XH-A1 & the HD Portable DTE Recorders at DVinfo.net

Guy Shaddock · July 15th, 2008, 10:01 AM

I am contemplating purchasing a Focus Enhancements FS-4 HD portable DTE recorder. There are a couple of choices that I have noticed. There is a "Canon" Firestore FSC-HD recorder that is about $550 more ($1150) than the Focus unit ($699). It appears that they are both manufactured by Focus. Given the huge price difference there must be a benefit to the Canon??? Does anyone know why and what the difference is?

Also I am wondering if anyone actually considers these devices useful?

Julian Frost · July 15th, 2008, 02:25 PM

The FS-C is specifically designed to be compatible with all the Canon HD and SD modes (30F/24F/60i). Any updates made to Canon cameras will be reflected in the firmware for the FS-C model of their DTE line, but may not be reflected in any of the others. If you want to maintain compatibility with Canon cameras, you might want to think about getting the FS-C.

That said... if you'll be sticking with the A1, I doubt we'll see any added features on that camera any time soon. :-(

Guy Shaddock · July 15th, 2008, 02:51 PM

Do you know whether the Focus (cheaper one) will work with 24F and 30F modes as well?

Julian Frost · July 15th, 2008, 04:12 PM

Guy,

When I was shopping for a DTE, I asked the same question from FocusEnhancements. Here is part of the reply I got. As you can see, they recommend the FS-C for Canon cameras:

Quote:

You seem to be interested in the FS-4 Pro HD and FS-C. I have provided you with product sheets and user manuals of both to help you with any minor technical questions. As tech support did say our FS-4 will work with your camera in most functionalities, we still suggest our FS-C because it is made specific for Canon cameras. I have provided purchasing information below, yet do not hesitate to contact me if you have anymore questions I can help you with.

There are a variety of Firestore DTE Recorders; 3 of which are made exclusively for our OEM Partners: Panasonic, JVC, and Canon cameras. For most Sony cameras we recommend the FS-4ProHDFamily, the FS-4ProHD’s are the only DTE Recorder which is more universal with many cameras (including some of the OEM Partners listed above). If you are primarily using Panasonic cameras, I would tell you to use the FS-100; also should you be primarily working with Canon cameras, I would tell you to use the FS-C. Finally, if you were using primarily JVC cameras, I would tell you to use our DR-HD100. Now if you wanted to use the FS-4ProHD with any of the OEM cameras you could but it would have some limitations. The OEM recorders (FS-100, FS-C, & DR-HD100) are built to record in the same bit/frame rate as your camera; the FS-C & DR-HD100 Recorders also work in QuickTime HDV, which the FS-4Pro HD won't.

A second email added the following information:

Quote:

The only "mode" that the FS-4 Pro HD (in comparison to the FS-C) does not support is Canon's F mode (1080 24F and 1080F) in the Quicktime format. It will record the F mode in the M2T format, however- so its relevance to you all depends on what editing system you are using. If you run a Mac editing suite and want to record in the F mode, then I would suggest the FS-C.

Also take into consideration, that any future Canon proprietary functionality updates through firmware would be done to the FS-C and probably not the FS-4 line as well.

So, to summarize... if you want to maintain compatibility with Canon cameras, get the FS-C. If you don't care about future firmware updates on the the A1, or other Canon cameras, or your DTE, and you never want to capture in Quicktime format, you can get the FS-4 ProHD.

Hope this helps.

Guy Shaddock · July 15th, 2008, 08:41 PM

Well that makes sense. I am going with the Canon one!
Thanks for the advice.

Bryce Comer · July 15th, 2008, 10:16 PM

I too am interested in the Firestore units, but have a couple of questions before i make any final decisions.
1: Are they reliable enough to work with without the need to use a tape back up?
2: Will these units work ok at low temperatures, say -30deg C?
This last question is probably the most important one for me as i will be shooting in the snow.

Thanks in advance for any advice.

Bryce

Julian Frost · July 16th, 2008, 01:32 PM

Bryce,

I can't answer question #2, as I live in Southern California, and it's very hot here!

As far as answering the reliability question, all I can say is that unlike tapes, where I've had dropouts and errors in the MPEG stream (as reported by Premier Pro CS3), I've never suffered the same problems with the FS-C.

One thing to remember though, is that the Firestore products work off the firewire connector on the camera. The instant you press the RECORD button on the camera to stop filming, the Firestore products also stop recording. However, the camera takes some time to process the captured footage and send it out through the firewire port. It takes about 2 seconds to "flush" the footage throught the camera's firewire port. What this means is, if you stop filming right at the end of the footage you want to capture, the Firestore will not save the last 2 seconds. Therefore, when using a Firestore product (or at least, the FS-C with the Canon A1), you MUST remember to keep filming for 2 seconds AFTER you'd normally stop filming if you want to be sure of getting everything on the DTE recorder.

A real world example of the above, would be filming someone counting down from 5 to 1, in one second intervals. If you press the RECORD button on the A1 to stop capturing footage when the subject says "1", the DTE will record only "5, 4, 3"

Chris Anderson · July 16th, 2008, 03:03 PM

So just to clarify, the FS-4 Pro HD will record to Quicktime (from an XH-A1) only in 60i, and will not record to Quicktime in 24f and 30f modes, correct?

Does anyone know what modes the FS-5 will record?

July 15th, 2008, 10:01 AM	#1
Guy Shaddock Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 131	XH-A1 & the HD Portable DTE Recorders I am contemplating purchasing a Focus Enhancements FS-4 HD portable DTE recorder. There are a couple of choices that I have noticed. There is a "Canon" Firestore FSC-HD recorder that is about $550 more ($1150) than the Focus unit ($699). It appears that they are both manufactured by Focus. Given the huge price difference there must be a benefit to the Canon??? Does anyone know why and what the difference is? Also I am wondering if anyone actually considers these devices useful?

July 15th, 2008, 10:16 PM	#6
Bryce Comer Trustee Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Rossland, British Columbia Posts: 1,024	I too am interested in the Firestore units, but have a couple of questions before i make any final decisions. 1: Are they reliable enough to work with without the need to use a tape back up? 2: Will these units work ok at low temperatures, say -30deg C? This last question is probably the most important one for me as i will be shooting in the snow. Thanks in advance for any advice. Bryce __________________ There's never enough hours in the day!

July 15th, 2008, 02:25 PM	#2
Julian Frost Major Player Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: California USA Posts: 576	The FS-C is specifically designed to be compatible with all the Canon HD and SD modes (30F/24F/60i). Any updates made to Canon cameras will be reflected in the firmware for the FS-C model of their DTE line, but may not be reflected in any of the others. If you want to maintain compatibility with Canon cameras, you might want to think about getting the FS-C. That said... if you'll be sticking with the A1, I doubt we'll see any added features on that camera any time soon. :-(

July 15th, 2008, 02:51 PM	#3
Guy Shaddock Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 131	Do you know whether the Focus (cheaper one) will work with 24F and 30F modes as well?

July 15th, 2008, 08:41 PM	#5
Guy Shaddock Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 131	Well that makes sense. I am going with the Canon one! Thanks for the advice.

July 16th, 2008, 01:32 PM	#7
Julian Frost Major Player Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: California USA Posts: 576	Bryce, I can't answer question #2, as I live in Southern California, and it's very hot here! As far as answering the reliability question, all I can say is that unlike tapes, where I've had dropouts and errors in the MPEG stream (as reported by Premier Pro CS3), I've never suffered the same problems with the FS-C. One thing to remember though, is that the Firestore products work off the firewire connector on the camera. The instant you press the RECORD button on the camera to stop filming, the Firestore products also stop recording. However, the camera takes some time to process the captured footage and send it out through the firewire port. It takes about 2 seconds to "flush" the footage throught the camera's firewire port. What this means is, if you stop filming right at the end of the footage you want to capture, the Firestore will not save the last 2 seconds. Therefore, when using a Firestore product (or at least, the FS-C with the Canon A1), you MUST remember to keep filming for 2 seconds AFTER you'd normally stop filming if you want to be sure of getting everything on the DTE recorder. A real world example of the above, would be filming someone counting down from 5 to 1, in one second intervals. If you press the RECORD button on the A1 to stop capturing footage when the subject says "1", the DTE will record only "5, 4, 3"

July 16th, 2008, 03:03 PM	#8
Chris Anderson New Boot Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 8	So just to clarify, the FS-4 Pro HD will record to Quicktime (from an XH-A1) only in 60i, and will not record to Quicktime in 24f and 30f modes, correct? Does anyone know what modes the FS-5 will record?