Canon announces XC10 and new codec XF-AVC

[Monday Isa]

Chris please feel free to replace camera links with Canon press releases. I can't find them yet.

Canon develops own video format targeting 4K professional video camcorders: Canon develops 4K video format XF-AVC at DV Info Net

Canon XC10 press release, US and UK versions: Canon USA Announces XC10 4K Camcorder at DV Info Net

Canon UK product pages for the Canon XC10: Canon XC10 - Cinema EOS Cameras - Canon UK

https://youtu.be/Gaw_df_R0_c

https://youtu.be/0BLEzbHPL7Y

Unleash 4K video recording with the all new XC10 - YouTube

[Mark Fry]

The new family of codecs looks interesting, as much for what is (currently) left out as for what's included. The 10-bit 4:2:2 Intra-frame 4k is going to really excite some people, but why isn't there a long-GOP 4k version, and why is 30P the highest 4k frame-rate? I think there must be more to come as Canon fill in the rest of their 4k range.

The 1" chip in the new XC10 looks promising. I can imagine 4k XF200 and XF300 replacements being built around it, hopefully with more efficient long-GOP 4k recording and, maybe, 50/60 fps 4k??

[Jack Zhang]

No Long-GOP option for 4K in XF-AVC is going to really hurt longform productions like concerts. We also don't need another XAVC that isn't compatible with Sony. It's Canon MXF all over again.

The XC10 looks like it uses 8-bit Intra only recording, not Long-GOP. It seems like it uses 310mbps for 8bit 4:2:2 and 410mbps for 10bit 4:2:2.

And big miss is the lack of 50p/60p on the C300mkII. It will not qualify for Discovery's acquisition requirements.

[Glen Vandermolen]

The rumors were spot on.
4K internal, fixed lens, C100 form factor, about $2,500. Exactly as I'd heard.
One odd omission: a hand strap. Pretty much every video camera/lens has a hand strap. Just so you won't be as prone to drop the camera.

[Chris Hurd]

Originally Posted by Monday Isa

Chris please feel free to replace camera links with Canon press releases. I can't find them yet.

Much appreciated, Monday -- as you can see, I have dressed up your post a bit. Many thanks!

[Les Wilson]

Kudos to Canon for making a companion video camera with proper ND filters in this segment instead of yet another stills camera. No doubt it's a quiet lens with AF, de-clicked and incremental iris as a video camera should be. Even leaping away from the DSLR "squeeze-to-hold" ergonomics and fixed back view screen.

Odd as it seems though, I think that lack of strap is ruinous. It's why I dumped all my DSLRs and won't buy another. The hand can't use the fingers when they are squeezing the grip and without the strap, the palm can't free the fingers as a proper video camera does by holding the camera. Yes, the left hand can hold the camera just like a DSLR so then what's the point? So close and yet so far. Hope I'm wrong and it ships with one.

[John Wiley]

C300mkII actually looks a lot better than I had expected. I think they've certainly done enough to prevent a tidal wave of C300 owners switching over to the Sony FS7.

The XC10 has me on the fence though. On the one hand I love the fact that they have stepped away from the "hybrid" mentality of mirrorless cameras like the GH4 and A7s to make a purely video-orientated camera - and one which you should easily be able to pull out of the bag and start shooting on without switching lenses, fiddling with rigs and EVFs, etc. On the other hand, it baffles me that they seem to have taken some of the things we hate about shooting with DSLR's (poor layout, no XLR's, 8-bit) as well as the main things that caused us to abandon traditional camcorders (small sensor, fixed lens) and combined them into this thing. On one hand I can imagine this being in my bag as a grab-n-run kind of camera, but on the other hand I can't help wondering why this in not in a XF200 type body with proper audio and a camcorder-layout.

[Dylan Couper]

I like the xc10 for about $1500. For $2500.... Naaaah.

[Andy Wilkinson]

I just wish the XC10 had a faster lens - or an EF mount so I could put any (Canon) lens on it...

[Dylan Couper]

Agreed. I'd much rather have it shorter and faster with a continuous aperture.

Sony and Panny for example...

[Mark Fry]

Originally Posted by Dylan Couper

I like the xc10 for about $1500. For $2500.... Naaaah.

I guess that's where the price will settle, but not for a few months at least. Remember how much the Sony RX10 and Panasonic FZ1000 dropped over time. Plus, the price of the much-rumoured but not-yet-announced Sony RX10-Mk2, when/if it emerges, will have a big impact on the XC10's street price

[Philip Lipetz]

Originally Posted by Jack Zhang

No Long-GOP option for 4K in XF-AVC is going to really hurt longform productions like concerts. We also don't need another XAVC that isn't compatible with Sony. It's Canon MXF all over again.

The XC10 looks like it uses 8-bit Intra only recording, not Long-GOP. It seems like it uses 310mbps for 8bit 4:2:2 and 410mbps for 10bit 4:2:2.

And big miss is the lack of 50p/60p on the C300mkII. It will not qualify for Discovery's acquisition requirements.

The XC10 has an mechanical shutter to minimize rolling shutter effects

[Steve Struthers]

Originally Posted by Dylan Couper

I like the xc10 for about $1500. For $2500.... Naaaah.

$2500 is really pricey for a camera that has a fixed, non-interchangeable lens with no power zoom, and offers a maximum resolution of only 12 megapixels. I realize megapixels aren't everything, as a well-engineered sensor that is sized properly can produce better images than one with more megapixels.

I've seen reports the suggested retail price of the XC10 is going to be closer to $1999USD than $2500.00. But the competing Sony and Panasonic models are going for around a grand or less - although the Sony doesn't offer 4K video.

Looks like Canon are just trying to cash in on the 4K craze and trying to charge more for it, as usual. It's interesting to see that Canon haven't even tried to offer a dedicated pro-grade 4K camcorder, while Sony and Panasonic have already done so.

Bottom line, Canon aren't going to find many buyers at their proposed price point. If they chop the price to $1299, they may have a chance of scooping up a few people who otherwise might opt for a Sony RX10 or Sony FZ1000, given that these cameras are consumer grade, as is the XC10.

Lately Canon have seemed to be in a pattern of being a day late and a dollar short and only offering incremental to modest improvements in their products.

[Ken Plotin]

XC10 specs don't show 24p mode in HD. Also, no viewfinder.
Ken

[Mark Fry]

Originally Posted by Ken Plotin

... Also, no viewfinder. Ken

Not as such, but there is a "loup" to go over the rear screen which has much the same effect