What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? at DVinfo.net

Allan Black · May 15th, 2022, 01:24 PM

Can anyone tell me what’s a suitable data storage device to attach to Canon XH-A1 and A1s cameras? I’m selling both and would like to be able to tell the buyer what tapeless units he or she can buy.

Both the Sony HVR-MRC1K and the Datavideo DN-60A are discontinued and I haven’t seen any on sale anywhere.

Cheers.

John Nantz · May 15th, 2022, 04:12 PM

Allan - Would a previously owned or used model work?

If it helps any, in the case of the Sony, a check with the US eBay site there was one "K" model listed; however, there are a number of HVR-MRC1 units advertised. As a suggestion, one might search for the non-"K" model numbers.

A reply to an old 2010 post on DVinfo indicated the K may indicate a "Kit" model that included the cradle.

The eBay search for the Datavideo DN-60A didn't come up with anything.

Disclaimer: I have no idea what the current shipping and customs hassle would be like with buying from overseas. Certainly, with a used item, one would have to be very careful. Years ago I hitchhiked around New Zealand and it was obvious that everything from the US was "very dear".

Allan Black · May 15th, 2022, 07:16 PM

Thanks John I appreciate your reply.

I wasn’t intending to buy a unit, just have the info. to let a buyer of the camera know what’s available and I thought you may know of a different unit. A closer look on eBay I see there’s a couple of used Sony HVR-MRC1K units for sale in Japan, and now I’m wondering whether buying one, will better the chance of selling my tape based Canon XH-A1, also for a better price of course. Check this out …

https://www.ebay.com/itm/31382293999...Cclp%3A2047675

The Sony and Datavideo units were discontinued, probably because sales were slowing when new models of DVtape cameras stopped.
Cheers.

Don Palomaki · May 19th, 2022, 06:23 AM

Beyond finding legacy gear on the used market, which is spotty at best. An approach with new gear is sort of a kludge given that most if not all current production portable recorders are HDMI or SDI input, but it might work. Just more gear to lug about in a fanny/belt pack. At least the recorder could give a larger screen monitor as well.

Get a component to HDMI converter and battery power it, perhaps something like:
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/918747-REG/startech_cpnta2hdmi_component_to_hdmi.html/BI/2855/KBID/3801
Since it uses 5 VDC power one of the USB battery power packs might work if you can find or make a connecting cable.

Note that I have not tried it so this is just speculation.

Allan Black · May 19th, 2022, 05:38 PM

Thanks Don, interesting. As you saw when selling a Canon XH-A1, I’d like to be able to recommend a tapeless unit.

Cheers.

Don Palomaki · May 22nd, 2022, 10:19 AM

For kicks I tried a low cost RCA-to-HDMI converter with both a HD (Canon XA10) and HDV (Canon VIXIA HV40) camcorder live camera component output. I fed the converter's HDMI output to a BMD Intensity Pro 4K card and captured with BMD Media Express. I used a Macbeth color chart and a generic resolution chart as targets. The captures were 1080i NTSC. The Media express frame grab was converted to JPG forup loading.

Screens grab of the result from the HV40 live camera feed is attached. This was with the camcorder in AUTO mode and no attempt was made to better frame, focus, or balance the image. Results from the XA10 were similar. The targets were lit by room LED ceiling lighting. My intent was to see if the low cost device worked with a Canon HDV camcorder output and whether a typical HDMI capture card could see the output.

The device is:
"https://www.amazon.com/Component-Converter-YPBPR-Support-Player/dp/B07TYBLFYM/ref=sr_1_3?crid=JRGXET1CEDR2&keywords=component%2Bto%2Bhdmi%2Bconverter&qid=1653236465&sprefix=compo nent%2Bto%2Bhdmi%2Bconverter%2Caps%2C55&sr=8-3&th=1"

I powered it with the furnished USB supply and with a "VERITAS" USB batter pack I have.. I don't have a Atmos or similar device so I cannot assess whether it would work in that context. Yet at around $21 it not a big investment. My take is that It is compact solution and appears to work fairly well. Cable/cord management in the field may well be the biggest issue.

There are a number of similar devices available at around the same price point.

Boyd Ostroff · May 22nd, 2022, 10:49 AM

FWIW, I have one of these (it is apparently discontinued) and used it for awhile to connect the component output of a Sony HVR-M15U HDV tape deck to a monitor that only had HDMI. It also converts the audio but I didn't use that feature.

Sewell Direct Midas Component To Hdmi With Upscaling Technology: Amazon.co.uk: Electronics & Photo

Looking on Sewell's site, it appears they no longer sell any type of component to HDMI converters. It's pretty similar to the device that Dan linked to at B&H Photo... but this was cheaper, IIRC it was about half that cost when I got it back around 2016.

Allan Black · June 27th, 2022, 07:55 PM

Hi all. Luckily via eBAY recently I managed to buy a ‘mint condition’ Sony HVR-MRC1K from a shop in Japan at an excellent price. And it has the latest Firmware V3. It looks like the K refers to the HVRA-CR1 cradle which came with it.

I also bought batteries with a charger from Amazon Aust., ‘Neewer’ a brand I’ve never heard of before. Amazingly they home delivered them last Saturday night.

I’m now planning to save ‘the best of the best’ from a large library of HARS DV tapes shot with a Canon XH-A1 and a XH-A1s over a number of years. This will save historical video for HARS and clear a great number of DV tapes for sale with the cameras.

I’m not concerned with mounting the Sony on the camera (yet) they’ll just sit side by side. The next thing is to cable them together. Both the Sony and the XH-A1s have FireWire 400 but the XH-A1 doesn’t, so I bought a FW to FW cable to be able to use the A1s for the transfers. Buying large suitable CF cards in Sydney has become difficult, so Amazon Aust. to the rescue again and I’m waiting for a 64GB SanDisc CF type B card, which has to be imported by them.
Cheers.

Allan Black · July 1st, 2022, 03:36 PM

The SanDisc arrived but it’s the wrong type, fortunately a friend will take it. But what does everyone else successfully use?
Cheers.

Roger Van Duyn · July 2nd, 2022, 05:20 AM

When I still had my two DN-60 units, I was only able to use the supply of CF cards I bought when I first bought the two units new. The standards for CF cards changed and new cards would NOT work with the DN-60s. I tried to find more cards, but was unsuccessful. Even B&H. Maybe this the link to this document will help you.

https://datavideo.zendesk.com/hc/en-...atibility-List

Sorry, I somehow thought you'd gotten a Datavideo device instead of the Sony. I wonder if the change in CF standards caused a similar problem with all the CF recorders made back then? For indoor shoots, if you could find an old laptop with Firewire you could tether to it.

I really liked my Canon XH-A1 and A1S, but am so glad I switched to newer cameras that used easy to find SD cards.

Allan Black · July 2nd, 2022, 05:58 PM

Hi Roger, thanks for your reply and your info from sunny Florida, it’s pouring rain here. For 5 years I was the vid producer for the Historical Aircraft Restoration Society here and now I’d like to save the historical footage for their archives and erase the DV tapes for sale with the Canon XH-A1 and A1s cameras.

Looking at the release dates of my HVR-MRC1, it’s Firmware V3 and the revisions of the Compact Flash cards, it looks like my MRC1 might be outdated, unless I can find older cards, which I haven’t to date.

But there is a 2022 MRC1 update available, it doesn’t suit me and the site is rated by Norton as unsafe … Firmware hvr mrc1 Full guides for Download and update firmware on you ... updated 02 Jul 2022

So it looks like Sony is still actively supporting their HVR-MRC1. I guess what we’d like to see is a new Firmware V4, to cope with new version CF cards.
Cheers.

Allan Black · July 3rd, 2022, 12:34 AM

Hi Roger, I might be making more out of this than is necessary. I looked up B&H which still has the HVR-MRC1 listed even though it’s discontinued. The current Compact Flash Card is still listed as an accessory for sale …

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/580065-REG/Sony_HVR_MRC1K_HVR_MRC1_Memory_Recording_Unit.html/specs/BI/2855/KBID/3801

I think I know where to get one locally, the reviews at B&H are interesting too.
Cheers.

Don Palomaki · July 3rd, 2022, 04:14 AM

I wonder if one of the SD-to-CF adapters would work? Reviews are mixed.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search/BI/2855/KBID/3801

Is the 64GB SanDisc CF type B card a CFExpress card? The CFExpress came out in around 2016 and has a different interface from the original CF cards so it likely is not compatible with older gear.

Allan Black · July 3rd, 2022, 08:34 PM

Years ago on this forum I read some good advice where, if you want to find older obscure gear, try in a big retail camera shop that has a good ‘bits and pieces’ bin.

And that’s what’s just happened, I tried a big shop here when it was quieter and the eldest shop assistant knew exactly what I wanted. So now I’ve got 3 pre-owned SanDisk Extreme 32GB cards which all formatted in the Sony.

The difference between these and a brand new SanDisk CF card which doesn’t format is, mine has UDMA listed on them, and the new card has UDMA7. I guess that’s the clue Don.
Cheers.

Allan Black · July 29th, 2022, 09:59 PM

You take a bit of a chance I suppose but via eBay, I now have another 4 new SanDisk 32GB flash cards all marked UDMA, and they all format in the Sony HVR-MRC1.

Mini DV dry cleaning tapes are not available in Australia anymore. So if that means they’re not being produced now, I also bought 5 Panasonic AY-DVMCLWW tapes from Amazon.com to eventually sell with my Canon XH-A1 and A1s cameras.
Cheers.

May 15th, 2022, 01:24 PM	#1
Allan Black Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Sydney. Posts: 2,931	What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? Can anyone tell me what’s a suitable data storage device to attach to Canon XH-A1 and A1s cameras? I’m selling both and would like to be able to tell the buyer what tapeless units he or she can buy. Both the Sony HVR-MRC1K and the Datavideo DN-60A are discontinued and I haven’t seen any on sale anywhere. Cheers. __________________ Drink more tap water. On admission at Sydney hospitals more than 5% of day patients are de-hydrated.

May 15th, 2022, 04:12 PM	#2
John Nantz Trustee Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Seattle WA Posts: 1,254	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? Allan - Would a previously owned or used model work? If it helps any, in the case of the Sony, a check with the US eBay site there was one "K" model listed; however, there are a number of HVR-MRC1 units advertised. As a suggestion, one might search for the non-"K" model numbers. A reply to an old 2010 post on DVinfo indicated the K may indicate a "Kit" model that included the cradle. The eBay search for the Datavideo DN-60A didn't come up with anything. Disclaimer: I have no idea what the current shipping and customs hassle would be like with buying from overseas. Certainly, with a used item, one would have to be very careful. Years ago I hitchhiked around New Zealand and it was obvious that everything from the US was "very dear".

May 15th, 2022, 07:16 PM	#3
Allan Black Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Sydney. Posts: 2,931	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? Thanks John I appreciate your reply. I wasn’t intending to buy a unit, just have the info. to let a buyer of the camera know what’s available and I thought you may know of a different unit. A closer look on eBay I see there’s a couple of used Sony HVR-MRC1K units for sale in Japan, and now I’m wondering whether buying one, will better the chance of selling my tape based Canon XH-A1, also for a better price of course. Check this out … https://www.ebay.com/itm/31382293999...Cclp%3A2047675 The Sony and Datavideo units were discontinued, probably because sales were slowing when new models of DVtape cameras stopped. Cheers. __________________ Drink more tap water. On admission at Sydney hospitals more than 5% of day patients are de-hydrated.

May 19th, 2022, 06:23 AM	#4
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,489	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? Beyond finding legacy gear on the used market, which is spotty at best. An approach with new gear is sort of a kludge given that most if not all current production portable recorders are HDMI or SDI input, but it might work. Just more gear to lug about in a fanny/belt pack. At least the recorder could give a larger screen monitor as well. Get a component to HDMI converter and battery power it, perhaps something like: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/918747-REG/startech_cpnta2hdmi_component_to_hdmi.html/BI/2855/KBID/3801 Since it uses 5 VDC power one of the USB battery power packs might work if you can find or make a connecting cable. Note that I have not tried it so this is just speculation. __________________ dpalomaki@dspalomaki.com

May 19th, 2022, 05:38 PM	#5
Allan Black Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Sydney. Posts: 2,931	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? Thanks Don, interesting. As you saw when selling a Canon XH-A1, I’d like to be able to recommend a tapeless unit. Cheers. __________________ Drink more tap water. On admission at Sydney hospitals more than 5% of day patients are de-hydrated.

May 22nd, 2022, 10:19 AM	#6
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,489	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? For kicks I tried a low cost RCA-to-HDMI converter with both a HD (Canon XA10) and HDV (Canon VIXIA HV40) camcorder live camera component output. I fed the converter's HDMI output to a BMD Intensity Pro 4K card and captured with BMD Media Express. I used a Macbeth color chart and a generic resolution chart as targets. The captures were 1080i NTSC. The Media express frame grab was converted to JPG forup loading. Screens grab of the result from the HV40 live camera feed is attached. This was with the camcorder in AUTO mode and no attempt was made to better frame, focus, or balance the image. Results from the XA10 were similar. The targets were lit by room LED ceiling lighting. My intent was to see if the low cost device worked with a Canon HDV camcorder output and whether a typical HDMI capture card could see the output. The device is: "https://www.amazon.com/Component-Converter-YPBPR-Support-Player/dp/B07TYBLFYM/ref=sr_1_3?crid=JRGXET1CEDR2&keywords=component%2Bto%2Bhdmi%2Bconverter&qid=1653236465&sprefix=compo nent%2Bto%2Bhdmi%2Bconverter%2Caps%2C55&sr=8-3&th=1" I powered it with the furnished USB supply and with a "VERITAS" USB batter pack I have.. I don't have a Atmos or similar device so I cannot assess whether it would work in that context. Yet at around $21 it not a big investment. My take is that It is compact solution and appears to work fairly well. Cable/cord management in the field may well be the biggest issue. There are a number of similar devices available at around the same price point. Attached Thumbnails __________________ dpalomaki@dspalomaki.com

May 22nd, 2022, 10:49 AM	#7
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? FWIW, I have one of these (it is apparently discontinued) and used it for awhile to connect the component output of a Sony HVR-M15U HDV tape deck to a monitor that only had HDMI. It also converts the audio but I didn't use that feature. Sewell Direct Midas Component To Hdmi With Upscaling Technology: Amazon.co.uk: Electronics & Photo Sewell Direct Midas Component To Hdmi With Upscaling Technology: Amazon.co.uk: Electronics & Photo Looking on Sewell's site, it appears they no longer sell any type of component to HDMI converters. It's pretty similar to the device that Dan linked to at B&H Photo... but this was cheaper, IIRC it was about half that cost when I got it back around 2016.

June 27th, 2022, 07:55 PM	#8
Allan Black Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Sydney. Posts: 2,931	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? Hi all. Luckily via eBAY recently I managed to buy a ‘mint condition’ Sony HVR-MRC1K from a shop in Japan at an excellent price. And it has the latest Firmware V3. It looks like the K refers to the HVRA-CR1 cradle which came with it. I also bought batteries with a charger from Amazon Aust., ‘Neewer’ a brand I’ve never heard of before. Amazingly they home delivered them last Saturday night. I’m now planning to save ‘the best of the best’ from a large library of HARS DV tapes shot with a Canon XH-A1 and a XH-A1s over a number of years. This will save historical video for HARS and clear a great number of DV tapes for sale with the cameras. I’m not concerned with mounting the Sony on the camera (yet) they’ll just sit side by side. The next thing is to cable them together. Both the Sony and the XH-A1s have FireWire 400 but the XH-A1 doesn’t, so I bought a FW to FW cable to be able to use the A1s for the transfers. Buying large suitable CF cards in Sydney has become difficult, so Amazon Aust. to the rescue again and I’m waiting for a 64GB SanDisc CF type B card, which has to be imported by them. Cheers. __________________ Drink more tap water. On admission at Sydney hospitals more than 5% of day patients are de-hydrated.

July 1st, 2022, 03:36 PM	#9
Allan Black Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Sydney. Posts: 2,931	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? The SanDisc arrived but it’s the wrong type, fortunately a friend will take it. But what does everyone else successfully use? Cheers. __________________ Drink more tap water. On admission at Sydney hospitals more than 5% of day patients are de-hydrated.

July 2nd, 2022, 05:20 AM	#10
Roger Van Duyn Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Lakeland Florida Posts: 692	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? When I still had my two DN-60 units, I was only able to use the supply of CF cards I bought when I first bought the two units new. The standards for CF cards changed and new cards would NOT work with the DN-60s. I tried to find more cards, but was unsuccessful. Even B&H. Maybe this the link to this document will help you. https://datavideo.zendesk.com/hc/en-...atibility-List Sorry, I somehow thought you'd gotten a Datavideo device instead of the Sony. I wonder if the change in CF standards caused a similar problem with all the CF recorders made back then? For indoor shoots, if you could find an old laptop with Firewire you could tether to it. I really liked my Canon XH-A1 and A1S, but am so glad I switched to newer cameras that used easy to find SD cards. __________________ Roger My YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAp...2AHr_pHFID5LDA Last edited by Roger Van Duyn; July 2nd, 2022 at 05:39 AM. Reason: reread previous posts and saw I'd made a wrong assumption.

July 2nd, 2022, 05:58 PM	#11
Allan Black Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Sydney. Posts: 2,931	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? Hi Roger, thanks for your reply and your info from sunny Florida, it’s pouring rain here. For 5 years I was the vid producer for the Historical Aircraft Restoration Society here and now I’d like to save the historical footage for their archives and erase the DV tapes for sale with the Canon XH-A1 and A1s cameras. Looking at the release dates of my HVR-MRC1, it’s Firmware V3 and the revisions of the Compact Flash cards, it looks like my MRC1 might be outdated, unless I can find older cards, which I haven’t to date. But there is a 2022 MRC1 update available, it doesn’t suit me and the site is rated by Norton as unsafe … Firmware hvr mrc1 Full guides for Download and update firmware on you ... updated 02 Jul 2022 So it looks like Sony is still actively supporting their HVR-MRC1. I guess what we’d like to see is a new Firmware V4, to cope with new version CF cards. Cheers. __________________ Drink more tap water. On admission at Sydney hospitals more than 5% of day patients are de-hydrated.

July 3rd, 2022, 12:34 AM	#12
Allan Black Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Sydney. Posts: 2,931	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? Hi Roger, I might be making more out of this than is necessary. I looked up B&H which still has the HVR-MRC1 listed even though it’s discontinued. The current Compact Flash Card is still listed as an accessory for sale … https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/580065-REG/Sony_HVR_MRC1K_HVR_MRC1_Memory_Recording_Unit.html/specs/BI/2855/KBID/3801 I think I know where to get one locally, the reviews at B&H are interesting too. Cheers. __________________ Drink more tap water. On admission at Sydney hospitals more than 5% of day patients are de-hydrated.

July 3rd, 2022, 04:14 AM	#13
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,489	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? I wonder if one of the SD-to-CF adapters would work? Reviews are mixed. https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search/BI/2855/KBID/3801 Is the 64GB SanDisc CF type B card a CFExpress card? The CFExpress came out in around 2016 and has a different interface from the original CF cards so it likely is not compatible with older gear. __________________ dpalomaki@dspalomaki.com

July 3rd, 2022, 08:34 PM	#14
Allan Black Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Sydney. Posts: 2,931	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? Years ago on this forum I read some good advice where, if you want to find older obscure gear, try in a big retail camera shop that has a good ‘bits and pieces’ bin. And that’s what’s just happened, I tried a big shop here when it was quieter and the eldest shop assistant knew exactly what I wanted. So now I’ve got 3 pre-owned SanDisk Extreme 32GB cards which all formatted in the Sony. The difference between these and a brand new SanDisk CF card which doesn’t format is, mine has UDMA listed on them, and the new card has UDMA7. I guess that’s the clue Don. Cheers. __________________ Drink more tap water. On admission at Sydney hospitals more than 5% of day patients are de-hydrated.

July 29th, 2022, 09:59 PM	#15
Allan Black Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Sydney. Posts: 2,931	Re: What’s a suitable tapeless storage device still available in 2022? You take a bit of a chance I suppose but via eBay, I now have another 4 new SanDisk 32GB flash cards all marked UDMA, and they all format in the Sony HVR-MRC1. Mini DV dry cleaning tapes are not available in Australia anymore. So if that means they’re not being produced now, I also bought 5 Panasonic AY-DVMCLWW tapes from Amazon.com to eventually sell with my Canon XH-A1 and A1s cameras. Cheers. __________________ Drink more tap water. On admission at Sydney hospitals more than 5% of day patients are de-hydrated.