XH A1 24F project, 60i to 24F slow mo ? at DVinfo.net

Matt Crane · January 10th, 2007, 08:08 AM

So I'm shooting a short film in HDV 24F with my XH A1, but want to do some slow-mo shots. What is the best way to take the 1080i60 footage into my Final Cut Pro 1080p24 project? The Canon HDV 24F footage drops right in and plays.

I'd like to get the HDV 1080i60 footage converted to 60p, or even 24p as long as its slowed down. Any input?

(I found several posts about this, but wasn't related to HDV footage, only DV).

Matt Crane · January 10th, 2007, 09:16 AM

As a follow up, I don't have After Effects. Just the latest version of Final Cut Studio.

Brent Graham · January 10th, 2007, 11:43 AM

There's lots out there on this. Try another search in the Canon A1 forum...

Also, I'd suggest After Effects.

Che Butterfield · January 15th, 2007, 11:48 PM

Clip:
http://www.chebutterfield.com/A1slowmo.mov

Here's how:

I used:

Final Cut Pro 5.1.2
After Effects 6.5

1) You must shoot in 60i at 1/120th or higher shutter. Motion blur robs you of the effect and anything below 1/120th will be too blurry. You must know, that by creating progressive frames from interlaced fields you are cutting your resolution at least in half. On a positive note, it will still look better than standard def.... and when you see the liquidity of the motion you wont worry about the resolution drop.

2) You can adapt this to a number of NLEs but I will tell you how I did it using Final Cut Pro 5.1.2. Create a sequence that is 1440x1080 HDV 60i. Import your footage. Make sure it is upper field first. I think it defaults to this but don't quote me. Place it on the timeline. I exported it using photo-jpeg as I only have After Effects 6.5 and this version won't support HDV. Export a 1440x1080 file with square pixels NO AUDIO. Its best to keep as close to the originating format as possible to limit artifacting.

3) On to After Effects. Make a new composition. Use Preset: Custom, Width 1440, Height 1080, Pixel Aspect Ratio: Square Pixels, Frame Rate: 24 (since you won't have matching audio this will translate well), Duration: (length of your clip or clips)

4) Go to Project Settings in the File menu and set Timecode Base : 24fps

5) Import your footage. (make sure its 1440x1080, the frame rate should be 29.97 as we have 30 frames/60 fields of interlaced video)

6) Click on your imported footage to highlight it and go to File>Interpret Footage>Main... Under Frame click Conform to frame rate and type 24 Frames per Second. Set Separate Fields to Upper First (if your footage happens to be Lower First and you select Upper First you will know it as it will be jerky. If you don't know what you've got then you have a fifty-fifty chance of getting it right.

7) Drag the clip into the composition. Choose Layer>Time Stretch. Input 200% for the Stretch Factor. (anything over this and After Effects will start to frame blend, you will loose the ultra smooth like butter effect and gain a whole lot of motion artifacting) Click OK

8) Make sure frame blending is off in the timeline (little icon looks like a film frame) If video is blocky in comp window make sure you have a / instead of a \ between the sun icon and the f icon down in the timeline.

9) To preview make sure you see your time controls palette. Click the RAM Preview Play button on the far left of the control to get playback in super slow mo. If there is no judder, and all looks well, then render out a movie.

10) Go to Composition>Make Movie. Click on Best Settings. If not already make sure you have these settings: Quality: Best, Resolution: Full, Frame Blending: Off, Field Render: Off, 3:2 Pulldown, Off, Motion Blur: Off, Time Span: (length of your clip), Use comp's frame rate. By output module click lossless and set up your compression with whatever you used to export from FCP. Make sure Video Output is only checked. Render and import into a 24p timeline in FCP and let the super slow mo ensue.

Due credit goes to this article by Thomas Worth below and several posts by Elton Barlow (he likes the FCP plugin Standards Conversion by Graeme Natress)

http://rarevision.com/articles/slow_motion.php#

Dave Halliday · January 16th, 2007, 09:07 AM

wow, that is some clean slo-mo! great job on the write-up as well.

I doubt I'll ever spend the time to create such a clean file, but the results speak for themselves.

Che Butterfield · January 16th, 2007, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Halliday

wow, that is some clean slo-mo! great job on the write-up as well.

I doubt I'll ever spend the time to create such a clean file, but the results speak for themselves.

Thanks Dave. Its really quite easy if you have After Effects and an NLE. I really didn't do anything to massage the footage. What you see is what you get with this technique. As far as footage goes, pick something with complex motion. People or animals running or walking are always good. Complex machines make for good subject matter (manufacturing).

If you have time to fiddle with this I guarantee you will get the same if not better results. Look at the woman with the red jacket. You will see a bit of smearing. Im guessing that it is wise to stay away from oversaturated colors. Does anyone know if there is a way to avoid this strobing?

Show your footage to a friend with an HVX and don't tell him how you got it. See what they say when you tell them its from your A1. I've noticed HVX users touting their variable frame rate. For the record, how often do you see slow motion on TV, most movies, not a whole lot. Its still nice to know A1 users have it in our arsenal too.

Matt Crane · January 22nd, 2007, 06:24 AM

That IS some clean slow-mo. And thanks for the write up.

I just wish there was a way to do this in Final Cut, since I don't have After Effects....

Che Butterfield · January 22nd, 2007, 12:25 PM

Wish granted:

http://www.nattress.com/Products/sta...conversion.htm

Noel Evans · January 23rd, 2007, 12:14 AM

Nattress plugin works beautifully.

Tony Tibbetts · January 23rd, 2007, 01:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noel Evans

Nattress plugin works beautifully.

Which plug in and what settings? I have yet to figure out how this is accomplished. I know it's located in Standards Conversion, but what is the process?

Jason Burkhimer · January 30th, 2007, 08:46 PM

any solution for this in Sony Vegas?

Ali Husain · January 31st, 2007, 01:07 AM

you can do better in vegas by adding a supersampling envelope with a value of 2. i believe the stuff that doesn't move between frames gets almost full resolution after the de-interlacing. i could be wrong on this, but it sure looks like that. it's magic and i love it. any vegas experts to comment?

Matt Crane · January 31st, 2007, 06:35 AM

Not owning After Effects, I'm still frustrated as I can't find a way to make this happen.

It really should be a feature Final Cut has natively.

Jason Burkhimer · January 31st, 2007, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ali Husain

you can do better in vegas by adding a supersampling envelope with a value of 2. i believe the stuff that doesn't move between frames gets almost full resolution after the de-interlacing. i could be wrong on this, but it sure looks like that. it's magic and i love it. any vegas experts to comment?

when i get my cam in ill give that a try, thanks man!

Barlow Elton · February 2nd, 2007, 01:03 AM

Here's how I do it in FCP:

--Drop a 1080i clip into a custom uncompressed 1080 60p (seriously!) sequence.
--Apply Nattress Standards Conversion Filter
--Select "Map Frames" and then choose "Fields to Frames HQ"
--You'll be prompted to drop the original clip from the bin into the image well of the filters tab

The interface should look like this attachment:

Export the clip as a self-contained QT movie, bring it into Cinema Tools and conform the frame rate to 23.98 (from 1080 60p) and then scale and recompress to whatever codec you're editing in.

January 10th, 2007, 08:08 AM	#1
Matt Crane Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Suffolk, VA Posts: 58	XH A1 24F project, 60i to 24F slow mo ? So I'm shooting a short film in HDV 24F with my XH A1, but want to do some slow-mo shots. What is the best way to take the 1080i60 footage into my Final Cut Pro 1080p24 project? The Canon HDV 24F footage drops right in and plays. I'd like to get the HDV 1080i60 footage converted to 60p, or even 24p as long as its slowed down. Any input? (I found several posts about this, but wasn't related to HDV footage, only DV).

January 15th, 2007, 11:48 PM	#4
Che Butterfield New Boot Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 24	Super Slow Mo with A1 in 10 Easy Steps Clip: http://www.chebutterfield.com/A1slowmo.mov Here's how: I used: Final Cut Pro 5.1.2 After Effects 6.5 1) You must shoot in 60i at 1/120th or higher shutter. Motion blur robs you of the effect and anything below 1/120th will be too blurry. You must know, that by creating progressive frames from interlaced fields you are cutting your resolution at least in half. On a positive note, it will still look better than standard def.... and when you see the liquidity of the motion you wont worry about the resolution drop. 2) You can adapt this to a number of NLEs but I will tell you how I did it using Final Cut Pro 5.1.2. Create a sequence that is 1440x1080 HDV 60i. Import your footage. Make sure it is upper field first. I think it defaults to this but don't quote me. Place it on the timeline. I exported it using photo-jpeg as I only have After Effects 6.5 and this version won't support HDV. Export a 1440x1080 file with square pixels NO AUDIO. Its best to keep as close to the originating format as possible to limit artifacting. 3) On to After Effects. Make a new composition. Use Preset: Custom, Width 1440, Height 1080, Pixel Aspect Ratio: Square Pixels, Frame Rate: 24 (since you won't have matching audio this will translate well), Duration: (length of your clip or clips) 4) Go to Project Settings in the File menu and set Timecode Base : 24fps 5) Import your footage. (make sure its 1440x1080, the frame rate should be 29.97 as we have 30 frames/60 fields of interlaced video) 6) Click on your imported footage to highlight it and go to File>Interpret Footage>Main... Under Frame click Conform to frame rate and type 24 Frames per Second. Set Separate Fields to Upper First (if your footage happens to be Lower First and you select Upper First you will know it as it will be jerky. If you don't know what you've got then you have a fifty-fifty chance of getting it right. 7) Drag the clip into the composition. Choose Layer>Time Stretch. Input 200% for the Stretch Factor. (anything over this and After Effects will start to frame blend, you will loose the ultra smooth like butter effect and gain a whole lot of motion artifacting) Click OK 8) Make sure frame blending is off in the timeline (little icon looks like a film frame) If video is blocky in comp window make sure you have a / instead of a \ between the sun icon and the f icon down in the timeline. 9) To preview make sure you see your time controls palette. Click the RAM Preview Play button on the far left of the control to get playback in super slow mo. If there is no judder, and all looks well, then render out a movie. 10) Go to Composition>Make Movie. Click on Best Settings. If not already make sure you have these settings: Quality: Best, Resolution: Full, Frame Blending: Off, Field Render: Off, 3:2 Pulldown, Off, Motion Blur: Off, Time Span: (length of your clip), Use comp's frame rate. By output module click lossless and set up your compression with whatever you used to export from FCP. Make sure Video Output is only checked. Render and import into a 24p timeline in FCP and let the super slow mo ensue. Due credit goes to this article by Thomas Worth below and several posts by Elton Barlow (he likes the FCP plugin Standards Conversion by Graeme Natress) http://rarevision.com/articles/slow_motion.php#

February 2nd, 2007, 01:03 AM	#15
Barlow Elton Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UT Posts: 945	Here's how I do it in FCP: --Drop a 1080i clip into a custom uncompressed 1080 60p (seriously!) sequence. --Apply Nattress Standards Conversion Filter --Select "Map Frames" and then choose "Fields to Frames HQ" --You'll be prompted to drop the original clip from the bin into the image well of the filters tab The interface should look like this attachment: Export the clip as a self-contained QT movie, bring it into Cinema Tools and conform the frame rate to 23.98 (from 1080 60p) and then scale and recompress to whatever codec you're editing in. Attached Thumbnails

January 10th, 2007, 09:16 AM	#2
Matt Crane Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Suffolk, VA Posts: 58	As a follow up, I don't have After Effects. Just the latest version of Final Cut Studio.

January 10th, 2007, 11:43 AM	#3
Brent Graham Major Player Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 222	There's lots out there on this. Try another search in the Canon A1 forum... Also, I'd suggest After Effects.

January 16th, 2007, 09:07 AM	#5
Dave Halliday Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Washington DC Posts: 116	wow, that is some clean slo-mo! great job on the write-up as well. I doubt I'll ever spend the time to create such a clean file, but the results speak for themselves.

January 22nd, 2007, 06:24 AM	#7
Matt Crane Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Suffolk, VA Posts: 58	That IS some clean slow-mo. And thanks for the write up. I just wish there was a way to do this in Final Cut, since I don't have After Effects....

January 22nd, 2007, 12:25 PM	#8
Che Butterfield New Boot Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 24	Wish granted: http://www.nattress.com/Products/sta...conversion.htm

January 23rd, 2007, 12:14 AM	#9
Noel Evans Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Tokyo, Japan Posts: 157	Nattress plugin works beautifully.

January 30th, 2007, 08:46 PM	#11
Jason Burkhimer Major Player Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 220	any solution for this in Sony Vegas?

January 31st, 2007, 01:07 AM	#12
Ali Husain Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 141	you can do better in vegas by adding a supersampling envelope with a value of 2. i believe the stuff that doesn't move between frames gets almost full resolution after the de-interlacing. i could be wrong on this, but it sure looks like that. it's magic and i love it. any vegas experts to comment?

January 31st, 2007, 06:35 AM	#13
Matt Crane Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Suffolk, VA Posts: 58	Not owning After Effects, I'm still frustrated as I can't find a way to make this happen. It really should be a feature Final Cut has natively.