HV20 and Sony wide angle Lens tests

Tom Hardwick · July 11th, 2007, 06:43 AM

Chris, adding a wide-angle converter doesn't necessarily mean you'll get barrel distortion. But on the other hand it does often lead you down that path, as your window frame shot shows to perfection. Fergus - Chris's shot shows what I mean, yet his other shots show how the distortion can be hidden in less critical subject matter.

My Z1's 12x zoom barrel distorts on its own, so if I add my zero barrel distortion 0.52x wide-angle converter, the final results (equivalent to a 17 mm lens on a 35mm camera) do indeed show barrel distortion. It's not too objectional, but it's there all right.

If I add my zoom-through 0.5 x Tecpro converter the results are all but unuseable for serious work, though what I call 'skate-boarding' films thrive on such distortion.

tom.

Fergus Anderson · July 11th, 2007, 10:45 AM

Thanks Tom, it is quite pronounced on Chris' door shot but having tested mine it is there but not nearly so obvious. As you say though, depending on the shot type it can be well hidden.

Pieter Jongerius · July 12th, 2007, 03:32 PM

Hi Fergus & Chris, thanks for those examples. Somewhere back in these threads I posted mine based on the WD43. This WD43 also suffers from barrel distortion to the point that it got me to despherize in post on critical shots, suffering some loss of sharpness of course.

Tom, my question would be: any thoughts on a (somewhat/virtually) barrel distortion-free lens in the range of .5 to .7? Thanks,
Pieter

Tom Hardwick · July 12th, 2007, 04:22 PM

Yes, I have a 0.52x Bolex Aspheron. It's made in Switzerland and is a glass, Zeiss T* coated single element aspheric. I've written about it at length on these forums. Here's a shot of the back of my garage, giving comparisons:
http://tinyurl.com/2bxrv5

and page one in my photos will show you the lens itself.
It is by far the very best wide-angle converter I've used, and I've tried Century, Schneider, Kenko, Tecpro, Raynox Cavision and so on.

It's not full zoom through, and at 65 of my Z1's 0 to 99 zoom range it goes dramatically out of focus. I love using this for focus dissolves on the timeline.

tom.

Chris Barcellos · July 12th, 2007, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Hardwick

Yes, I have a 0.52x Bolex Aspheron. It's made in Switzerland and is a glass, Zeiss T* coated single element aspheric. I've written about it at length on these forums. Here's a shot of the back of my garage, giving comparisons:
http://tinyurl.com/2bxrv5

and page one in my photos will show you the lens itself.
It is by far the very best wide-angle converter I've used, and I've tried Century, Schneider, Kenko, Tecpro, Raynox Cavision and so on.

It's not full zoom through, and at 65 of my Z1's 0 to 99 zoom range it goes dramatically out of focus. I love using this for focus dissolves on the timeline.

tom.

Tom: Couldn't track it down on line for sale. Is this something in manufacture, or are we going to have to track a used one down?

Tom Hardwick · July 13th, 2007, 01:06 AM

I bought my first one used to see if a lens designed for the 16 mm Bolex cameras of 35 years ago was going to work on my three-chip camcorders. It did, so I contacted Bolex in Switzerland and found they were still making them new. They are, so I ordered a new one:
http://www.bolex.ch/NEW/?p=1

You have to get a 'special' 85 mm to 72 mm (or whatever your filter thread size is) adapter made, but I have a drawing for that. Or you can butcher a lens hood as one of my followers has done, and make the Aspheron bayonet on. Cool.

tom.

Nathan Shane · July 13th, 2007, 08:17 AM

Hey Tom...just checked out your camera rigs and noticed you were already doing the idea I had just started doing...using an L bracket to mount the camera, mic, on. It looks like it's Canon brand...do they still make that? Do you have a model number, I'm not finding it online anywhere. I like that one much better than the one I'm using - it's more professional looking.

http://vettaville.com/photos/CanonHV...rig_handle.jpg

http://vettaville.com/photos/CanonHV20/hv20_rig.jpg

Tom Hardwick · July 13th, 2007, 09:26 AM

My L bracket is indeed man-sized and girder-bridge constructed vs the rather flimsy pieces of bent alloy you see these days. Mine came badged as a Vivitar and was made for the hammerhead flashguns and metal Nikon Fs in the early 70s.

I bought mine second-hand for pennies and I peeled off the Vivitar badge because I though a Canon badge looked a lot better. Snob, huh?

tom.

Dave Blackhurst · July 13th, 2007, 12:23 PM

Indeed that big bracket is apparently a Vivitar - have an identical one myself, needed that big hunk of steel and plastic for the Z1 to help stabilize - also seems about right for the FX7. I'll mention that if you're bracketing a smaller cam like the HV20, the huge bracket is overkill. Adds quite a bit of weight, and not much extra stability from my experience - actually a bit counter productive IMO, makes the nice light cam rig heavy and harder to hold for longer periods...

The "ergo" handle does seem to be a nice touch, and the strap for your hand makes for a nice "safety" strap.

Pieter Jongerius · July 14th, 2007, 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Hardwick

...I contacted Bolex in Switzerland and found they were still making them new. They are, so I ordered a new one:
http://www.bolex.ch/NEW/?p=1

Thanks! I'm having a hard time finding what you mean on that site... Is it the "Aspheron 6,5mm for former Vario-Switar 12.5-100"? It seems to cost a stunning 1400 Swiss Franks, which is about the cost of my HV20 :))

...now that I saw the photos of it (http://www.fortvir.net/gallery/v/tom...eron.jpg.html), it kinda makes sense... I think I am in the market for something...well...smaller. Any advice on my pending acquisition of one of the lesser gods in wide-angle-world? :)

Pieter

Tom Hardwick · July 15th, 2007, 01:04 AM

Exactly so Pieter. The one to get should say clearly on the back: Aspheron super wide angle 6.5 mm Multicoated for Vario Switar 12.5-100 mm.

You can purchase the 6,5mm Aspheron directly from Bolex International SA,
the manufacturer.

The normal price is CHF 1400 Swiss Francs (about £650), but if you ask nicely (a couple of us did) Bolex can grant you a nice discount of 30% off.

The final price was CHF 980 Swiss Francs (about £440), including postage
costs to England. But when you consider these are individually ground aspherical elements that are beautifully multicoated and give results superior to many a barrel-distorting zoom-through that costs more (I'm thinking Century here) it doesn't seem so dear.

Talk to Marc Ueter, tell him I sent you if you like. email bolex@bluewin.ch
There are alternative aspherics on sale at lesser prices. They're all lesser quality, but one thing they all do is remove barrel distortion.

Have a look-see here:

http://www.lenswvl.com/

http://www.wittner-kinotechnik.de/ka...a/b_optike.php

tom.

July 11th, 2007, 06:43 AM	#16
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	Chris, adding a wide-angle converter doesn't necessarily mean you'll get barrel distortion. But on the other hand it does often lead you down that path, as your window frame shot shows to perfection. Fergus - Chris's shot shows what I mean, yet his other shots show how the distortion can be hidden in less critical subject matter. My Z1's 12x zoom barrel distorts on its own, so if I add my zero barrel distortion 0.52x wide-angle converter, the final results (equivalent to a 17 mm lens on a 35mm camera) do indeed show barrel distortion. It's not too objectional, but it's there all right. If I add my zoom-through 0.5 x Tecpro converter the results are all but unuseable for serious work, though what I call 'skate-boarding' films thrive on such distortion. tom.

July 11th, 2007, 10:45 AM	#17
Fergus Anderson Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: London, UK Posts: 321	Thanks Tom, it is quite pronounced on Chris' door shot but having tested mine it is there but not nearly so obvious. As you say though, depending on the shot type it can be well hidden.

July 12th, 2007, 03:32 PM	#18
Pieter Jongerius Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Netherlands Posts: 101	Hi Fergus & Chris, thanks for those examples. Somewhere back in these threads I posted mine based on the WD43. This WD43 also suffers from barrel distortion to the point that it got me to despherize in post on critical shots, suffering some loss of sharpness of course. Tom, my question would be: any thoughts on a (somewhat/virtually) barrel distortion-free lens in the range of .5 to .7? Thanks, Pieter

July 12th, 2007, 04:22 PM	#19
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	Yes, I have a 0.52x Bolex Aspheron. It's made in Switzerland and is a glass, Zeiss T* coated single element aspheric. I've written about it at length on these forums. Here's a shot of the back of my garage, giving comparisons: http://tinyurl.com/2bxrv5 and page one in my photos will show you the lens itself. It is by far the very best wide-angle converter I've used, and I've tried Century, Schneider, Kenko, Tecpro, Raynox Cavision and so on. It's not full zoom through, and at 65 of my Z1's 0 to 99 zoom range it goes dramatically out of focus. I love using this for focus dissolves on the timeline. tom.

July 13th, 2007, 01:06 AM	#21
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	I bought my first one used to see if a lens designed for the 16 mm Bolex cameras of 35 years ago was going to work on my three-chip camcorders. It did, so I contacted Bolex in Switzerland and found they were still making them new. They are, so I ordered a new one: http://www.bolex.ch/NEW/?p=1 You have to get a 'special' 85 mm to 72 mm (or whatever your filter thread size is) adapter made, but I have a drawing for that. Or you can butcher a lens hood as one of my followers has done, and make the Aspheron bayonet on. Cool. tom.

July 13th, 2007, 08:17 AM	#22
Nathan Shane Regular Crew Join Date: May 2007 Location: Addison, Texas Posts: 178	Hey Tom...just checked out your camera rigs and noticed you were already doing the idea I had just started doing...using an L bracket to mount the camera, mic, on. It looks like it's Canon brand...do they still make that? Do you have a model number, I'm not finding it online anywhere. I like that one much better than the one I'm using - it's more professional looking. http://vettaville.com/photos/CanonHV...rig_handle.jpg http://vettaville.com/photos/CanonHV20/hv20_rig.jpg

July 13th, 2007, 09:26 AM	#23
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	My L bracket is indeed man-sized and girder-bridge constructed vs the rather flimsy pieces of bent alloy you see these days. Mine came badged as a Vivitar and was made for the hammerhead flashguns and metal Nikon Fs in the early 70s. I bought mine second-hand for pennies and I peeled off the Vivitar badge because I though a Canon badge looked a lot better. Snob, huh? tom.

July 13th, 2007, 12:23 PM	#24
Dave Blackhurst Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Apple Valley CA Posts: 4,874	Indeed that big bracket is apparently a Vivitar - have an identical one myself, needed that big hunk of steel and plastic for the Z1 to help stabilize - also seems about right for the FX7. I'll mention that if you're bracketing a smaller cam like the HV20, the huge bracket is overkill. Adds quite a bit of weight, and not much extra stability from my experience - actually a bit counter productive IMO, makes the nice light cam rig heavy and harder to hold for longer periods... The "ergo" handle does seem to be a nice touch, and the strap for your hand makes for a nice "safety" strap.

July 15th, 2007, 01:04 AM	#26
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	Exactly so Pieter. The one to get should say clearly on the back: Aspheron super wide angle 6.5 mm Multicoated for Vario Switar 12.5-100 mm. You can purchase the 6,5mm Aspheron directly from Bolex International SA, the manufacturer. The normal price is CHF 1400 Swiss Francs (about £650), but if you ask nicely (a couple of us did) Bolex can grant you a nice discount of 30% off. The final price was CHF 980 Swiss Francs (about £440), including postage costs to England. But when you consider these are individually ground aspherical elements that are beautifully multicoated and give results superior to many a barrel-distorting zoom-through that costs more (I'm thinking Century here) it doesn't seem so dear. Talk to Marc Ueter, tell him I sent you if you like. email bolex@bluewin.ch There are alternative aspherics on sale at lesser prices. They're all lesser quality, but one thing they all do is remove barrel distortion. Have a look-see here: http://www.lenswvl.com/ http://www.wittner-kinotechnik.de/ka...a/b_optike.php tom.