Knee and Color Matrix at DVinfo.net

Scott Becker · August 1st, 2007, 07:48 PM

Hi,

Can someone explain what the "knee" setting is for - how it's used.

Also, is there a good online source to find out about how to use color matrix?

Thanks for any help,

Scott

Buddy Frazer · August 2nd, 2007, 06:52 AM

This is the way I understand knee.

It you put knee in the low setting it will attenuate the brightness of very bright objects. For instance, if you have a bright light in the frame, it will make it a little "darker." This is great for things like stage plays where the contrast is really high.

Someone else probably has a much better explanation--or even a more accurate one.

Buddy

Richard Hunter · August 2nd, 2007, 08:37 AM

To add to what Buddy said, the knee controls the point where the attenuation starts to happen. Even the higher knee settings will cause attenuation of the highlights, but setting it lower makes this happen a bit closer to the mids.

Richard

Scott Becker · August 2nd, 2007, 01:34 PM

Thanks for the replies. That does give me a better understanding of it.

This seems to be an adjustment that you would use when filming a subject where little or no camera movement is being used - ie: panning. If you have to move the camera from a really bright object - or area to a darker area in one shot - what is the best way?

I've tried adjusting the aperature, but it isn't so smooth during the pan (not enough hands) :)

Any tricks to this?

Buddy Frazer · August 2nd, 2007, 03:04 PM

I guess you could use auto exposure, but that might give undesirable results. If you are using a tripod, I find it pretty easy to rotate the aperture ring while panning.

Lonnie Bell · August 2nd, 2007, 08:06 PM

the knee is more of a PRESET, not an adjustment you make while recording...
it's not meant to control "during" the take like aperature or shutter control.

Lonnie

Scott Becker · August 2nd, 2007, 09:48 PM

Thanks for the replies!

Buddy - The tripod really is the key, isn't it? I'm going to be filming is some situations (aboard a ship) where I will not be able to set up shop so to speak. I'll have to remain out of people's way, so I'm trying to get some techniques for light and dark shots.

Lonnie - This is sort of what I thought. I'm taking some of the CPs here and tinkering with them to see what kind of effects I get - hopefully come up with something cool :)

Jerome Cloninger · August 3rd, 2007, 01:34 PM

The way I understand the Knee setting, it adjusts the curve of the bright areas. For instance, if you are shooting a person under a light, adjusting to the low setting will limit how much of the bright areas on such as a forehead to be "blown out"... I think I remember seeing this in a Canon H1 instructional video or something like that.

Buddy Frazer · August 3rd, 2007, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Becker

Thanks for the replies!

Buddy - The tripod really is the key, isn't it?

I have tried some different ways to position my hands to control the exposure ring AND push the Push to Focus button at the same time. I have had reasonable success if I put my left palm under the camera, rest my thumb on the Push to Focus button and my index finger on the aperture ring. But I haven't tried this on a real shoot.

Andrew Galves · August 16th, 2007, 09:27 AM

"I remember seeing this in a Canon H1 instructional video"

Jerome, where did you find that video? Actually does anyone recommend training videos for the A1?

Jerome Cloninger · August 16th, 2007, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Galves

"I remember seeing this in a Canon H1 instructional video"

Jerome, where did you find that video? Actually does anyone recommend training videos for the A1?

I think I remember seeing it on the Canon website.

Jerome Cloninger · August 16th, 2007, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Galves

"I remember seeing this in a Canon H1 instructional video"

Jerome, where did you find that video? Actually does anyone recommend training videos for the A1?

Sorry, it is on dvcreators and was on the xl2... it talks about knee and all that in there: http://dvcreators.net/media/demos/xl...aturetour.html

Andrew Galves · August 16th, 2007, 08:24 PM

Got to the site, awsome video. That will help me out alot. Thanks!!!

August 1st, 2007, 07:48 PM	#1
Scott Becker New Boot Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 16	Knee and Color Matrix Hi, Can someone explain what the "knee" setting is for - how it's used. Also, is there a good online source to find out about how to use color matrix? Thanks for any help, Scott Last edited by Scott Becker; August 1st, 2007 at 07:49 PM. Reason: added question

August 2nd, 2007, 08:06 PM	#6
Lonnie Bell Major Player Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Las Vegas, NV United States Posts: 361	the knee is more of a PRESET, not an adjustment you make while recording... it's not meant to control "during" the take like aperature or shutter control. Lonnie __________________ Lonnie Bell mamas boy productions Las Vegas, NV

August 3rd, 2007, 01:34 PM	#8
Jerome Cloninger Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: East TN Posts: 415	The way I understand the Knee setting, it adjusts the curve of the bright areas. For instance, if you are shooting a person under a light, adjusting to the low setting will limit how much of the bright areas on such as a forehead to be "blown out"... I think I remember seeing this in a Canon H1 instructional video or something like that. __________________ Jerome www.jeromecloninger.com

August 16th, 2007, 09:27 AM	#10
Andrew Galves New Boot Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Los Angeles CA Posts: 10	Training Video "I remember seeing this in a Canon H1 instructional video" Jerome, where did you find that video? Actually does anyone recommend training videos for the A1?

August 16th, 2007, 08:24 PM	#13
Andrew Galves New Boot Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Los Angeles CA Posts: 10	Instructional Video Got to the site, awsome video. That will help me out alot. Thanks!!!

August 2nd, 2007, 06:52 AM	#2
Buddy Frazer Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Addison (Dallas) Texas Posts: 88	This is the way I understand knee. It you put knee in the low setting it will attenuate the brightness of very bright objects. For instance, if you have a bright light in the frame, it will make it a little "darker." This is great for things like stage plays where the contrast is really high. Someone else probably has a much better explanation--or even a more accurate one. Buddy

August 2nd, 2007, 08:37 AM	#3
Richard Hunter Trustee Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Lipa City Batangas, Philippines Posts: 1,110	To add to what Buddy said, the knee controls the point where the attenuation starts to happen. Even the higher knee settings will cause attenuation of the highlights, but setting it lower makes this happen a bit closer to the mids. Richard

August 2nd, 2007, 01:34 PM	#4
Scott Becker New Boot Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 16	Thanks for the replies. That does give me a better understanding of it. This seems to be an adjustment that you would use when filming a subject where little or no camera movement is being used - ie: panning. If you have to move the camera from a really bright object - or area to a darker area in one shot - what is the best way? I've tried adjusting the aperature, but it isn't so smooth during the pan (not enough hands) :) Any tricks to this?

August 2nd, 2007, 03:04 PM	#5
Buddy Frazer Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Addison (Dallas) Texas Posts: 88	I guess you could use auto exposure, but that might give undesirable results. If you are using a tripod, I find it pretty easy to rotate the aperture ring while panning.

August 2nd, 2007, 09:48 PM	#7
Scott Becker New Boot Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 16	Thanks for the replies! Buddy - The tripod really is the key, isn't it? I'm going to be filming is some situations (aboard a ship) where I will not be able to set up shop so to speak. I'll have to remain out of people's way, so I'm trying to get some techniques for light and dark shots. Lonnie - This is sort of what I thought. I'm taking some of the CPs here and tinkering with them to see what kind of effects I get - hopefully come up with something cool :)