Can someone please help with audio set-up? at DVinfo.net

Chris Fritsche · June 22nd, 2005, 09:34 PM

OK, I am trying to attach a wirless laviler(sp) mic. I have a sinnhessier EW 100 E2. I want to run this mic along with the front mic. The manual for my camera has a "whole 3 pages" on this subject, (not very helpful). Can someone just tell me what the setting should be and which XLR to jack into.
Also I have a on screen audio preview of channels 1 & 2, however once I get the wireless mic going, how can I also see it's levels..???
I am even more confused about the setting on the mic, if anyone would like to try and help me with this as well..???

Chris Hurd · June 22nd, 2005, 10:29 PM

Hi Chris,

You want to record audio from the front mic as well as your Senn wireless lav. You'll be using three of the four available audio channels on the XL2. Those four channels are divided into two stereo pairs called Audio 1 and Audio 2. Here are your step-by-step instructions.

Step One. Bring up the internal menu system of the XL2. Go to the Audio Setup menu. Under the entry for Audio Mode, choose the option called "12-bit Ch. 1/2, 3/4." Close the menu.

Step Two. Open the large white door on the left side of the camcorder which covers the audio controls panel. The lower half of the panel is labeled "Audio 1" and it controls the first stereo pair. Set the Audio 1 input select switch to "Front Mic." Set the Rec Level switch to "M."

Step Three. The upper half of the audio controls panel is labeled "Audio 2" and it controls the second stereo pair. Set the Audio 2 input select switch to "Rear." Set the Rec Level switch to "M." Close the large white door. You'll be able to manually adjust the audio level knobs with the tip of your finger even though the door is closed.

Step Four. Plug your wireless receiver into one of the rear XLR jacks. It doesn't matter which one. Your lav is a mono mic which means it'll provide one channel of sound. Whichever jack you plug into just means that the other side won't be carrying audio. Remember the front mic is stereo so it requires two channels (both sides of the Audio 1 stereo pair of inputs). Your wireless lav requires only one channel (only one side of the Audio 2 stereo pair of inputs, and you can use either the left or right side, it doesn't matter).

Step Five. Use headphones to monitor your audio mix. Locate the Audio Monitor button just below and in front of the large round Program Mode - Power On dial. This button allows you to first isolate the Audio 1 pair of inputs, which have been designated to your front mic. Set the level accordingly using the bottom two volume knobs for Audio 1. Press the Audio Monitor button again to isolate the Audio 2 pair of inputs. You will hear sound from only one side (that is, through one ear in your headphones) since your wireless lav is a monophonic mic. Set its level using the appropriate one of the top two volume knobs for Audio 2. Press the Audio Monitor one more time and know you're hearing a mix of all three channels (actually it's all four channels but one is empty since you're not using it).

Clear enough? Hope so!

Jonathan Jones · June 23rd, 2005, 12:04 AM

Thank you Mr. Hurd for your wonderful and detailed explanation of this important procedure. It was very clearly laid out and easy to follow. I went through this problem a few months ago when learning my new camera - and generally found it fairly intuitive to a point - mostly because I have many years experience in sound work overall - but what I was missing was the audio monitor button - and could figure out why I could not test the signal coming through the rear XLR on channel 3 or 4. The audio monitor is clearly there, but I must have had a brain fart and developed a blind spot because I found it by accident after some hair pulling - and even though it is mentioned in both the manual and Greg Salman DVD, it was quite un-notable as to have me skip right over it without even noticing.

It seems that alot of people are confused by the 4 channel audio switching and monitoring options, so maybe Chris Hurd's instructional step-by-step post could become another sticky (not another sticky!!!) or put into some FAQ section.

As a side note regarding the settings on the wireless input. Personally, on my lav wireless Sennheiser, I find the input signal to be very - very strong - and easy to distort, so I have to use the attenuator switch (on the rear of the camera -independently switchable for each channel- below the XLR input) and then flip the input to manual control to get what I think is the proper input level. - Just something to think about for Mr. Fritsche.
-Jon

Chris Fritsche · June 23rd, 2005, 05:33 AM

Thanks Chris, I will try as soon as I get home tonight. Yeah you are right about the usefulness of this. Video is the easy part, (turn it on and point it at something), the audio is a little more difficult, the manuel is not very informitive, I mean it tells you what to do, but doesn't really explain "how" to do it.

Steve House · June 23rd, 2005, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Hurd

Hi Chris,

You want to record audio from the front mic as well as your Senn wireless lav. You'll be using three of the four available audio channels on the XL2. Those four channels are divided into two stereo pairs called Audio 1 and Audio 2. Here are your step-by-step instructions.

....snip

Clear enough? Hope so!

Isn't the microphone receiver output line-level unbalanced? If so shouldn't it go to the audio-in pin jack, not the XLR connector, unless you also put a pad between it and the camera.

Wouldn't it be possible to leave it as 16 bit and only record two channels, channel 1 on front picking up one of the on-camera mike's sides. Put channel 2 on the rear connector and put the wireless mike on it. Of course you'd probably throw away the track recorded by the on-camera mike but odds are you'd do that anyway and this way you'd end up with at least one good 16 bit track from a good mike instead of 3 mediocre 12 bit tracks, two of which are likely destined for the great bit-bucket in the sky anyway.

For my money I'd rather have one good, clean 16 bit mono track than 3 noisy 12 bit tracks.

Chris Fritsche · June 23rd, 2005, 04:32 PM

Does anyone have this wireless mic set-up, I coud use some help getting it to recorder with my XL2

Chris Fritsche · June 23rd, 2005, 04:41 PM

Chris what should I do with the Audio 1 switches amrked " Record channel select and Mic ATT". I have followed your instructions, but I can not get my wireless system to work. It is on and functioning, however I show no signs of picking up any kind of audio signal fromt he wireless mic, I am sure I have a setting wrong, but I nned to use these tomorrow, and I have read all the pages in English in the manual, nothing tells you how to set up the system and run with it, it jsut covers what the menus do, not very helpful, can any help..

Jimmy McKenzie · June 23rd, 2005, 05:11 PM

You might also try staying 16 bit by removing the onboard mic for a shotgun or mono close range mic. This second mic would be connected to the second rear jack and you would then only record 2 channels, one lav, the other, the onboard.
This is the best environment to test your lav. Be sure you are on rear audio1 and your mic settings are att or mic. Headphones are required. The sennheiser has settings for sensitivity, try -10 to begin. There is a volume control on the receiver ... make sure it's on...

Chris Fritsche · June 23rd, 2005, 06:38 PM

Thanks Jimmy, your mentioning the word "reciever" got me to actually look at the back of the mics, like a moron, I had the backwards, I knw it had to be "user error"....

Greg Boston · June 23rd, 2005, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve House

Isn't the microphone receiver output line-level unbalanced? If so shouldn't it go to the audio-in pin jack, not the XLR connector, unless you also put a pad between it and the camera.

Wouldn't it be possible to leave it as 16 bit and only record two channels, channel 1 on front picking up one of the on-camera mike's sides. Put channel 2 on the rear connector and put the wireless mike on it. Of course you'd probably throw away the track recorded by the on-camera mike but odds are you'd do that anyway and this way you'd end up with at least one good 16 bit track from a good mike instead of 3 mediocre 12 bit tracks, two of which are likely destined for the great bit-bucket in the sky anyway.

For my money I'd rather have one good, clean 16 bit mono track than 3 noisy 12 bit tracks.

Sorry Steve, that's not how the XL-2 works. You cannot independently control the destination of all 4 channels. They are input 1 and input 2 and both channels of a given input will be taken from the same location.

regards,

-gb-

Chris Hurd · June 23rd, 2005, 10:53 PM

To phrase Greg's statement a different way, think of the four channels as two stereo pairs. The pairs can't be split; both channels of a particular stereo pair will come from two RCA jacks, or two XLR jacks, or the hot shoe, or the front mic. Unfortunately you can't designate one XLR jack and one RCA jack within a particular stereo pair. It's always two and two.

Chris Hurd · June 23rd, 2005, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve House

Wouldn't it be possible to leave it as 16 bit and only record two channels, channel 1 on front picking up one of the on-camera mike's sides.

Sorry, not possible. The front mic is a stereo mic so it always requires two channels. The front mic can't be switched to mono. What you could do instead is simply replace the front mic with a mono XLR mic. Add a wireless receiver for the remote lav and you've got your two channels at 16-bit quality.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve House

For my money I'd rather have one good, clean 16 bit mono track than 3 noisy 12 bit tracks.

I have never known 12-bit audio to sound "noisy." The ubiquitous Sony VX1000 had 12-bit audio and nobody ever complained about it. In my opinion it depends on the situation. We're talking about a wedding here. I seriously doubt that the customers would be able to discern a difference between 12-bit and 16-bit audio when they review their DVD; and having the extra channels of coverage more than makes up for the relatively slight hit in audio quality. I'm willing to bet the newlyweds will appreciate the wider coverage at 12-bit quality much more so than the limited number of sources at 16-bit quality.

Steve Smith · September 11th, 2005, 10:36 AM

Hi All, I just came back from USA and vissited BH Vidoe in NYC. WOW. Any way, I bought a lav mic and am trying to get both the lav mic and the attached mic to work. I followed everything in this thread and still no luck. Audio mode in menu is set to 12bit CH1/2.3/4

If I use the rear XLR jack, the lav mike works fine on audio 1 when I switch tje Input Select to Rear. If I have it plugged into XLR 1/3 it plays on one channel when I use the CH1 / CH1-CH2 swith set to CH1 and on both chanels when selected to CH1-CH2. If I plug the LAV mic into the XLR 2/4 I get only one channel (channel 2).

Everything seems ok up till this point. Lav mic works, channel select ok, ...

When I set the Audio 2 input select to rear I hear nothing. NAda, nix. I tried plugging the LAv mic into both XLR jacks.

I plugged the LAV mic receiver into the RCA jacks (AUDIO 1 and AUDIO 2). I only get sound on the AUDIO1 side when I set the input switch to AUDIO 1.

I am using headphones to monitor this.

Is my AUDIO 2 hosed or am I missing something.

MAny thanks,

Steve Smith · September 13th, 2005, 11:20 AM

Hi All,
I still am stuck. I am not sure if I should have stuck this on th eend of this thread, but this seems to be the best that explains what I should be doing. I am pretty sure that I have a HW problem, but before I send it to Canon, I wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something. Any help would be most appreciated.

Jimmy McKenzie · September 13th, 2005, 02:28 PM

Hi Steve

I think you might have over looked one step.

Menu your cam to 12 bit 1,2 / 3,4 mode.

Hook up everything.

Select your audio2 rear input. Same for front audio1.

With your headphones on, toggle through the 3 vu displays in the viewfinder. You should have levels showing for all connected sources.

June 22nd, 2005, 09:34 PM	#1
Chris Fritsche Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Houston, TX (Cypress to be exact) Posts: 169	Can someone please help with audio set-up? OK, I am trying to attach a wirless laviler(sp) mic. I have a sinnhessier EW 100 E2. I want to run this mic along with the front mic. The manual for my camera has a "whole 3 pages" on this subject, (not very helpful). Can someone just tell me what the setting should be and which XLR to jack into. Also I have a on screen audio preview of channels 1 & 2, however once I get the wireless mic going, how can I also see it's levels..??? I am even more confused about the setting on the mic, if anyone would like to try and help me with this as well..???

June 22nd, 2005, 10:29 PM	#2
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	Hi Chris, You want to record audio from the front mic as well as your Senn wireless lav. You'll be using three of the four available audio channels on the XL2. Those four channels are divided into two stereo pairs called Audio 1 and Audio 2. Here are your step-by-step instructions. Step One. Bring up the internal menu system of the XL2. Go to the Audio Setup menu. Under the entry for Audio Mode, choose the option called "12-bit Ch. 1/2, 3/4." Close the menu. Step Two. Open the large white door on the left side of the camcorder which covers the audio controls panel. The lower half of the panel is labeled "Audio 1" and it controls the first stereo pair. Set the Audio 1 input select switch to "Front Mic." Set the Rec Level switch to "M." Step Three. The upper half of the audio controls panel is labeled "Audio 2" and it controls the second stereo pair. Set the Audio 2 input select switch to "Rear." Set the Rec Level switch to "M." Close the large white door. You'll be able to manually adjust the audio level knobs with the tip of your finger even though the door is closed. Step Four. Plug your wireless receiver into one of the rear XLR jacks. It doesn't matter which one. Your lav is a mono mic which means it'll provide one channel of sound. Whichever jack you plug into just means that the other side won't be carrying audio. Remember the front mic is stereo so it requires two channels (both sides of the Audio 1 stereo pair of inputs). Your wireless lav requires only one channel (only one side of the Audio 2 stereo pair of inputs, and you can use either the left or right side, it doesn't matter). Step Five. Use headphones to monitor your audio mix. Locate the Audio Monitor button just below and in front of the large round Program Mode - Power On dial. This button allows you to first isolate the Audio 1 pair of inputs, which have been designated to your front mic. Set the level accordingly using the bottom two volume knobs for Audio 1. Press the Audio Monitor button again to isolate the Audio 2 pair of inputs. You will hear sound from only one side (that is, through one ear in your headphones) since your wireless lav is a monophonic mic. Set its level using the appropriate one of the top two volume knobs for Audio 2. Press the Audio Monitor one more time and know you're hearing a mix of all three channels (actually it's all four channels but one is empty since you're not using it). Clear enough? Hope so! __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

June 23rd, 2005, 12:04 AM	#3
Jonathan Jones Trustee Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Healdsburg, California Posts: 1,138	Kudos to Chris Hurd Thank you Mr. Hurd for your wonderful and detailed explanation of this important procedure. It was very clearly laid out and easy to follow. I went through this problem a few months ago when learning my new camera - and generally found it fairly intuitive to a point - mostly because I have many years experience in sound work overall - but what I was missing was the audio monitor button - and could figure out why I could not test the signal coming through the rear XLR on channel 3 or 4. The audio monitor is clearly there, but I must have had a brain fart and developed a blind spot because I found it by accident after some hair pulling - and even though it is mentioned in both the manual and Greg Salman DVD, it was quite un-notable as to have me skip right over it without even noticing. It seems that alot of people are confused by the 4 channel audio switching and monitoring options, so maybe Chris Hurd's instructional step-by-step post could become another sticky (not another sticky!!!) or put into some FAQ section. As a side note regarding the settings on the wireless input. Personally, on my lav wireless Sennheiser, I find the input signal to be very - very strong - and easy to distort, so I have to use the attenuator switch (on the rear of the camera -independently switchable for each channel- below the XLR input) and then flip the input to manual control to get what I think is the proper input level. - Just something to think about for Mr. Fritsche. -Jon

June 23rd, 2005, 04:32 PM	#6
Chris Fritsche Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Houston, TX (Cypress to be exact) Posts: 169	sennheiser ew 100 G2 Does anyone have this wireless mic set-up, I coud use some help getting it to recorder with my XL2

June 23rd, 2005, 05:11 PM	#8
Jimmy McKenzie Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Waterloo Ontario Posts: 721	Chris' explanation is excellent. You might also try staying 16 bit by removing the onboard mic for a shotgun or mono close range mic. This second mic would be connected to the second rear jack and you would then only record 2 channels, one lav, the other, the onboard. This is the best environment to test your lav. Be sure you are on rear audio1 and your mic settings are att or mic. Headphones are required. The sennheiser has settings for sensitivity, try -10 to begin. There is a volume control on the receiver ... make sure it's on...

June 23rd, 2005, 05:33 AM	#4
Chris Fritsche Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Houston, TX (Cypress to be exact) Posts: 169	Thanks Chris, I will try as soon as I get home tonight. Yeah you are right about the usefulness of this. Video is the easy part, (turn it on and point it at something), the audio is a little more difficult, the manuel is not very informitive, I mean it tells you what to do, but doesn't really explain "how" to do it.

June 23rd, 2005, 04:41 PM	#7
Chris Fritsche Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Houston, TX (Cypress to be exact) Posts: 169	Chris what should I do with the Audio 1 switches amrked " Record channel select and Mic ATT". I have followed your instructions, but I can not get my wireless system to work. It is on and functioning, however I show no signs of picking up any kind of audio signal fromt he wireless mic, I am sure I have a setting wrong, but I nned to use these tomorrow, and I have read all the pages in English in the manual, nothing tells you how to set up the system and run with it, it jsut covers what the menus do, not very helpful, can any help..

June 23rd, 2005, 06:38 PM	#9
Chris Fritsche Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Houston, TX (Cypress to be exact) Posts: 169	Thanks Jimmy, your mentioning the word "reciever" got me to actually look at the back of the mics, like a moron, I had the backwards, I knw it had to be "user error"....

June 23rd, 2005, 10:53 PM	#11
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	To phrase Greg's statement a different way, think of the four channels as two stereo pairs. The pairs can't be split; both channels of a particular stereo pair will come from two RCA jacks, or two XLR jacks, or the hot shoe, or the front mic. Unfortunately you can't designate one XLR jack and one RCA jack within a particular stereo pair. It's always two and two. __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

September 11th, 2005, 10:36 AM	#13
Steve Smith Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Munich Germany Posts: 31	Still Lost Hi All, I just came back from USA and vissited BH Vidoe in NYC. WOW. Any way, I bought a lav mic and am trying to get both the lav mic and the attached mic to work. I followed everything in this thread and still no luck. Audio mode in menu is set to 12bit CH1/2.3/4 If I use the rear XLR jack, the lav mike works fine on audio 1 when I switch tje Input Select to Rear. If I have it plugged into XLR 1/3 it plays on one channel when I use the CH1 / CH1-CH2 swith set to CH1 and on both chanels when selected to CH1-CH2. If I plug the LAV mic into the XLR 2/4 I get only one channel (channel 2). Everything seems ok up till this point. Lav mic works, channel select ok, ... When I set the Audio 2 input select to rear I hear nothing. NAda, nix. I tried plugging the LAv mic into both XLR jacks. I plugged the LAV mic receiver into the RCA jacks (AUDIO 1 and AUDIO 2). I only get sound on the AUDIO1 side when I set the input switch to AUDIO 1. I am using headphones to monitor this. Is my AUDIO 2 hosed or am I missing something. MAny thanks, __________________ Gone Fishing. If you need me, please wait! If it is important, please wait longer.

September 13th, 2005, 11:20 AM	#14
Steve Smith Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Munich Germany Posts: 31	Still need help Hi All, I still am stuck. I am not sure if I should have stuck this on th eend of this thread, but this seems to be the best that explains what I should be doing. I am pretty sure that I have a HW problem, but before I send it to Canon, I wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something. Any help would be most appreciated. __________________ Gone Fishing. If you need me, please wait! If it is important, please wait longer.

September 13th, 2005, 02:28 PM	#15
Jimmy McKenzie Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Waterloo Ontario Posts: 721	Hi Steve I think you might have over looked one step. Menu your cam to 12 bit 1,2 / 3,4 mode. Hook up everything. Select your audio2 rear input. Same for front audio1. With your headphones on, toggle through the 3 vu displays in the viewfinder. You should have levels showing for all connected sources.