case, the song started at the same tempo, then speeded up very slightly from about halfway through. I'm lucky that I am intercutting with other footage, so was able to "steal" time here and there to pull the shots back into sync with the CD track. Knowing where to cheat makes all the difference!

Richard

Richard Hunter · November 29th, 2006, 06:15 PM

Hi Tim. Actually, I ended up using hardly any of the live footage, because the story in the video is told through 3D animation. And what I did use, I mangled a lot of it, so overall this won't tell you anything about the low-light capability of the XL2. Anyway, just in case you are interested, you can see the video at the link below.

Richard

http://www.jaegercat.com/danger.html

November 3rd, 2006, 07:17 PM	#16
Tim Bickford Major Player Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 448	I see what you mean. I think it is a copy and paste issue. Sorry... I'll do the experiment again and repost the shots... sorry. Tim __________________ Tim Bickford

November 4th, 2006, 09:02 PM	#19
Tim Bickford Major Player Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 448	Richard- Cool shots... Shooting bands in dark locations is always a nightmare when you have zero control over light. Here is a link to a short interview that I did at night using my haunt-1 setting. gain = 6dB 24P 1/48 shutter Manual white balance Aperture = wide open Distance from camera 15 feet VL 10LI light My first time interviewing people. The guy that was suppose to do the interviewing could not make it. I set-up the camera and handed to a buddy that just pointed it at who ever I interviewed. http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...36175620006535 Did you use the on-board mic to capture the audio? Can you post some of the video to goodle video or youtube? Tim __________________ Tim Bickford

November 6th, 2006, 06:42 PM	#22
Tim Bickford Major Player Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 448	Jarrod, Good point about the audio sync. I think we may now be off the original topic. Anyway, if you are crafty enough you can match pre-recorded audio to live video. A lot of the 70's rock bands did it. I.E. Led Zeppelin's "The Song Remains The Same" is a good example. There are many live shot's that simply do not match up with the audio. You have to pay close attention, or in some cases be a guitarist. It helps to have lots of footage of the live performance. Bottom line, you can pull it off. As for the dark conditions... I agree, any chance to set up early and get the preset down is time well spent. __________________ Tim Bickford

November 4th, 2006, 08:06 PM	#18
Richard Hunter Trustee Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Lipa City Batangas, Philippines Posts: 1,110	Hi Tim. Here's some frame grabs that show some of the range of lighting conditions. Not very sharp, due to the MB, but it looks better as moving video. Richard http://www.jaegercat.com/~richard/Firebrands1f.png http://www.jaegercat.com/~richard/Firebrands2f.png http://www.jaegercat.com/~richard/Firebrands3f.png http://www.jaegercat.com/~richard/Firebrands4f.png http://www.jaegercat.com/~richard/Firebrands5f.png http://www.jaegercat.com/~richard/Firebrands6f.png http://www.jaegercat.com/~richard/Firebrands7f.png http://www.jaegercat.com/~richard/Firebrands8f.png http://www.jaegercat.com/~richard/Firebrands9f.png

November 6th, 2006, 03:37 AM	#20
Richard Hunter Trustee Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Lipa City Batangas, Philippines Posts: 1,110	Hi Tim. Saw your interview, everything comes across fine and it is pretty clean so the light really helps. I did use the on-camera mic, but will only be using the recorded sound to sychronise the video to an existing CD audio track released by the band. Anyway, I was moving around and getting very variable sound depending on where the nearest speakers happened to be. (And at some locations, the wind from the bass cabinets was blowing my trouser legs around like mad, it was so loud.) Don't know if I can post anything on the web yet, need to check with the band because the music is copyright. Richard

November 29th, 2006, 06:15 PM	#24
Richard Hunter Trustee Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Lipa City Batangas, Philippines Posts: 1,110	Hi Tim. Actually, I ended up using hardly any of the live footage, because the story in the video is told through 3D animation. And what I did use, I mangled a lot of it, so overall this won't tell you anything about the low-light capability of the XL2. Anyway, just in case you are interested, you can see the video at the link below. Richard http://www.jaegercat.com/danger.html