XL2

Jim Sofranko · March 7th, 2005, 04:20 PM

Anybody hear of XL2's on the market without the serial number on the sticker in the battery compartment? Is that how grey market bodies are sold??

What are the drawbacks to grey market gear??

Many thanks.

Chris Hurd · March 7th, 2005, 04:43 PM

Hi Jim,

I've never heard of any cameras selling without a serial number.

"Grey market" with respect to the U.S. simply means that a particular batch of a product was intended for sale in some other world market, and not in the U.S. Consequences typically involve no warranty or invalid warranty, and a U.S. service center refusing to do work on the item. The serial number shows which market the camera was intended to be sold in; no serial number at all or one that shows to be grey-market would be all the justification a service center needs to void a warranty and refuse service.

Personally I don't think it's worth the trouble. Hope this helps,

Boyd Ostroff · March 7th, 2005, 05:07 PM

If there is no serial number then one might wonder if they are "hot"....

Aaron Koolen · March 7th, 2005, 05:34 PM

Gray market, no, Black Market would be more what I'd think.

Jim Sofranko · March 7th, 2005, 06:32 PM

Those were my thoughts as well.

I should clarify the situation. The entire sticker with the build date, bar code and serial number is missing from the battery compartment. So it may have been removed...but why??

The seller suggested privately that the camera may have been a grey market purchase from the original buyer. Thus the missing sticker but that sounded odd to me.

The seller is the second owner and the camera listed for sale rather inexpensively in the DV Info classifieds.

Chris Hurd · March 7th, 2005, 07:09 PM

Jim, as with any used purchase, I strongly urge you to get it into the Jamesburg, NJ Canon factory service center for a complete check-up. They'll be able to tell you a lot about it. Hand-carry it in there if you can.

Boyd Ostroff · March 7th, 2005, 07:26 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Jim Sofranko : The entire sticker with the build date, bar code and serial number is missing from the battery compartment. So it may have been removed...but why?? -->>>

Well obviously if it was stolen then someone in this chain of events could have removed the sticker to prevent itfrom being traced. Do you really want to get involved with somthing like this? The police could show up one day and take it from you.

A lot of gear "falls of the back of a truck" somewhere along the way. I have a friend who runs a company that designs booths at shows like CES, etc. He says that an unbelievable amount of equipment just disappears without a trace on the final day. As to how this might happen.... I'll leave that as an excercise for the reader...

Jim Sofranko · March 7th, 2005, 07:52 PM

Yes... the lack of a serial number has discouraged me from getting involved. I thought it might be too good to be true...isn't it always.

The lack of a serial number may have implications for getting proper insurance on the rig. Plus, I want to use this rig for a location outside the US. My recollection is that US Customs insist on a serial number for the docket.

And if there is any serial number on the body interior and Canon finds it to be missing from somewhere, who knows where that will lead. Although the techs at Canon told me that the battery sticker was the only serial number I will find.

Maybe it's all innocent but I will use this camera for business and I can't afford to have problems down the line.

Chris Hurd · March 7th, 2005, 08:23 PM

Jim if you found this camera in one of our classifieds, please send me the link to that thread by private email. I may need to pull it from public view. Thanks,

Pete Bauer · March 7th, 2005, 08:42 PM

Yeah, Jim, if you're traveling out of the country, that adds another dimension to it all. I was in Russia and Kazakhstan last year and would have been REALLY uncomfortable about not having a serial number to place on the customs & immigration forms. We all have our own threshold; me, with the vibes I'm getting here, I wouldn't touch this no-serial number camera with a 10 foot pole.

Jim Sofranko · March 7th, 2005, 09:10 PM

No I bowed out. I left it to the seller to verify it's authenticity from Canon if that's possible. Otherwise I'm out of the running as it is simply too risky.

March 7th, 2005, 04:20 PM	#1
Jim Sofranko Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: West Shokan, NY Posts: 217	XL2 - Grey market Anybody hear of XL2's on the market without the serial number on the sticker in the battery compartment? Is that how grey market bodies are sold?? What are the drawbacks to grey market gear?? Many thanks.

March 7th, 2005, 04:43 PM	#2
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	Hi Jim, I've never heard of any cameras selling without a serial number. "Grey market" with respect to the U.S. simply means that a particular batch of a product was intended for sale in some other world market, and not in the U.S. Consequences typically involve no warranty or invalid warranty, and a U.S. service center refusing to do work on the item. The serial number shows which market the camera was intended to be sold in; no serial number at all or one that shows to be grey-market would be all the justification a service center needs to void a warranty and refuse service. Personally I don't think it's worth the trouble. Hope this helps, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

March 7th, 2005, 05:34 PM	#4
Aaron Koolen Trustee Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Auckland, New Zealand Posts: 1,727	Gray market, no, Black Market would be more what I'd think. __________________ My Website Meat Free Media

March 7th, 2005, 07:09 PM	#6
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	Jim, as with any used purchase, I strongly urge you to get it into the Jamesburg, NJ Canon factory service center for a complete check-up. They'll be able to tell you a lot about it. Hand-carry it in there if you can. __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

March 7th, 2005, 08:23 PM	#9
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	Jim if you found this camera in one of our classifieds, please send me the link to that thread by private email. I may need to pull it from public view. Thanks, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

March 7th, 2005, 05:07 PM	#3
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	If there is no serial number then one might wonder if they are "hot"....

March 7th, 2005, 06:32 PM	#5
Jim Sofranko Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: West Shokan, NY Posts: 217	Those were my thoughts as well. I should clarify the situation. The entire sticker with the build date, bar code and serial number is missing from the battery compartment. So it may have been removed...but why?? The seller suggested privately that the camera may have been a grey market purchase from the original buyer. Thus the missing sticker but that sounded odd to me. The seller is the second owner and the camera listed for sale rather inexpensively in the DV Info classifieds.

March 7th, 2005, 07:26 PM	#7
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	<<<-- Originally posted by Jim Sofranko : The entire sticker with the build date, bar code and serial number is missing from the battery compartment. So it may have been removed...but why?? -->>> Well obviously if it was stolen then someone in this chain of events could have removed the sticker to prevent itfrom being traced. Do you really want to get involved with somthing like this? The police could show up one day and take it from you. A lot of gear "falls of the back of a truck" somewhere along the way. I have a friend who runs a company that designs booths at shows like CES, etc. He says that an unbelievable amount of equipment just disappears without a trace on the final day. As to how this might happen.... I'll leave that as an excercise for the reader...

March 7th, 2005, 07:52 PM	#8
Jim Sofranko Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: West Shokan, NY Posts: 217	Yes... the lack of a serial number has discouraged me from getting involved. I thought it might be too good to be true...isn't it always. The lack of a serial number may have implications for getting proper insurance on the rig. Plus, I want to use this rig for a location outside the US. My recollection is that US Customs insist on a serial number for the docket. And if there is any serial number on the body interior and Canon finds it to be missing from somewhere, who knows where that will lead. Although the techs at Canon told me that the battery sticker was the only serial number I will find. Maybe it's all innocent but I will use this camera for business and I can't afford to have problems down the line.

March 7th, 2005, 08:42 PM	#10
Pete Bauer Wrangler Join Date: May 2003 Location: Eagle River, AK Posts: 4,100	Yeah, Jim, if you're traveling out of the country, that adds another dimension to it all. I was in Russia and Kazakhstan last year and would have been REALLY uncomfortable about not having a serial number to place on the customs & immigration forms. We all have our own threshold; me, with the vibes I'm getting here, I wouldn't touch this no-serial number camera with a 10 foot pole. __________________ Pete Bauer The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. Albert Einstein Trying to solve a DV mystery? You may find the answer behind the SEARCH function ... or be able to join a discussion already in progress!

March 7th, 2005, 09:10 PM	#11
Jim Sofranko Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: West Shokan, NY Posts: 217	No I bowed out. I left it to the seller to verify it's authenticity from Canon if that's possible. Otherwise I'm out of the running as it is simply too risky.