xl2 circular polariser at DVinfo.net

Jon Turner · February 27th, 2005, 06:34 AM

the standard xl2 has built-in ND filters, but is it necessary to have a polariser as well? if so, which ones do you folks use?

Jimmy McKenzie · February 27th, 2005, 07:17 AM

Spend the most you can. Tiffen or equal quality. Forget the bargain bundle goodies offered by many on line companies. These bargain products subtract from the finished shot.

Pete Bauer · February 27th, 2005, 07:41 AM

Hi Jon,

A circular polarizer is pretty much thought of as a standard accessory. Although it will reduce exposure like the ND, a polarizer's main use is to reduce glare. It is common for video folks to avoid filters and "do it in post" but the glare and reflection reduction you can get with a properly used polarizer can't duplicated in a NLE. If you recorded glare on a window, that's what's in the image and whatever was behind the window just wasn't recorded.

Here's a link to the polarizing filter page of the tiffen web site that also contains links to all their filters:

http://www.tiffen.com/Filter_&_Lens_...FILT_06_07.htm

Happy shooting!

Jon Turner · February 27th, 2005, 08:35 AM

thanks guys!

also, once you have the polarising filter, is it necessary, or even possible, to simultaneously use a uv filter?

p.s. the tiffen link was very helpful. is this the best brand?

Jimmy McKenzie · February 27th, 2005, 08:42 AM

Extra glass = extra muddy. The uv filter is often recommended for lens protection only so it along with the C.P. would be redundant.

A. J. deLange · February 27th, 2005, 10:37 AM

This was covered in another thread recently. The summary: 1. CP filters have some UV absorbtion but UV filters start absorbing at longer wavelengths and thus give better protection against UV. 2. Silicon CCDs are not sensitive to UV so UV protection is not needed. 3. Therefore the value of a UV filter on a video camera (with silicon CCD's) is soley as a protective device. 4. A CP filter provides protenction. 5. Any air-glass interface will cause reflections and potential flare. 6. Don't use a CP and UV filter with a video camera.

Kevin Kocak · February 27th, 2005, 01:21 PM

How many stops do you lose with the CP?

A. J. deLange · February 27th, 2005, 07:57 PM

At http://www.pbase.com/agamid/image/39336430 I've posted the absorbtion for a Kenko circular polarizer. Over the visble part of the range the absorbtion appears to be about 0.4. As 1 stop is 0.3 this filter would require about 1 and 1/3 stops additional exposure.

Mel Williams · February 27th, 2005, 08:06 PM

I hear it's supposed to be better than the Tiffen.

Looking forward to trying it.

Jim Sofranko · March 1st, 2005, 10:24 PM

I've been using a 4x4 polorizer by Zhang which I enjoy considerably.

It is a round filter in a 4x4 frame so it fits in a matte box. On the top side is a small dial that rotates the round filter in the 4x4 frame. This allows you to easily make polorizer adjustments on the fly without having to use a rotatable stage on a matte box. Rotating a stage on a matte box is sometime a little clumsy and certainly not smooth but I can even rotate the Zhang while operating a shot if needed as it is very smooth.

The quality of the glasis great and easily comparable to the other known brands out there.

BTW-Elimination of glare is an important use of the polorizer but let's not forget it's use in controlling reflections and getting that sky nice and blue!

Jon Turner · March 2nd, 2005, 03:10 PM

is it really of more use for outdoor shoots? my project is 99% indoors. do i need the polariser?

Jimmy McKenzie · March 2nd, 2005, 03:15 PM

Likely not required unless you have a huuuuuge amount of lighting and you want to stop the lens down even more for less DOF. But for that you would use ND filters.

Jim Sofranko · March 2nd, 2005, 03:41 PM

Personally, I never shoot exteriors on video or film without a polorizer.

You must be careful using it outdoors as it can sometimes be noticeable on wide sky shots if the camera is moving. It works wonderfully on lock offs and does a great job tuning in the color of grass and foilage by dialing out the reflections.

February 27th, 2005, 06:34 AM	#1
Jon Turner Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: England Posts: 69	xl2 circular polariser the standard xl2 has built-in ND filters, but is it necessary to have a polariser as well? if so, which ones do you folks use?

February 27th, 2005, 07:41 AM	#3
Pete Bauer Wrangler Join Date: May 2003 Location: Eagle River, AK Posts: 4,100	Hi Jon, A circular polarizer is pretty much thought of as a standard accessory. Although it will reduce exposure like the ND, a polarizer's main use is to reduce glare. It is common for video folks to avoid filters and "do it in post" but the glare and reflection reduction you can get with a properly used polarizer can't duplicated in a NLE. If you recorded glare on a window, that's what's in the image and whatever was behind the window just wasn't recorded. Here's a link to the polarizing filter page of the tiffen web site that also contains links to all their filters: http://www.tiffen.com/Filter_&_Lens_...FILT_06_07.htm Happy shooting! __________________ Pete Bauer The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. Albert Einstein Trying to solve a DV mystery? You may find the answer behind the SEARCH function ... or be able to join a discussion already in progress!

February 27th, 2005, 08:35 AM	#4
Jon Turner Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: England Posts: 69	thanks thanks guys! also, once you have the polarising filter, is it necessary, or even possible, to simultaneously use a uv filter? p.s. the tiffen link was very helpful. is this the best brand?

February 27th, 2005, 08:06 PM	#9
Mel Williams Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Southern California Posts: 34	just bought the B&W polarizer today I hear it's supposed to be better than the Tiffen. Looking forward to trying it. __________________ Mel Williams

March 2nd, 2005, 03:10 PM	#11
Jon Turner Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: England Posts: 69	polariser is it really of more use for outdoor shoots? my project is 99% indoors. do i need the polariser?

February 27th, 2005, 07:17 AM	#2
Jimmy McKenzie Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Waterloo Ontario Posts: 721	Spend the most you can. Tiffen or equal quality. Forget the bargain bundle goodies offered by many on line companies. These bargain products subtract from the finished shot.

February 27th, 2005, 08:42 AM	#5
Jimmy McKenzie Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Waterloo Ontario Posts: 721	Extra glass = extra muddy. The uv filter is often recommended for lens protection only so it along with the C.P. would be redundant.

February 27th, 2005, 10:37 AM	#6
A. J. deLange Major Player Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: McLean, VA United States Posts: 749	This was covered in another thread recently. The summary: 1. CP filters have some UV absorbtion but UV filters start absorbing at longer wavelengths and thus give better protection against UV. 2. Silicon CCDs are not sensitive to UV so UV protection is not needed. 3. Therefore the value of a UV filter on a video camera (with silicon CCD's) is soley as a protective device. 4. A CP filter provides protenction. 5. Any air-glass interface will cause reflections and potential flare. 6. Don't use a CP and UV filter with a video camera.

February 27th, 2005, 01:21 PM	#7
Kevin Kocak Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Tampa, Fl Posts: 149	How many stops do you lose with the CP?

February 27th, 2005, 07:57 PM	#8
A. J. deLange Major Player Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: McLean, VA United States Posts: 749	At http://www.pbase.com/agamid/image/39336430 I've posted the absorbtion for a Kenko circular polarizer. Over the visble part of the range the absorbtion appears to be about 0.4. As 1 stop is 0.3 this filter would require about 1 and 1/3 stops additional exposure.

March 1st, 2005, 10:24 PM	#10
Jim Sofranko Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: West Shokan, NY Posts: 217	I've been using a 4x4 polorizer by Zhang which I enjoy considerably. It is a round filter in a 4x4 frame so it fits in a matte box. On the top side is a small dial that rotates the round filter in the 4x4 frame. This allows you to easily make polorizer adjustments on the fly without having to use a rotatable stage on a matte box. Rotating a stage on a matte box is sometime a little clumsy and certainly not smooth but I can even rotate the Zhang while operating a shot if needed as it is very smooth. The quality of the glasis great and easily comparable to the other known brands out there. BTW-Elimination of glare is an important use of the polorizer but let's not forget it's use in controlling reflections and getting that sky nice and blue!

March 2nd, 2005, 03:15 PM	#12
Jimmy McKenzie Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Waterloo Ontario Posts: 721	Likely not required unless you have a huuuuuge amount of lighting and you want to stop the lens down even more for less DOF. But for that you would use ND filters.

March 2nd, 2005, 03:41 PM	#13
Jim Sofranko Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: West Shokan, NY Posts: 217	Personally, I never shoot exteriors on video or film without a polorizer. You must be careful using it outdoors as it can sometimes be noticeable on wide sky shots if the camera is moving. It works wonderfully on lock offs and does a great job tuning in the color of grass and foilage by dialing out the reflections.