720p? at DVinfo.net

Kevin Lewis · November 6th, 2011, 12:23 PM

I frequently see posts where people state that they have shot a particular project in 720P. What exactly does this mean? Do some cameras have a separate 720P setting? Is this the same as shooting 30F on the xha1 which I typically shoot? Also, is it possible for an editing system to render out 1080P with files created with the xha1?

Mark Donnell · November 6th, 2011, 04:54 PM

Kevin - 720p refers to shooting a progressive frame at 1280x720 frame size, which is one of two common high definition video sizes (the other being 1080, or 1920x1200 frame size). Most better high def cameras offer the option of shooting 1080i (interlaced) at 60 fps, or 1080p at 30 or 24 fps, or 720p at 60 fps or less. A progressive frame is shot by scanning all 720 or 1080 horizontal lines sequentially, as opposed to an interlaced frame where only every other line is recorded, followed by the in-between lines. The 720p or 1080p formats have an advantage over interlaced formats when recording scenes with a lot of action, such as sports events, car races, etc. Your 30F setting should be equivalent to a 30p mode, and if you are shooting in 720 30F, some editing systems can upconvert this to 1080P, but I would recommend against it. Your 720 30F footage should come out looking very good just as it is.

Kevin Lewis · November 6th, 2011, 05:32 PM

The xha1 shoots 1080i so I assume that shooting720p is not an option. I typically shoot 30f then render out to 720p. Since I am shooting 1080i can assume that I can render out to 1080p? Also do sites like vimeo and youtube accept 1080p, which I am assumeing will look much better than 720p?

Mark Donnell · November 7th, 2011, 03:17 PM

I may have to defer to someone who uses your type of camera, but if you have the choice of 1080i 60 or 1080i 30F, the latter should be nearly equivalent to 1080p 30. The 30F implies that 30 fps is encoded within 1080i by using two interlaced fields to make a frame. If you have a good editing program, I would try converting your footage to 1080p 30 fps MPEG-2. Again, maybe someone with this camera can suggest the best workflow.

Kevin Lewis · November 7th, 2011, 05:42 PM

Thanks for your input Mark. 1080 60i produces a very clear and sharp image. Howver it has that "video" look to it. I guess ultimatly what im trying to do is keep that same sharp image in a progressive mode. Thats why I thought that rendering out to 60p might give a good look. My current system does not render to 60p which is why I havent just tested it.

Gregory Gesch · November 7th, 2011, 06:55 PM

Hi Kevin. I suspect you might be getting a few things confused.
If you shoot at 30F it is the same as 30p (30 full frames [progressive]).
When you shoot at 60i you record 60 half frames [interlaced] which are played back at 30 frames per second (60 half frames = 30 full frames)
The 1080/720 is the number of pixels recorded regardless of your frame rate.
So you can shoot at 30F, import it and it will be 30p as you have normally done (except that it will be 1080 not 720).

Kevin Lewis · November 7th, 2011, 09:25 PM

Thanks for the additional input Greg. I guess what i'm ultimatly trying to determine is if I shoot 30f and export from an nle at 60p will the 60p footage be better than the original 30f. If this is even possible.

Mark Donnell · November 7th, 2011, 10:22 PM

Its not really possible to convert 30p (or 30F) to 60p. Its like trying to create 60 pictures from 30 pictures. No editing system that I am aware of can take two frames and create an "in between" frame, which is what you are asking for. I still think that your 30F video is about as good as you can get. No standard codecs (MPEG-2, DVCPRO HD, AVC-intra, WMV) currently support 1080p 60 fps video, so if you really want 60 fps, you need to go to the 720p format.

Kevin Lewis · November 8th, 2011, 07:03 AM

Ok, thanks guys.

Josh Keffer · November 9th, 2011, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin Lewis

Also do sites like vimeo and youtube accept 1080p, which I am assumeing will look much better than 720p?

Yes, they do. However, I don't think that 1080 or 720 usually makes a significant difference when viewed on the web. Either way can look great.

Alex Humphrey · March 8th, 2013, 06:57 PM

Also 1080 video is ugly bandwidth hog and most will opt for the 720 or 420 viewer anyway. Oh and 30p/f is really only valid for 60hz countries. Since most of the world is 50hz 30p/f never play well. NTSC 24p/f or PAL/SECOM 25p are world wide standards for DVD, blueray, web upload etc. Uploading 24/25p in your region improves consistency for world wide viewers. Just one of those things to think about.

November 6th, 2011, 12:23 PM	#1
Kevin Lewis Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Philadelphia, pa Posts: 705	720p? I frequently see posts where people state that they have shot a particular project in 720P. What exactly does this mean? Do some cameras have a separate 720P setting? Is this the same as shooting 30F on the xha1 which I typically shoot? Also, is it possible for an editing system to render out 1080P with files created with the xha1?

November 6th, 2011, 04:54 PM	#2
Mark Donnell Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Silver City, NM Posts: 385	Re: 720p? Kevin - 720p refers to shooting a progressive frame at 1280x720 frame size, which is one of two common high definition video sizes (the other being 1080, or 1920x1200 frame size). Most better high def cameras offer the option of shooting 1080i (interlaced) at 60 fps, or 1080p at 30 or 24 fps, or 720p at 60 fps or less. A progressive frame is shot by scanning all 720 or 1080 horizontal lines sequentially, as opposed to an interlaced frame where only every other line is recorded, followed by the in-between lines. The 720p or 1080p formats have an advantage over interlaced formats when recording scenes with a lot of action, such as sports events, car races, etc. Your 30F setting should be equivalent to a 30p mode, and if you are shooting in 720 30F, some editing systems can upconvert this to 1080P, but I would recommend against it. Your 720 30F footage should come out looking very good just as it is.

November 6th, 2011, 05:32 PM	#3
Kevin Lewis Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Philadelphia, pa Posts: 705	Re: 720p? The xha1 shoots 1080i so I assume that shooting720p is not an option. I typically shoot 30f then render out to 720p. Since I am shooting 1080i can assume that I can render out to 1080p? Also do sites like vimeo and youtube accept 1080p, which I am assumeing will look much better than 720p?

November 7th, 2011, 03:17 PM	#4
Mark Donnell Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Silver City, NM Posts: 385	Re: 720p? I may have to defer to someone who uses your type of camera, but if you have the choice of 1080i 60 or 1080i 30F, the latter should be nearly equivalent to 1080p 30. The 30F implies that 30 fps is encoded within 1080i by using two interlaced fields to make a frame. If you have a good editing program, I would try converting your footage to 1080p 30 fps MPEG-2. Again, maybe someone with this camera can suggest the best workflow.

November 7th, 2011, 05:42 PM	#5
Kevin Lewis Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Philadelphia, pa Posts: 705	Re: 720p? Thanks for your input Mark. 1080 60i produces a very clear and sharp image. Howver it has that "video" look to it. I guess ultimatly what im trying to do is keep that same sharp image in a progressive mode. Thats why I thought that rendering out to 60p might give a good look. My current system does not render to 60p which is why I havent just tested it.

November 7th, 2011, 06:55 PM	#6
Gregory Gesch Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Brisbane Australia Posts: 114	Re: 720p? Hi Kevin. I suspect you might be getting a few things confused. If you shoot at 30F it is the same as 30p (30 full frames [progressive]). When you shoot at 60i you record 60 half frames [interlaced] which are played back at 30 frames per second (60 half frames = 30 full frames) The 1080/720 is the number of pixels recorded regardless of your frame rate. So you can shoot at 30F, import it and it will be 30p as you have normally done (except that it will be 1080 not 720).

November 7th, 2011, 09:25 PM	#7
Kevin Lewis Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Philadelphia, pa Posts: 705	Re: 720p? Thanks for the additional input Greg. I guess what i'm ultimatly trying to determine is if I shoot 30f and export from an nle at 60p will the 60p footage be better than the original 30f. If this is even possible.

November 7th, 2011, 10:22 PM	#8
Mark Donnell Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Silver City, NM Posts: 385	Re: 720p? Its not really possible to convert 30p (or 30F) to 60p. Its like trying to create 60 pictures from 30 pictures. No editing system that I am aware of can take two frames and create an "in between" frame, which is what you are asking for. I still think that your 30F video is about as good as you can get. No standard codecs (MPEG-2, DVCPRO HD, AVC-intra, WMV) currently support 1080p 60 fps video, so if you really want 60 fps, you need to go to the 720p format.

November 8th, 2011, 07:03 AM	#9
Kevin Lewis Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Philadelphia, pa Posts: 705	Re: 720p? Ok, thanks guys.

March 8th, 2013, 06:57 PM	#11
Alex Humphrey Major Player Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: california North and South Posts: 642	Re: 720p? Also 1080 video is ugly bandwidth hog and most will opt for the 720 or 420 viewer anyway. Oh and 30p/f is really only valid for 60hz countries. Since most of the world is 50hz 30p/f never play well. NTSC 24p/f or PAL/SECOM 25p are world wide standards for DVD, blueray, web upload etc. Uploading 24/25p in your region improves consistency for world wide viewers. Just one of those things to think about.