SD or HD? at DVinfo.net

G. Randy Brown · July 18th, 2010, 08:22 AM

Hey,
If I know a project is going to DVD and not blu-ray is there any advantage to shooting HD and then downconverting in post or is it better to just shoot SD widescreen?
Thanks very much,
Randy

Bruce Watson · July 18th, 2010, 08:41 AM

Given a choice, I always shoot at the maximum capabilities of the camera. Because I never know if the footage will be needed for something else later. IOW, one never knows if a client won't come back later and want that same "DVD only" project reworked for blu-ray. It's usually better to downrez than to uprez.

The cost of doing this is increased file sizes, and increased processing time which is often not that big a penalty with modern hardware.

David W. Jones · July 18th, 2010, 11:59 AM

I tend to always acquire in HD even when delivering in SD.
It gives me the option to resize the shot if needed.

By the way, I do a ton of voice work in Las Cruces.
Just wondering what it's like there?

Dave

Les Wilson · July 18th, 2010, 12:10 PM

I've see some HV footage edited on Premier that has downrez artifacts that match this article's explanation of what can happen when shooting HD and producing SD: XDCAM-USER.com Getting SD from HD and the problems of oversampling.

I use Final Cut Pro and an A1 and have been pleased with the downrezing. If your camera/NLE/DVD packages don't do a good job, your camera's DownConvert may do better. That way you can have the benefits of capture and archive at HD.

G. Randy Brown · July 18th, 2010, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David W. Jones

I tend to always acquire in HD even when delivering in SD.
It gives me the option to resize the shot if needed.

By the way, I do a ton of voice work in Las Cruces.
Just wondering what it's like there?

Dave

By resizing do you mean to be able to zoom in post?
Las Cruces, I absolutely love it except from mid July until late August, it's miserable because the humidity gets up to ...well, normal....however 90% of the homes here have swamp coolers and they don't work worth a crap when it's humid....wahhhhh...but then again it's very nice to be able to wear a T-shirt outside in January...I do own a leather jacket but only wear it because it makes me look cool.

G. Randy Brown · July 18th, 2010, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Les Wilson

I've see some HV footage edited on Premier that has downrez artifacts that match this article's explanation of what can happen when shooting HD and producing SD: XDCAM-USER.com Getting SD from HD and the problems of oversampling.

I use Final Cut Pro and an A1 and have been pleased with the downrezing. If your camera/NLE/DVD packages don't do a good job, your camera's DownConvert may do better. That way you can have the benefits of capture and archive at HD.

Yessir, I've read to not downconvert in the camera

Rainer Listing · July 19th, 2010, 06:08 PM

This is seriously a major topic especially for those of us agonizing over whether to keep our XL2s. Theoretically, if you squeeze 5 pixels into 1, which is in effect what you are doing when you are downconverting (PAL), however you do it, some pixels are going to go the wrong way, so you should be better off shooting SD. So why do Hollywood movies on commercial DVD look better than our DV footage? With the post downconvertors available to us, there are artifacts/shimmer, especially noticeable where you have straight edges. But to me overall my post downconverted HD footage just does look better than equivalent original SD. I'd also comment that I have tried shooting slightly softer HD to see if I could get better SD - the result was quite opposite (a slight blur in post as suggested in the article can help).

David Stembridge · July 19th, 2010, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Les Wilson

I use Final Cut Pro and an A1 and have been pleased with the downrezing.

Les, what is your method within FCP? I shot an interview in HD on my XHA1s and exported it to much footage shot as 16:9 SD It took a while; but looked very good. Would be interested i finding a little quicker method

Les Wilson · July 20th, 2010, 06:16 AM

Import footage into FCP using HDV 60i
Export as Quicktime file
Master DVD with Toast, iDVD or DVD Studio Pro

David W. Jones · July 21st, 2010, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G. Randy Brown

By resizing do you mean to be able to zoom in post?
Las Cruces, I absolutely love it except from mid July until late August, it's miserable because the humidity gets up to ...well, normal....however 90% of the homes here have swamp coolers and they don't work worth a crap when it's humid....wahhhhh...but then again it's very nice to be able to wear a T-shirt outside in January...I do own a leather jacket but only wear it because it makes me look cool.

Yes zoom or reframe the shot in post.

Just voiced two more spots for your market today.... I love working in Las Cruces!

G. Randy Brown · July 21st, 2010, 04:03 PM

"Just voiced two more spots for your market today.... I love working in Las Cruces! "

I would like to hear some samples can you send me some or have some online somewhere?
BTW, just out of curiosity who are you working for in Cruces?

David W. Jones · July 21st, 2010, 04:54 PM

Did Martin Tire the other day, and a couple for the Borman Autoplex today.
Should be able to hear me on the radio and TV there.

Dave

G. Randy Brown · July 21st, 2010, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David W. Jones

Did Martin Tire the other day, and a couple for the Borman Autoplex today.
Should be able to hear me on the radio and TV there.

Dave

OMG, you're not the voice calling all the other car dealers chickens are you??!!!

David W. Jones · July 22nd, 2010, 06:24 AM

We did those some time back.
The new pitch is $99.

G. Randy Brown · July 22nd, 2010, 07:33 AM

I just took a look at your demo reel...looks very impressive...I doubt I could afford your VO but I'll contact you next time anyway.

July 18th, 2010, 08:22 AM	#1
G. Randy Brown Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Las Cruces, NM Posts: 288	SD or HD? Hey, If I know a project is going to DVD and not blu-ray is there any advantage to shooting HD and then downconverting in post or is it better to just shoot SD widescreen? Thanks very much, Randy Last edited by G. Randy Brown; July 18th, 2010 at 08:24 AM. Reason: spelling

July 18th, 2010, 11:59 AM	#3
David W. Jones Trustee Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Little Rock Posts: 1,383	I tend to always acquire in HD even when delivering in SD. It gives me the option to resize the shot if needed. By the way, I do a ton of voice work in Las Cruces. Just wondering what it's like there? Dave __________________ David W. Jones www.joneshdfilms.com

July 21st, 2010, 04:54 PM	#12
David W. Jones Trustee Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Little Rock Posts: 1,383	Did Martin Tire the other day, and a couple for the Borman Autoplex today. Should be able to hear me on the radio and TV there. Dave __________________ David W. Jones www.joneshdfilms.com

July 22nd, 2010, 06:24 AM	#14
David W. Jones Trustee Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Little Rock Posts: 1,383	We did those some time back. The new pitch is $99. __________________ David W. Jones www.joneshdfilms.com

July 18th, 2010, 08:41 AM	#2
Bruce Watson Major Player Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Raleigh, NC, USA Posts: 710	Given a choice, I always shoot at the maximum capabilities of the camera. Because I never know if the footage will be needed for something else later. IOW, one never knows if a client won't come back later and want that same "DVD only" project reworked for blu-ray. It's usually better to downrez than to uprez. The cost of doing this is increased file sizes, and increased processing time which is often not that big a penalty with modern hardware.

July 18th, 2010, 12:10 PM	#4
Les Wilson Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Boca Raton, FL Posts: 3,014	I've see some HV footage edited on Premier that has downrez artifacts that match this article's explanation of what can happen when shooting HD and producing SD: XDCAM-USER.com Getting SD from HD and the problems of oversampling. I use Final Cut Pro and an A1 and have been pleased with the downrezing. If your camera/NLE/DVD packages don't do a good job, your camera's DownConvert may do better. That way you can have the benefits of capture and archive at HD.

July 19th, 2010, 06:08 PM	#7
Rainer Listing Major Player Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Nowra, Australia Posts: 440	This is seriously a major topic especially for those of us agonizing over whether to keep our XL2s. Theoretically, if you squeeze 5 pixels into 1, which is in effect what you are doing when you are downconverting (PAL), however you do it, some pixels are going to go the wrong way, so you should be better off shooting SD. So why do Hollywood movies on commercial DVD look better than our DV footage? With the post downconvertors available to us, there are artifacts/shimmer, especially noticeable where you have straight edges. But to me overall my post downconverted HD footage just does look better than equivalent original SD. I'd also comment that I have tried shooting slightly softer HD to see if I could get better SD - the result was quite opposite (a slight blur in post as suggested in the article can help).

July 20th, 2010, 06:16 AM	#9
Les Wilson Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Boca Raton, FL Posts: 3,014	Import footage into FCP using HDV 60i Export as Quicktime file Master DVD with Toast, iDVD or DVD Studio Pro

July 21st, 2010, 04:03 PM	#11
G. Randy Brown Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Las Cruces, NM Posts: 288	"Just voiced two more spots for your market today.... I love working in Las Cruces! " I would like to hear some samples can you send me some or have some online somewhere? BTW, just out of curiosity who are you working for in Cruces?

July 22nd, 2010, 07:33 AM	#15
G. Randy Brown Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Las Cruces, NM Posts: 288	I just took a look at your demo reel...looks very impressive...I doubt I could afford your VO but I'll contact you next time anyway.