Long clips getting broken.....HELP!!!!!

Howard Wilczynski · February 6th, 2009, 08:37 AM

I had another thread about this exact problem.
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/canon-xh-...cond-gaps.html

It for sure is not the capture, because when I watched the tape on the camera without it connected to anything, the gaps were there with a freeze frame.

I think it is the tapes. In my case I had switched from the Pani MQ to PQ when it started happening. I've had the heads cleans and am going back to the MQ tapes. I have another "long" shoot next month and I'm hoping for no gaps.

I think I will test that theory this weekend.

Howard

Philip R. Coltart · February 6th, 2009, 10:02 AM

After speaking with Apple and getting what amounted to half an hour of free technical support (thank you Apple, I now forgive you that my 17 inch laptop is late) I think we may have cracked it. I ingested two tapes yesterday and they went in like a charm without any drops. I am sleeping better, my wife loves me again and I feel that much closer to world peace. Aaaaaaahhhhhhh at last.

After a lengthy explanation on why HDV is the savior to bringing HD to the masses, he went on to say it is also a crippling format to capture true HD quality and carries no real time code. It sort of manufactures a time code and slaps it on top. In the light of my success, I will take his word for it. He also said that it is "nothing like DV" and behaves very differently. With that in mind he pointed me to User Preferences in FCP and said to uncheck the "Report Dropped Frames During Playback" and to select "Warn after capture" in the drop down menu for "On time code break" He said something like 'HDV has a weird form of time code and it doesn't play well with FCP.'

I can't say I understand all he was saying and some may argue his points but I have ingested 2 tapes (one hour each) and they went in without a hitch. The real test would be to pull a tape that I know had drops and ingest that. These tapes all came from the same wedding shot with the same camera so I can't see it being different. I will ingest them again anyway because now maybe I won't have to re-sync my multicam edits every 5 minutes.

Thanks all for your help and suggestions. If anything changes I will report back in case this can be of use in the future.

Jacob Thomas · February 6th, 2009, 11:31 AM

I think you are dropping frames, so it's a problem with the tape, especially if you try to capture multiple times and it happens in the same places. I've captured a lot of HDV footage, mostly with several different XH-A1's. The problem may have been dirty heads when you recorded the footage. Or I've even seen, systematically, that newer HDV cameras tend to have this drop frame problem and then as they get used more often they become more reliable. It would happen with a tape every once in while to me. I don't know why, but it's what I've observed, almost like they're getting broken in. Certainly also try cleaning your heads and capturing with different cameras if possible. Also, attempt to capture small clips right around the place where you see the clips breaking, that way you can see if it's a problem with the recorded data on the tape.

Anyway, in FCP when a clip ends or breaks you have 8 seconds before the next one starts because that's how long it takes for FCP to kick back in and begin ingesting the data again that's coming off the tape, that's all. You'll probably find that if you look at the footage via the camera that that 8 (or 7.5 seconds) of footage is good. Sometimes if you try recapturing I've even seen a place where a frame got dropped and the clip ended on the first try actually get read properly the 2nd or 3rd time, but that's not so likely with HDV as it was with DV.

Good luck.

February 6th, 2009, 08:37 AM	#16
Howard Wilczynski Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Canyon Country, CA Posts: 71	Same Problem I had another thread about this exact problem. http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/canon-xh-...cond-gaps.html It for sure is not the capture, because when I watched the tape on the camera without it connected to anything, the gaps were there with a freeze frame. I think it is the tapes. In my case I had switched from the Pani MQ to PQ when it started happening. I've had the heads cleans and am going back to the MQ tapes. I have another "long" shoot next month and I'm hoping for no gaps. I think I will test that theory this weekend. Howard

February 6th, 2009, 10:02 AM	#17
Philip R. Coltart New Boot Join Date: May 2007 Location: Corinth, NY Posts: 14	Problem maybe solved......! After speaking with Apple and getting what amounted to half an hour of free technical support (thank you Apple, I now forgive you that my 17 inch laptop is late) I think we may have cracked it. I ingested two tapes yesterday and they went in like a charm without any drops. I am sleeping better, my wife loves me again and I feel that much closer to world peace. Aaaaaaahhhhhhh at last. After a lengthy explanation on why HDV is the savior to bringing HD to the masses, he went on to say it is also a crippling format to capture true HD quality and carries no real time code. It sort of manufactures a time code and slaps it on top. In the light of my success, I will take his word for it. He also said that it is "nothing like DV" and behaves very differently. With that in mind he pointed me to User Preferences in FCP and said to uncheck the "Report Dropped Frames During Playback" and to select "Warn after capture" in the drop down menu for "On time code break" He said something like 'HDV has a weird form of time code and it doesn't play well with FCP.' I can't say I understand all he was saying and some may argue his points but I have ingested 2 tapes (one hour each) and they went in without a hitch. The real test would be to pull a tape that I know had drops and ingest that. These tapes all came from the same wedding shot with the same camera so I can't see it being different. I will ingest them again anyway because now maybe I won't have to re-sync my multicam edits every 5 minutes. Thanks all for your help and suggestions. If anything changes I will report back in case this can be of use in the future. Attached Thumbnails __________________ Many are called...... few are chosen

February 6th, 2009, 11:31 AM	#18
Jacob Thomas Tourist Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Somerville, MA Posts: 3	I think you are dropping frames, so it's a problem with the tape, especially if you try to capture multiple times and it happens in the same places. I've captured a lot of HDV footage, mostly with several different XH-A1's. The problem may have been dirty heads when you recorded the footage. Or I've even seen, systematically, that newer HDV cameras tend to have this drop frame problem and then as they get used more often they become more reliable. It would happen with a tape every once in while to me. I don't know why, but it's what I've observed, almost like they're getting broken in. Certainly also try cleaning your heads and capturing with different cameras if possible. Also, attempt to capture small clips right around the place where you see the clips breaking, that way you can see if it's a problem with the recorded data on the tape. Anyway, in FCP when a clip ends or breaks you have 8 seconds before the next one starts because that's how long it takes for FCP to kick back in and begin ingesting the data again that's coming off the tape, that's all. You'll probably find that if you look at the footage via the camera that that 8 (or 7.5 seconds) of footage is good. Sometimes if you try recapturing I've even seen a place where a frame got dropped and the clip ended on the first try actually get read properly the 2nd or 3rd time, but that's not so likely with HDV as it was with DV. Good luck.