Canon introduces XF105 and XF100

[Andy Wilkinson]

I agree with the sentiments that the XF100/105 are priced well above what you'd expect it to be with respect to the competition from Panasonic, JVC and Sony. However, I know first hand that the XF100/105 have superb build quality so that has to be a factor. It's new so, sure, early adopters will pay a premium and of course there is that 50Mbps codec. As to if the sensor and lens can do it justice - we'll just have to wait and see.

Regarding the single lens ring. That may be an issue for some but I think I could live with it - especially since the "little knob" can be assigned to some functions, I believe.

I'm a bit more concerned about the software controlled ND filter system so would love to hear more about how well (or otherwise) that works.

One other thing that I picked up on today (in the XF300/305 section - see quote below) is the AF Face Detection Mode which appears to work really well on those big sister cams. Now I'm usually using Full Manual focus 99% of the time, actually make that 99.99%... but if it really works as well on these little XF100/105 then that could be a big plus in some situations (run-n-gun events etc.) for some that may help justify the steep pricing (alas, especially steep here in the UK it seems). Mind you the little Panasonic TM700 I'm about to buy has a similar feature and costs peanuts! (relatively).

Sean, (or anyone that took delivery today) if you have time to check out this Face Detection AF Mode as well as the ND system in some depth I'm sure I'm not alone in being interested in your comments! Many thanks!

Originally Posted by Robert Turchick

The AF really depends on the situation. As with all cameras, light makes a huge difference. I have mostly been using mine in full daylight or controlled lighting shoots. I shot a series of auditions for a tv show and just for grins decided to try the face detection AF mode. Not a critical shoot so wasnt concerned if it messed up. To my amazement, it never missed. I mean not once! I then used it for a greenscreen TelePrompTer shoot where the actor would be walking around a bit. Dead perfect! This is the real deal and not a gimmick! Not saying I'd use it all the time but for certain types of shoots, it makes life insanely easy! On a recent shoot, my XF found itself flying on a glidecam 4000 and I suggested to the operator to leave it in face detection AF mode. Worked great!
Since discovering how well it does work, the only times the AF had a problem were in unlit indoors situations (chasing my kids around the house) and one shoot where the background was too bright (used the backlight feature and it helped) So in extreme lighting conditions, use manual. But give the face detection mode a try (I use the instant mode) and as long as the white box is around your talent, you are perfectly focused!

[Bill Koehler]

Originally Posted by Chris Hurd

You have to understand that the control ring on the XF100 / 105 isn't a step "backward" but is instead a step down in size. As I said before, the XF100 / 105 is simply a compact, pocket version of the XF300 / 305. If you need a small pro camcorder, that's what it's for. If you need the three control rings, the XF300 / 305 has them. The XF300 / 305 is the one you want, the one that has it all. The XF100 / 105 is its little brother. Just to reiterate one more time, if you want three control rings and the XF codec, then you've got them... not in the XF100 / 105 but instead the XF300 / 305.

The XF100 / 105 is just a subset of the XF300 / 305. It's important to understand that.

Or alternatively, understand that the XF100 / 105 are a big step up from the HF-S21 / 20 / 200 consumer cams that they superficially resemble with upgrades to the lens (control ring, ND), sensor, codec, storage media (CompactFlash instead of SDHC), presets, and pro XLR audio inputs (did I leave anything out? viewfinder?). And with the XF105 you get HD-SDI and the ability to pair them up to do 3-D.

[Robert Turchick]

Originally Posted by Andy Wilkinson

I agree with the sentiments that the XF100/105 are priced well above what you'd expect it to be with respect to the competition from Panasonic, JVC and Sony. However, I know first hand that the XF100/105 have superb build quality so that has to be a factor. It's new so, sure, early adopters will pay a premium and of course there is that 50Mbps codec. As to if the sensor and lens can do it justice - we'll just have to wait and see.

Regarding the single lens ring. That may be an issue for some but I think I could live with it - especially since the "little knob" can be assigned to some functions, I believe.

I'm a bit more concerned about the software controlled ND filter system so would love to hear more about how well (or otherwise) that works.

One other thing that I picked up on today (in the XF300/305 section - see quote below) is the AF Face Detection Mode which appears to work really well on those big sister cams. Now I'm usually using Full Manual focus 99% of the time, actually make that 99.99%... but if it really works as well on these little XF100/105 then that could be a big plus in some situations (run-n-gun events etc.) for some that may help justify the steep pricing (alas, especially steep here in the UK it seems). Mind you the little Panasonic TM700 I'm about to buy has a similar feature and costs peanuts! (relatively).

Sean, (or anyone that took delivery today) if you have time to check out this Face Detection AF Mode as well as the ND system in some depth I'm sure I'm not alone in being interested in your comments! Many thanks!

Andy, I'll say it again...the face detection is killer! It's like when the auto industry introduced ABS and traction control. If I want to play with focus, I grab my 7D with it's toys! (if I want to do burnouts and drift, I take my wife's old Mustang!) Works great since I shoot a bunch of 2 camera gigs with me as the only operator.

I plan on getting a 100 for a b-cam next year and hope the AF works as well as it does on the 300!

[Robin Davies-Rollinson]

Originally Posted by Bill Koehler

understand that the XF100 / 105 are a big step up from the HF-S21 / 20 / 200 consumer cams that they superficially resemble

That's exactly my feeling as well Bill.
I see it as an upgrade from my little HFS100 - which I love dearly and really sings for me - with the advantage of a professional (broadcast) codec and better control of focus.

[Russ Johnson]

Sean,

Thanks for those details. I saw your review on the Sony NX5 and I 'm wondering how the Canon XF100 compares in image quality and in particular, low light sensitivity to that camera. Can you make any observations for us?

Originally Posted by Sean Seah

I messed ard with it and i kinda like it! The LCD is gorgeous, the audio controls are good and the wheel is pretty nice. i realised that i would set the aperature once normally.. (to the fastest having being so spoilt by DSLRs), and i would use the rocker 90% of the time for zooming. So the single ring didnt bother me that much. Only thing i didnt like was the ND filter had to be triggered by software. However there is a small ring like the one on the Sony Z1 which can be used to control the ND. I didnt try that. Will have a go tonight to see how it works.

The features are very similar to the XF300 series and i was impressed. It is truly a great B cam from my intial impressions. I heard from Canon Singapore the price would be quite attractive. I hope they price it right this time. Because i feel that the XF300 was overpriced when compared to the EX1R. In this market the competition would be the new Sony mini NXCAM MC50e which records in AVCHD compared to the nice mpeg2 50Mbps 422.

[Flemming Bo Hansen]

Maybe it is of interest
Found new video
“XF100 / 105 masterclass" on the Canon-Europe website:

Canon Professional Network - XF105 & XF100 Masterclass

[Andy Wilkinson]

Good feature overview by Canon. Thanks for posting!

Now deliveries are apparently coming through, anyone with "real user hands-on experience" got any comments, e.g. I'd love to know more about the Auto ND?

[Jim Martin]

Andy-
Can you confirm that dealers in the UK, or Europe for that matter, have 100s and/or 105s in stock.

Thanks,

Jim Martin
FilmTools.com

[Andy Wilkinson]

Hi Jim,

I'm sure Canon are the best people to tell you exactly when your US bound stock will arrive but this is what (little) I am able to ascertain.

Creative Video Products here in the UK originally had the XF105 listed as available from 20th Dec (see post by another Brit, Mark, earlier in this thread) but I checked their website just now and it's saying in stock on 4th Jan (and 1st Jan availability for the XF100). Other well known/trusted UK video suppliers websites that I've just viewed typically list "2-3 days delivery" on both (which I'd take with a pinch of salt right now).

My guess is the UK wide airport shutdown fracas that we recently endured with the snow here will have delayed some freight shipments somewhat but let's hope they start appearing next week! I'm still eagerly awaiting real user comments and video clips before I decide to buy a baby XF (or not) in the Spring (or possibly await a Canon 5DMkIII later in the year ....if it gets released in 2011, that's anyone's guess right now and certainly not a topic for discussion just yet).

At least we know deliveries of the baby XFs have started in Asia! (as Sean Seah has already taken delivery of his production XF100 - see earlier in this thread).

[Ivan Pin]

Japanese review of the Canon XF105 (by Google translation): Canon XF105.

For comparision:
- Canon XF300 / XF305: Canon XF300 / XF305,
- Sony NX5: Sony NX5.

Some shots from the reviews:

TV table.
Canon XF305:
http://www.pronews.jp/photo/XF305-12h46m46s.jpg

Canon XF105:
http://www.pronews.jp/photo/XF105-20...-02h11m32s.jpg

Sony NX5:
http://www.pronews.jp/photo/SONY%20NX5J%20010.jpg

Resolution.
Canon XF305:
http://www.pronews.jp/photo/XF305-12h47m07s44.jpg

Canon XF105:
http://www.pronews.jp/photo/XF105-20...02h11m04s0.jpg

Sony NX5:
http://www.pronews.jp/photo/SONY%20NX5J%20004.jpg

Resolution and aliasing.
Canon XF305:
http://www.pronews.jp/photo/XF305-12h47m24s.jpg

Canon XF105:
http://www.pronews.jp/photo/XF105-20...-02h09m03s.jpg

Sony NX5:
http://www.pronews.jp/photo/SONY%20NX5J%20008.jpg

[Jim Martin]

Originally Posted by Andy Wilkinson

Hi Jim,

I'm sure Canon are the best people to tell you exactly when your US bound stock will arrive but this is what (little) I am able to ascertain.

Creative Video Products here in the UK originally had the XF105 listed as available from 20th Dec (see post by another Brit, Mark, earlier in this thread) but I checked their website just now and it's saying in stock on 4th Jan (and 1st Jan availability for the XF100). Other well known/trusted UK video suppliers websites that I've just viewed typically list "2-3 days delivery" on both (which I'd take with a pinch of salt right now).

My guess is the UK wide airport shutdown fracas that we recently endured with the snow here will have delayed some freight shipments somewhat but let's hope they start appearing next week! I'm still eagerly awaiting real user comments and video clips before I decide to buy a baby XF (or not) in the Spring (or possibly await a Canon 5DMkIII later in the year ....if it gets released in 2011, that's anyone's guess right now and certainly not a topic for discussion just yet).

At least we know deliveries of the baby XFs have started in Asia! (as Sean Seah has already taken delivery of his production XF100 - see earlier in this thread).

Thanks Andy...I'm just trying to confirm that Europe & Asia are getting theirs before they hit the US. I was told last week that for us, the cameras were being pushed into sometime February....which I'm not real happy about.

Thanks,

Jim Martin
FilmTools.com

[Mark Johnson]

I know these cameras are scarce but this price hike is a bit steep!

Decided not to order one today...... :)


Mark

[Buba Kastorski]

No way man, it's a web master comma typo :)

[Andy Wilkinson]

Must be the VAT increase that's to blame!!! Cost aside, looking on the bright side at least you can have a baby XF in 2-3 days if you REALLY want it! ;-)

[Robin Davies-Rollinson]

...and you know you do - really!...