Anyway to Timecode Sync with A1 ? at DVinfo.net
DV Info Net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Canon EOS / MXF / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Canon HDV and DV Camera Systems > Canon XH Series HDV Camcorders
Register FAQ Today's Posts Buyer's Guides

Canon XH Series HDV Camcorders
Canon XH G1S / G1 (with SDI), Canon XH A1S / A1 (without SDI).

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old April 23rd, 2008, 05:09 PM   #1
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vancouver Canada
Posts: 89
Anyway to Timecode Sync with A1 ?

Am I stuck either plugging audio into the camera direct, or syncing by hand in post?

Or is there any way to sync to an audio recorder without the timecode ports (external device? FW->BNC? exist?)

Thanks!
Chris Sweet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2008, 05:45 PM   #2
Contributor
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Kansas City, MO
Posts: 4,449
There's no way to get timecode out of the XH A1 for that purpose. You'd need to buy the XH G1, and that's one big reason it's $3K more. And you'd have to have a sound recorder with sync capability.

You could do it the way we shot sync sound for many years back in my 16mm film days: use a slate and clapboard. Actually, I still use the old clapboard when syncing a video camera with a sound recorder, so that's not as obsolete as people might think. You just have to be sure the camera mic is on, and to do the clapboard about equal distance from the soundman's mic and the camera mic, otherwise you could end up up to a frame out of sync if the room's big enough.
Bill Pryor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2008, 07:23 PM   #3
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vancouver Canada
Posts: 89
yea..

cool thanks for the help. I've been doing location sound work for the past year and a half, and have tc capabilities on my recorder. Been doing editing and post work for a few months now as well. So I'm too much of a noob to have worked in the days of analog slates. lol. On the last proj I worked on though, the onboard mic was turned off on the A1. I told him to so there'd be no chance of that crappy audio being used. I guess if it was left on, lining up the waveforms would be how to sync.. is this what you mean?

On this post work I'm doing there is no tc, and no audio on the camera. Is there a difference in time, from when the lens picks up the slate shutting in front of the camera, to the mic recording the clap about 7-8 feet away? Would this method of syncing be hard to get accurate?

thanks again for any help

chris

cheers
Chris Sweet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 24th, 2008, 04:18 AM   #4
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 5,742
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Sweet View Post
cool thanks for the help. I've been doing location sound work for the past year and a half, and have tc capabilities on my recorder. Been doing editing and post work for a few months now as well. So I'm too much of a noob to have worked in the days of analog slates. lol. On the last proj I worked on though, the onboard mic was turned off on the A1. I told him to so there'd be no chance of that crappy audio being used. I guess if it was left on, lining up the waveforms would be how to sync.. is this what you mean?

On this post work I'm doing there is no tc, and no audio on the camera. Is there a difference in time, from when the lens picks up the slate shutting in front of the camera, to the mic recording the clap about 7-8 feet away? Would this method of syncing be hard to get accurate?

thanks again for any help

chris

cheers

Sound travels at about 1 foot per millisecond, so the clap of a slate 8 feet away will be delayed about 8ms or between 1/3 and 1/4 frame.

In a film workflow where the audio is resolved to analog media or audio and video are mated in telecine, timecode controlled the speed of the process and provided not only lineup but maintained sync over the duration of the reel. But with a video workflow, all it does is provide a single lineup point to aid in establishing sync plus provides a system for logging and cataloging shots. It doesn't do anything to maintain sync as the shot plays out - for that you need to salve wordclock or blackburst so the samples clocks are locked together. While it would be convenient to have the camera and audio timecodes the same, you can achieve the same lineup point by using a smart slate that has been jammed from the timcode generator in the audio recorder, displaying the timecode values in the audio at the instant the slate is clapped. OF course that means the audio recorder has to generate and output timecode, not just read it ... the Sound Devices recorders do but the popular Tascam HD-P2 only reads external timecode and doesn't gene4rate any for output.
__________________
Good news, Cousins! This week's chocolate ration is 15 grams!
Steve House is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 24th, 2008, 06:34 PM   #5
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vancouver Canada
Posts: 89
great thanks for those details! I will convince the producer to rent a digital slate next time a camera like the A1 is being used.

cheers
Chris Sweet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 25th, 2008, 06:12 AM   #6
Wrangler
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 4,489
A clap board, or similar impulse noise maker, at the talent (sound source) is probably the simplest method and it preserves the relative lag between light and sound at the camcorder. You sync on the audio waveform. If the camcorder (viewers eye) is ~35 feet from the talent, you expect the sound to arrive about one frame after the video.
__________________
dpalomaki@dspalomaki.com
Don Palomaki is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY USA

Scan Computers Int. Ltd.
+44 0871-472-4747
Bolton, Lancashire UK


DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Canon EOS / MXF / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Canon HDV and DV Camera Systems > Canon XH Series HDV Camcorders


 



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:59 AM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2024 The Digital Video Information Network