Corrupt CF card

Larry Cohen · August 19th, 2010, 09:10 PM

What do you guys think? Ever had this problem?
We've been using our XF300 for 3 weeks now. Perfectly shooting and taking the CF card (an approved UDNA card) and putting it into a new card reader from OWC - and directly importing to our MacBook Pro and Final Cut Pro. Then we copy the folder created in the Capture Scratch to a second drive for backup.

All has worked well for 3 weeks. Then, all hell broke lose! Something got corrupted and we couldn't import the card in FCPro. (We have the latest of all software and hardware). FCPro just wouldn't recognize the CF card. We tried to copy CF card to Finder - and we couldn't even copy card - kept getting an error in the finder
"The Finder can't complete the operation because some data "AA052101.mxf" can't be read or written. error code -36."

But the card plays fine in the XF300. Canon XF Utility wouldn't open card either. I called Canon tech support - they said DO NOT IMPORT FROM CARD READER INTO FCPro. They said there can be some kind of corruption FCPro may cause (or something vague, blaming Apple or the card!) They said to be safe - first copy cart to a folder on a hard drive - then import that folder to FCPro. This will really mess up our workflow, when we're shooting with two cameras and several cards a day.

But it seems very intermittent? Almost always - the direct import procedure works perfectly? Why the corruption "sometimes" We've had Panasonic P2 system for 3 years - NEVER had a corruption problem.

Anyone had any experience with this? We're dying (because it's simple) to simply take card out of camera, place in card reader and import into FCPro - then duplicate capture scratch folder for backup. BUT . . . if it corrupts during this process - we're DEAD! :(
This last fiasco caused MAJOR problems in reshooting.

Thanks for any advice,
Larry

Nicholas de Kock · August 21st, 2010, 06:45 PM

Find someone with a PC and try copying it off, it's probably a FCP issue. If the card is corrupt for real find recovery software and have it recover the data.

Robert Turchick · August 21st, 2010, 07:15 PM

Had a very similar experience with my Panny HMC150 which uses sdhc cards. That was over a year ago and since changing my workflow to copy the card to a hard drive and then do the L&T in FCP from those files, I haven't had an issue (knocking on wood!)
What really scared me was I had a different card go bad about a week later. Joys of tapeless! (though I will never go back...benefits are too numerous!)

And P2 is a completely different animal. Wish it wasn't so darn expensive but the reliability is proven.

Olakunle Olanrewaju · August 23rd, 2010, 11:41 AM

You can try nexto 2725

Eddie Coates · August 23rd, 2010, 12:23 PM

This is why i stick to windows based tools and adobe products. Which never go online ever.

A friend of mine has new Mac and every time I transfer photos or video from my cameras, his LAME mac corrupts my media cards. NO BS! It is the mac that is doing it, not FCP.

I have never had these problems with windows in all of my shooting years since 1997. I truly believe that mac is the problem, if you do not eject the cards properly, the LAME mac will definitely corrupt your files!

Windows is pure plug and play with no issues.

Robert Turchick · August 23rd, 2010, 03:14 PM

Sorry Eddie, I just don't buy that theory. I understand you may have a thing against Macs and that's fine.

The card corruption doesn't happen when I transfer the files to the hard drive. And that's something I've been doing with SD, SDHC, CF, MS and older formats for a LOT longer than I've been dealing with video.

As I mentioned, now that I copy the files to a drive THEN L&T from FCP it has worked perfectly. It was only when I tried to L&T from the card that I had issues.

Please try it my way and if you get the same problem, then you can blame the Mac. Until then, it's FCP and the fix, while not the most efficient, works great.

Glen Vandermolen · August 23rd, 2010, 03:37 PM

Well, in Eddie's defense, there is the possiblity that Macs can delete the files out of P2 cards after you download them. It hasn't happened to me, but I've been warned about it. If I remember correctly, Panasonic advises turning the lock on your P2 card before downloading to a Mac. I never do, of course.
If Macs can react to P2 cards like that, perhaps they can have issues with other media cards.

Nick Wilcox-Brown · August 26th, 2010, 01:02 PM

With respect, there is NO issue with Macs and CF cards, I have been using them for 10 years, sometimes swapping into PCs as well. Zero problems, but see below:

Larry, what you don't say is how you are wiping the cards before the next use?

The golden rule with CF cards is always, always to format cards in the camera, every time you use them. Don't just delete files, re-format cards. Couple this with a quality card (pref SanDIsk with Canon, but YMMV) and you should not have any issues.

Nick.

Larry Cohen · August 26th, 2010, 03:36 PM

Thank you, Nick.
We ALWAYS ONLY initialize the card in the XF300. So we're doing exactly what you're suggesting.

Don't know what went wrong that once . . . but something sure did!

Most of the other contributors seem to feel first copy the card - THEN L&T. That's probably not a bad idea! No downside - just a little time. And you DO have a backup. I'm doing that now with nary a problem.

But thanks for your input and thoughts,
Larry

Nick Wilcox-Brown · August 26th, 2010, 03:40 PM

Apologies Larry, so many people (photographers in particular) erase in Mac / PC and wonder why they have issues.

I'm sure you have a FW800 reader for copying? I wish someone would offer something faster still.

Good luck!

Nick.

Larry Cohen · August 26th, 2010, 03:44 PM

Actually, Nick, we bought an Apple Store USB2 CF card reader. Really cool, and seems to copy over a gig a minute to our MacBook Pro. But just ordered a Firewire 800 one. I'm sure we'll like it better! Sounds like you're reading our minds!
Thanks

Nick Wilcox-Brown · August 26th, 2010, 03:55 PM

I'll add this as a separate message: Larry, your OWC reader - is it FW or USB? The ones on their site are USB. I have just done a spotlight search on my memory and remembered a card corruption issue I had several years ago - I broke my FW reader and resorted to using the spare, Lexar USB reader.

I experienced exactly the same sort of issue. Files that would play fine on the camera (stills) were corrupted during the USB transfer, causing not only software crashes on the Mac (and PC too from memory, I was using both), but on the Mac, I had a kernal panic as a result of the corruption.

I kept the card and when put into another FW reader, the files copied absolutely fine. No explanation, but a lesson learned.

Hope this may help?

Nick.

Larry Cohen · August 28th, 2010, 08:24 PM

I take it, Nick, you're thinking the USB transfer could be the villain . . . as the firewire transfer was OK?

Just asking, did you copy the card to another drive - then export THAT as many suggest . . . ?

Or were you L&T directly into FCPro? My firewire 800 CF card reader didn't come yet - but I seem to have no more problems so long as I copy to a hard drive FIRST - then L&T that!

But this could be completely coincidental, too. It does seem safer, though, even though it does increase workflow. But for most anything I shoot - I'm happy to do that! (Increase workflow a bit for increased data safety -- If I'm even correct! :)

August 19th, 2010, 09:10 PM	#1
Larry Cohen Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Watchung New Jersey Posts: 50	Corrupt CF card - this shouldn't be! What do you guys think? Ever had this problem? We've been using our XF300 for 3 weeks now. Perfectly shooting and taking the CF card (an approved UDNA card) and putting it into a new card reader from OWC - and directly importing to our MacBook Pro and Final Cut Pro. Then we copy the folder created in the Capture Scratch to a second drive for backup. All has worked well for 3 weeks. Then, all hell broke lose! Something got corrupted and we couldn't import the card in FCPro. (We have the latest of all software and hardware). FCPro just wouldn't recognize the CF card. We tried to copy CF card to Finder - and we couldn't even copy card - kept getting an error in the finder "The Finder can't complete the operation because some data "AA052101.mxf" can't be read or written. error code -36." But the card plays fine in the XF300. Canon XF Utility wouldn't open card either. I called Canon tech support - they said DO NOT IMPORT FROM CARD READER INTO FCPro. They said there can be some kind of corruption FCPro may cause (or something vague, blaming Apple or the card!) They said to be safe - first copy cart to a folder on a hard drive - then import that folder to FCPro. This will really mess up our workflow, when we're shooting with two cameras and several cards a day. But it seems very intermittent? Almost always - the direct import procedure works perfectly? Why the corruption "sometimes" We've had Panasonic P2 system for 3 years - NEVER had a corruption problem. Anyone had any experience with this? We're dying (because it's simple) to simply take card out of camera, place in card reader and import into FCPro - then duplicate capture scratch folder for backup. BUT . . . if it corrupts during this process - we're DEAD! :( This last fiasco caused MAJOR problems in reshooting. Thanks for any advice, Larry

August 21st, 2010, 07:15 PM	#3
Robert Turchick Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Mesa, AZ Posts: 1,389	Had a very similar experience with my Panny HMC150 which uses sdhc cards. That was over a year ago and since changing my workflow to copy the card to a hard drive and then do the L&T in FCP from those files, I haven't had an issue (knocking on wood!) What really scared me was I had a different card go bad about a week later. Joys of tapeless! (though I will never go back...benefits are too numerous!) And P2 is a completely different animal. Wish it wasn't so darn expensive but the reliability is proven. __________________ The older I get, the better I was!

August 23rd, 2010, 12:23 PM	#5
Eddie Coates Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Scottsdale, AZ Posts: 58	This is why i stick to windows based tools and adobe products. Which never go online ever. A friend of mine has new Mac and every time I transfer photos or video from my cameras, his LAME mac corrupts my media cards. NO BS! It is the mac that is doing it, not FCP. I have never had these problems with windows in all of my shooting years since 1997. I truly believe that mac is the problem, if you do not eject the cards properly, the LAME mac will definitely corrupt your files! Windows is pure plug and play with no issues. __________________ SONY EX1, (Vista Ultimate 64bit, i-7 core processor, 12gigs of DDR3, ATI 5870 GPU Adobe CS4) Canon 5DMkII and Canon 7D 70-200mm 2.8L IS, Tamron 28-75mm 2.8 XR Di

August 23rd, 2010, 03:14 PM	#6
Robert Turchick Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Mesa, AZ Posts: 1,389	Sorry Eddie, I just don't buy that theory. I understand you may have a thing against Macs and that's fine. The card corruption doesn't happen when I transfer the files to the hard drive. And that's something I've been doing with SD, SDHC, CF, MS and older formats for a LOT longer than I've been dealing with video. As I mentioned, now that I copy the files to a drive THEN L&T from FCP it has worked perfectly. It was only when I tried to L&T from the card that I had issues. Please try it my way and if you get the same problem, then you can blame the Mac. Until then, it's FCP and the fix, while not the most efficient, works great. __________________ The older I get, the better I was!

August 26th, 2010, 01:02 PM	#8
Nick Wilcox-Brown Major Player Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Bristol, UK Posts: 231	With respect, there is NO issue with Macs and CF cards, I have been using them for 10 years, sometimes swapping into PCs as well. Zero problems, but see below: Larry, what you don't say is how you are wiping the cards before the next use? The golden rule with CF cards is always, always to format cards in the camera, every time you use them. Don't just delete files, re-format cards. Couple this with a quality card (pref SanDIsk with Canon, but YMMV) and you should not have any issues. Nick. __________________ Nick Wilcox-Brown, Film-maker and Photographer https://nickwb.com https://wildphotographer.co.uk

August 21st, 2010, 06:45 PM	#2
Nicholas de Kock Major Player Join Date: May 2007 Location: KLD, South Africa Posts: 983	Find someone with a PC and try copying it off, it's probably a FCP issue. If the card is corrupt for real find recovery software and have it recover the data.

August 23rd, 2010, 11:41 AM	#4
Olakunle Olanrewaju Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Ibadan, Nigeria Posts: 103	You can try nexto 2725

August 23rd, 2010, 03:37 PM	#7
Glen Vandermolen Space Hipster Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 1,596	Well, in Eddie's defense, there is the possiblity that Macs can delete the files out of P2 cards after you download them. It hasn't happened to me, but I've been warned about it. If I remember correctly, Panasonic advises turning the lock on your P2 card before downloading to a Mac. I never do, of course. If Macs can react to P2 cards like that, perhaps they can have issues with other media cards.

August 26th, 2010, 03:36 PM	#9
Larry Cohen Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Watchung New Jersey Posts: 50	CF cards Thank you, Nick. We ALWAYS ONLY initialize the card in the XF300. So we're doing exactly what you're suggesting. Don't know what went wrong that once . . . but something sure did! Most of the other contributors seem to feel first copy the card - THEN L&T. That's probably not a bad idea! No downside - just a little time. And you DO have a backup. I'm doing that now with nary a problem. But thanks for your input and thoughts, Larry

August 26th, 2010, 03:40 PM	#10
Nick Wilcox-Brown Major Player Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Bristol, UK Posts: 231	Apologies Larry, so many people (photographers in particular) erase in Mac / PC and wonder why they have issues. I'm sure you have a FW800 reader for copying? I wish someone would offer something faster still. Good luck! Nick.

August 26th, 2010, 03:44 PM	#11
Larry Cohen Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Watchung New Jersey Posts: 50	CF cards Actually, Nick, we bought an Apple Store USB2 CF card reader. Really cool, and seems to copy over a gig a minute to our MacBook Pro. But just ordered a Firewire 800 one. I'm sure we'll like it better! Sounds like you're reading our minds! Thanks

August 26th, 2010, 03:55 PM	#12
Nick Wilcox-Brown Major Player Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Bristol, UK Posts: 231	I'll add this as a separate message: Larry, your OWC reader - is it FW or USB? The ones on their site are USB. I have just done a spotlight search on my memory and remembered a card corruption issue I had several years ago - I broke my FW reader and resorted to using the spare, Lexar USB reader. I experienced exactly the same sort of issue. Files that would play fine on the camera (stills) were corrupted during the USB transfer, causing not only software crashes on the Mac (and PC too from memory, I was using both), but on the Mac, I had a kernal panic as a result of the corruption. I kept the card and when put into another FW reader, the files copied absolutely fine. No explanation, but a lesson learned. Hope this may help? Nick.

August 28th, 2010, 08:24 PM	#13
Larry Cohen Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Watchung New Jersey Posts: 50	cf card corruption I take it, Nick, you're thinking the USB transfer could be the villain . . . as the firewire transfer was OK? Just asking, did you copy the card to another drive - then export THAT as many suggest . . . ? Or were you L&T directly into FCPro? My firewire 800 CF card reader didn't come yet - but I seem to have no more problems so long as I copy to a hard drive FIRST - then L&T that! But this could be completely coincidental, too. It does seem safer, though, even though it does increase workflow. But for most anything I shoot - I'm happy to do that! (Increase workflow a bit for increased data safety -- If I'm even correct! :)