24p questions

Alan James · May 28th, 2007, 05:34 AM

The reason the crew of 28 days later used PAL instead of NTSC was because the latest XL series camera out at the time was the XL1s which was just coming out. This camera only shot 4X3 footage and thus had to have a 16X9 extraction. PAL’s resolution is 720X576 and NTSC is 720X480. The pixels are stretched/compressed to make a 4X3 image. PAL is stretched 1.06 times wider and NTSC is 0.9, but they still contain only 720 pixels wide.

This is where the term “non-square pixel” comes from.

If you extract the middle 16X9 (1.77:1) area of PAL it’s a higher resolution then NTSC. I belive its 433 scan lines in PAL to 366 scan lines in NTSC (correct me if I’m wrong).

By playing the 25p footage back at 24p it was close enough to pull off the effect of actually shooting in 24p, but you get extra resolution. It’s only 96% slower and from scene to scene it wouldn’t change the pacing of the movie. There were loads of other limitations the production dealt with, being that’s shooting movies with DV was a new thing, but most were minor like color compression, replacing blown out skies later in post, and removing noise when they shot at night time.

Most of the action was shoot with a higher shutter, most likely over 1/250 of a second (just a guess but probably around 1/500 or so, again just a guess). Most of the problems they faced were eliminated when HDCAM SR cameras, like the Sony F950, hit the market.

Have fun

Michael Bearns · January 1st, 2008, 12:37 PM

Hello,

I am new to this forum and I have a question.
I did receive a Canon XL2 For a Christmas Gift.
My Question is, "What do I set my camera on when I am taping?
60i, 30P or 24P?
I mostly video tape weddings and I would like to get the best possible picture possible. The guide that came with the camera only talk about this area in general. I would appreciate any suggestions, setups, just about anything to give me the look I am looking for. Thanks in advance and wishing you all a very nice New Year.

Sincerly
Michael

Cole McDonald · January 1st, 2008, 12:59 PM

If you search for those terms, you'll come up with bunches of threads on the subject and the strengths and caveats of each.

Joseph Andolina · January 1st, 2008, 05:03 PM

Definetly do some research. But also experiement with the camera, since you have it now at your fingertips. Congrats on your new wonderful gift :)

You should try all your options, 24pn, 24pa, 30p, 60I.

My favorite is 24pn & even 30p. Although I don't think it can be considered a true film look, but I've gotten many compliments by others how the shots look like film to them. But of course, it's all about lighting & exposure. And you can play with different presets to tweek to what looks good to you.

I love also the anamorphic 16:9 setting.

And the camera leaves options open for you, like if you have a second camera of some kind that only shoots in 60I to get other shots at a wedding shoot, at least you can shoot 60I with the XL2 to go with 60I for the entire shoot.

BTW, I think 60I looks great with the XL2 as well.

Joe

Manu De Smet · January 2nd, 2008, 02:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joseph Andolina

I love also the anamorphic 16:9 setting.

Sorry to go a bit off topic here but this option, where can i find it, or are you talking about the standard 16:9 on the XL2?

Chris Hurd · January 2nd, 2008, 06:24 AM

It's not an option, there's only one 16:9 setting. Joseph refers to it as anamorphic because of the way it's recorded to tape.

Jack Barker · January 2nd, 2008, 10:02 AM

Start by watching the XL2 Features Tour. I believe once you have watched it, you can save it to your computer as a QuickTime movie.

http://dvcreators.net/media/demos/xl...aturetour.html

Then, you might consider The Ultimate Guide to the Canon XL2, here

http://www.filmwareproducts.com/Ulti...de/UG-XL2.html

January 1st, 2008, 12:37 PM	#632
Michael Bearns Tourist Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Paradise, Newfoundland, Canada Posts: 1	60i, 30P or 24P Hello, I am new to this forum and I have a question. I did receive a Canon XL2 For a Christmas Gift. My Question is, "What do I set my camera on when I am taping? 60i, 30P or 24P? I mostly video tape weddings and I would like to get the best possible picture possible. The guide that came with the camera only talk about this area in general. I would appreciate any suggestions, setups, just about anything to give me the look I am looking for. Thanks in advance and wishing you all a very nice New Year. Sincerly Michael

January 1st, 2008, 12:59 PM	#633
Cole McDonald Trustee Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Sauk Rapids, MN, USA Posts: 1,675	If you search for those terms, you'll come up with bunches of threads on the subject and the strengths and caveats of each. __________________ Web Youtube Facebook

January 2nd, 2008, 06:24 AM	#636
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	It's not an option, there's only one 16:9 setting. Joseph refers to it as anamorphic because of the way it's recorded to tape. __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

May 28th, 2007, 05:34 AM	#631
Alan James Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Tampa, Florida Posts: 261	The reason the crew of 28 days later used PAL instead of NTSC was because the latest XL series camera out at the time was the XL1s which was just coming out. This camera only shot 4X3 footage and thus had to have a 16X9 extraction. PAL’s resolution is 720X576 and NTSC is 720X480. The pixels are stretched/compressed to make a 4X3 image. PAL is stretched 1.06 times wider and NTSC is 0.9, but they still contain only 720 pixels wide. This is where the term “non-square pixel” comes from. If you extract the middle 16X9 (1.77:1) area of PAL it’s a higher resolution then NTSC. I belive its 433 scan lines in PAL to 366 scan lines in NTSC (correct me if I’m wrong). By playing the 25p footage back at 24p it was close enough to pull off the effect of actually shooting in 24p, but you get extra resolution. It’s only 96% slower and from scene to scene it wouldn’t change the pacing of the movie. There were loads of other limitations the production dealt with, being that’s shooting movies with DV was a new thing, but most were minor like color compression, replacing blown out skies later in post, and removing noise when they shot at night time. Most of the action was shoot with a higher shutter, most likely over 1/250 of a second (just a guess but probably around 1/500 or so, again just a guess). Most of the problems they faced were eliminated when HDCAM SR cameras, like the Sony F950, hit the market. Have fun

January 1st, 2008, 05:03 PM	#634
Joseph Andolina Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Everett, WA Posts: 178	Definetly do some research. But also experiement with the camera, since you have it now at your fingertips. Congrats on your new wonderful gift :) You should try all your options, 24pn, 24pa, 30p, 60I. My favorite is 24pn & even 30p. Although I don't think it can be considered a true film look, but I've gotten many compliments by others how the shots look like film to them. But of course, it's all about lighting & exposure. And you can play with different presets to tweek to what looks good to you. I love also the anamorphic 16:9 setting. And the camera leaves options open for you, like if you have a second camera of some kind that only shoots in 60I to get other shots at a wedding shoot, at least you can shoot 60I with the XL2 to go with 60I for the entire shoot. BTW, I think 60I looks great with the XL2 as well. Joe

January 2nd, 2008, 10:02 AM	#637
Jack Barker Major Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 342	Start by watching the XL2 Features Tour. I believe once you have watched it, you can save it to your computer as a QuickTime movie. http://dvcreators.net/media/demos/xl...aturetour.html Then, you might consider The Ultimate Guide to the Canon XL2, here http://www.filmwareproducts.com/Ulti...de/UG-XL2.html