Old West Reenactment video -- 1st post at DVinfo.net

Mike Watkins · April 9th, 2008, 07:42 AM

Thanks to all of you who run this forum and make this site what it is. I'm new to video(October 07 - got my XHA1) but have learned so much from this forum.

Anyway, this is my first post of a video I shot for a reenactment group my parents are a part of. It was shot during a festival so the natural soundtrack was ruined by a live band and a helicopter tour, which both were louder than the re-enactors.

Shot in 24f 1/48, modified truecolor preset with no adapters. Some handheld and some tripod. All fcp6, except for the title which was done in Motion.

Looking for advice, critiques, likes and dislikes. Thanks so much!

http://www.vimeo.com/876972

Perrone Ford · April 9th, 2008, 08:03 AM

Please bear in mind that I'm not sure what you were "after" with this, and that I am no expert. Just learning as I go along...

I thought the imagery was nice. Beautiful setting. Song selection was very nice and appropriate. Gun sounds were a bit muted, but not bad.

To my mind, there was more panning and zooming that I'd like to see in 10 features put together. Moving the camera is certainly one thing that seperates basic video from a more film-like look. And since it appears you have neither a dolly nor a stabilizer, you used zooms, and pans and zooms on the stills to achieve movement. Not bad in itself, but subtlety is key.

I'd also look at perhaps at getting some TRULY wide shots, and some 1 and two shots in the mix. A lot of it was what I call "non-commital". Essentially, you get close, but not close enough, and you get far away, but not far enough. If that makes sense.

The opening was VERY nice until we got to the zoom. I would have liked to see the camera remain still, and the shot of the boots walk off-camera while remaining in focus.

Transitions were good for the most part. In fact, I think I liked the editing more than anything else. You clearly worked hard on this. It's a LARGE step up from most "video" you see. I think the only other thing that really stood out was the large depth of field, but without spending real money to go to a 35mm adapter, there's not a lot of ways around it.

Pretty good effort man! And better than anything I've done so far.

Mike Watkins · April 9th, 2008, 08:19 AM

Thanks for the comments Perrone.
I was basically trying to get a trailer style video together for their website. No budget, of course:(...

HOLY SCHNIKEYS!(Chris Farley), when I look at it now I realize it's too busy.

On some of the shots I was required to stay behind a safety barricade, and the set was a little small for wide shots that didn't let cars and budweiser signs creep into frame.

Thanks for the willingness to offer advice. That's what I'm needing.

Mike

Peter Wiley · April 9th, 2008, 09:04 AM

The thing that's missing is a story.

There not too much technically wrong with the images, although I agree about the zooming and panning. What you've done is to substitute camera moves for story. When you have a clear story to tell what to do with the camera is much easier to sort out.

There are two possible stories here. The first is the story that the the reenactors are acting out the second is a story about the reenactors. Who are these people? Where are they from? How did they get started doing it? Why do they do it? Why is it important to them? etc. You could do either of these stories or both, and it would have been fine to tell them in the context of the festival they were a part of.

You could still do a lot with this by going back to these people and interviewing them in "real life" and cut the interviews in with what you now have.

I also thought the title sequences was nicely done.

Perrone Ford · April 9th, 2008, 09:10 AM

He said he was doing a "Trailer". Interviews aren't gonna work. :) But I do agree about the idea of a story. Here's my question...

What are they re-enacting?

I think that's your story. Figure out how to tell that visually, cut it to 45 seconds to 90 seconds, and there you have it.

Mike Watkins · April 9th, 2008, 09:32 AM

I agree that a story would be better.

However, I think that I like the interview of the actors approach.

**Since they write their own skits, it may not be completely accurate to call them "reenactors", sorry for any misuse of the word and any confusion.**

Also the skits they were doing I had never seen, and they only did them once during the show. I would like the opportunity to go back and video a more planned and controlled "reenactment", where multiple takes and shot set-ups could be better.

Please keep the comments coming, I'm looking to improve, so tell me how it could be better..

thanks,

mike

Joe Rizzo-Naudi · April 10th, 2008, 06:08 AM

I liked it, certainly watchable. I agree with the previous comments about zooms and pans. Using a zoom to reframe a shot is fine, but i wouldn't leave the 'zooming' part of the reframing in the final edit, it just looks sloppy.

I thought the action shots were awesome- really liked the first set with the draws then the shooting- looked really fun! Loved the end shot too with the bleeding colour change- would have been nice if he'd fired but it doesn't matter- reminded me of the intro to 'Tombstone'.

Mike Watkins · April 10th, 2008, 08:46 PM

Joe,

You're right, this was a fun shoot to do. Thanks for the encouraging words.

I struggled a little to get in all of the action with only a single camera set up and minimal knowledge of the "script" of the show. Therefore the zooms were a bit erratic and unplanned.

I'm in the process of planning a second shoot with the re-enactors, totally dedicated to the purpose of making a video and not acting for a crowd.

Any additional suggestions or ideas would be appreciated. I am scheduling this for possibly the end of April.

Thanks,

Mike

Mike Watkins · July 20th, 2008, 08:29 PM

Attached are some screen grabs for some interview footage I took this weekend and intend to incorporate into the original video.

All grabs are shot at 24p 1/48, panalook preset and no color correction has been done.

Will post video soon for critiques.

I'm very pleased with the color and clarity of the camera...let me know your thoughts.

Thanks,

Mike

Mike Watkins · July 21st, 2008, 10:25 AM

can be found in the following thread

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...=125515&page=2

thanks,

Mike Watkins

Mike Watkins · February 23rd, 2009, 09:55 PM

I have gone back to this project and re-edited and put this project to what I'm calling finished state. Would love to hear your comments on the final product since you guys originally commented on this thread and offered some advice(which I tried to implement)...you can follow the new thread here:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/taking-ca...cumercial.html

I appreciate your time and opinions. Same to everyone on the forum!

Mike Watkins

April 9th, 2008, 07:42 AM	#1
Mike Watkins Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Burleson, TX Posts: 131	Old West Reenactment video -- 1st post Thanks to all of you who run this forum and make this site what it is. I'm new to video(October 07 - got my XHA1) but have learned so much from this forum. Anyway, this is my first post of a video I shot for a reenactment group my parents are a part of. It was shot during a festival so the natural soundtrack was ruined by a live band and a helicopter tour, which both were louder than the re-enactors. Shot in 24f 1/48, modified truecolor preset with no adapters. Some handheld and some tripod. All fcp6, except for the title which was done in Motion. Looking for advice, critiques, likes and dislikes. Thanks so much! http://www.vimeo.com/876972

April 10th, 2008, 08:46 PM	#8
Mike Watkins Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Burleson, TX Posts: 131	Joe, You're right, this was a fun shoot to do. Thanks for the encouraging words. I struggled a little to get in all of the action with only a single camera set up and minimal knowledge of the "script" of the show. Therefore the zooms were a bit erratic and unplanned. I'm in the process of planning a second shoot with the re-enactors, totally dedicated to the purpose of making a video and not acting for a crowd. Any additional suggestions or ideas would be appreciated. I am scheduling this for possibly the end of April. Thanks, Mike Last edited by Mike Watkins; April 10th, 2008 at 08:47 PM. Reason: misspelled word

July 20th, 2008, 08:29 PM	#9
Mike Watkins Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Burleson, TX Posts: 131	new footage Attached are some screen grabs for some interview footage I took this weekend and intend to incorporate into the original video. All grabs are shot at 24p 1/48, panalook preset and no color correction has been done. Will post video soon for critiques. I'm very pleased with the color and clarity of the camera...let me know your thoughts. Thanks, Mike Attached Thumbnails

July 21st, 2008, 10:25 AM	#10
Mike Watkins Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Burleson, TX Posts: 131	additional clips can be found in the following thread http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...=125515&page=2 thanks, Mike Watkins

February 23rd, 2009, 09:55 PM	#11
Mike Watkins Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Burleson, TX Posts: 131	Perrone, Peter, Joe Rizzo I have gone back to this project and re-edited and put this project to what I'm calling finished state. Would love to hear your comments on the final product since you guys originally commented on this thread and offered some advice(which I tried to implement)...you can follow the new thread here: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/taking-ca...cumercial.html I appreciate your time and opinions. Same to everyone on the forum! Mike Watkins __________________ XHA1, FCS2, Shake 4.1, 501HDV

April 9th, 2008, 08:03 AM	#2
Perrone Ford Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Posts: 4,100	Please bear in mind that I'm not sure what you were "after" with this, and that I am no expert. Just learning as I go along... I thought the imagery was nice. Beautiful setting. Song selection was very nice and appropriate. Gun sounds were a bit muted, but not bad. To my mind, there was more panning and zooming that I'd like to see in 10 features put together. Moving the camera is certainly one thing that seperates basic video from a more film-like look. And since it appears you have neither a dolly nor a stabilizer, you used zooms, and pans and zooms on the stills to achieve movement. Not bad in itself, but subtlety is key. I'd also look at perhaps at getting some TRULY wide shots, and some 1 and two shots in the mix. A lot of it was what I call "non-commital". Essentially, you get close, but not close enough, and you get far away, but not far enough. If that makes sense. The opening was VERY nice until we got to the zoom. I would have liked to see the camera remain still, and the shot of the boots walk off-camera while remaining in focus. Transitions were good for the most part. In fact, I think I liked the editing more than anything else. You clearly worked hard on this. It's a LARGE step up from most "video" you see. I think the only other thing that really stood out was the large depth of field, but without spending real money to go to a 35mm adapter, there's not a lot of ways around it. Pretty good effort man! And better than anything I've done so far.

April 9th, 2008, 08:19 AM	#3
Mike Watkins Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Burleson, TX Posts: 131	Thanks for the comments Perrone. I was basically trying to get a trailer style video together for their website. No budget, of course:(... HOLY SCHNIKEYS!(Chris Farley), when I look at it now I realize it's too busy. On some of the shots I was required to stay behind a safety barricade, and the set was a little small for wide shots that didn't let cars and budweiser signs creep into frame. Thanks for the willingness to offer advice. That's what I'm needing. Mike

April 9th, 2008, 09:04 AM	#4
Peter Wiley Major Player Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Lewisburg PA Posts: 752	The thing that's missing is a story. There not too much technically wrong with the images, although I agree about the zooming and panning. What you've done is to substitute camera moves for story. When you have a clear story to tell what to do with the camera is much easier to sort out. There are two possible stories here. The first is the story that the the reenactors are acting out the second is a story about the reenactors. Who are these people? Where are they from? How did they get started doing it? Why do they do it? Why is it important to them? etc. You could do either of these stories or both, and it would have been fine to tell them in the context of the festival they were a part of. You could still do a lot with this by going back to these people and interviewing them in "real life" and cut the interviews in with what you now have. I also thought the title sequences was nicely done.

April 9th, 2008, 09:10 AM	#5
Perrone Ford Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Posts: 4,100	He said he was doing a "Trailer". Interviews aren't gonna work. :) But I do agree about the idea of a story. Here's my question... What are they re-enacting? I think that's your story. Figure out how to tell that visually, cut it to 45 seconds to 90 seconds, and there you have it.

April 9th, 2008, 09:32 AM	#6
Mike Watkins Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Burleson, TX Posts: 131	I agree that a story would be better. However, I think that I like the interview of the actors approach. Since they write their own skits, it may not be completely accurate to call them "reenactors", sorry for any misuse of the word and any confusion. Also the skits they were doing I had never seen, and they only did them once during the show. I would like the opportunity to go back and video a more planned and controlled "reenactment", where multiple takes and shot set-ups could be better. Please keep the comments coming, I'm looking to improve, so tell me how it could be better.. thanks, mike

April 10th, 2008, 06:08 AM	#7
Joe Rizzo-Naudi Regular Crew Join Date: May 2007 Location: London, UK Posts: 32	I liked it, certainly watchable. I agree with the previous comments about zooms and pans. Using a zoom to reframe a shot is fine, but i wouldn't leave the 'zooming' part of the reframing in the final edit, it just looks sloppy. I thought the action shots were awesome- really liked the first set with the draws then the shooting- looked really fun! Loved the end shot too with the bleeding colour change- would have been nice if he'd fired but it doesn't matter- reminded me of the intro to 'Tombstone'.