50i or 25P for mixed recordings at DVinfo.net

Michael Jakobsen · May 29th, 2007, 01:39 AM

My big question is weather to use 50i or 25P for a lot of recordings under mixed conditions ?

In the forum a lot have been written about the advantage of 50i or 25P.

50i is best for fast movements but lowlight is poor.
25P is not so good for fast movement but better in lowlight.

If you are going to shoot a lot of video under mixed conditions (daylight, night etc.) then would you use 50i or 25P ?

I am going on a 3 week trip to Thailand with my girlfriend. I am planning to do a lot of filming on beaches, boats, in the jungle etc. I will also do some night shootings of beach parties, nightlife etc.
The material will be used for a website, normal DVD's and video in HD (played from a computer now and HD-disk later on).

I have only had time to do a few small tests.
I think I will probably choose 25P. For steady nature scenes on a tripod this should be fine.
But do you think this will cause too much judder when people, a boat or an elephant move around in front of the camera or when the camera is handheld or on a moving boat ?

Another option would be to mix 50i and 25P recordings but when you edit the video you still have to choose to output it in 50i or 25P. I am not sure how well video editing software handle this. Would this mixing be acceptable and give a good result - or is it better to stick to just one format ?

I hope someone can tell what you use and what you think is best.
I am sure that a lot of other Canon HV20 owners think about the same - both PAL and NTSC users.

Note that the answer may not be exactly the same for NTSC and PAL users. In PAL we do not need to worry about the conversion/pulldown so that may make a difference in the final result.

Fabio Martina · May 29th, 2007, 03:30 AM

Hi Michael,
unfortunely I can't answer to your question. I bought a PAL HV20 just few days a go and I already have to do more test.
I gently ask you a question: how do you do to watch the movie de-interlaced on the PC ? Do you before transforme the .m2t files in something else deinterlaced ?

Thanks in advance

Fabio

Enea Lanzarone · May 29th, 2007, 09:50 AM

Fortunately, it absolutely doesn't matter if you edit 25P in a 50i timeline or not. 25P is not handled any different than 50i.

It's your choice what to use, but personally I'd go for 25P. I don't think I will ever use 50i with the HV20. 25P motion with the HV20 looks so much smoother than with any cinema/frame mode I've seen on many other cams. I just hate that 'cheap tv commercial' and 'home movie' look of 50i. 25P looks much more stylish and artistic to me, no matter what I shoot.

Fabio: you can use the free VLC player for both watching footage via firewire or already captured clips. The VLC player has a built in configurable deinterlacer, which works in real time.

Saluti a Milano da un siciliano in Svizzera! ;)

Andrew Boss · May 29th, 2007, 11:40 AM

Which deinterlacing mode should you use in VLC? Blend, bob, discard, linear, mean, x?

Fabio Martina · May 30th, 2007, 02:35 AM

Grazie Enea,
I'll try some experiments...

Fabio

p.s.
Semmai ti scrivo in privato così posso parlare in italiano che mi riesce meglio !

Marco Delgado · May 30th, 2007, 10:17 AM

I'm on the same dilemma... I'm travelling to Alaska tomorrowand still not sure if I should use 24P or 60i...

I think I will go with 24P for all my shoots using a tripod and if I'm walking or shooting from the helicopter I'll go with 60i.

Fabio Martina · May 31st, 2007, 09:54 AM

It works !!

X Andrew

The correct deintarlacing mode is "discard" (for PAL)

It must also to go into Preference...video...filters...deinterlacing...and choose "discard" and
Preference...video...filters to flag "deinterlacing"

By

Fergus Anderson · May 31st, 2007, 02:13 PM

i would have thought for 25p you dont want any deinterlacing so i would leave it at none

Fabio Martina · June 4th, 2007, 03:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fergus Anderson

i would have thought for 25p you dont want any deinterlacing so i would leave it at none

Yes for 25p, but if you use 50i I used "discard" ("annulla" in italian)

Fergus Anderson · June 4th, 2007, 05:40 AM

discard is not the same as no deinterlacing in VLC. I think it discards altenate fields

Fabio Martina · June 4th, 2007, 06:36 AM

Perhaps is an error of my translation:

the correct choise for deinterlacing in VLC PAL footage, for me is the 4th in the menu list, between "bob" and "linear": I don't know the word in VLC english version (I have the italian menu)...

by

Fabio

Fergus Anderson · June 4th, 2007, 10:54 AM

Hi Fabio

No that option is "discard", what you want is the top one on the list which is to "disable"

Don Meers · June 16th, 2007, 03:55 PM

I just returned from thailand with my hv20 .Shot everything hdv25p cine mode. editing the footage now. Looks great. Even the low light.

May 29th, 2007, 01:39 AM	#1
Michael Jakobsen Tourist Join Date: May 2007 Location: Denmark Posts: 1	50i or 25P for mixed recordings My big question is weather to use 50i or 25P for a lot of recordings under mixed conditions ? In the forum a lot have been written about the advantage of 50i or 25P. 50i is best for fast movements but lowlight is poor. 25P is not so good for fast movement but better in lowlight. If you are going to shoot a lot of video under mixed conditions (daylight, night etc.) then would you use 50i or 25P ? I am going on a 3 week trip to Thailand with my girlfriend. I am planning to do a lot of filming on beaches, boats, in the jungle etc. I will also do some night shootings of beach parties, nightlife etc. The material will be used for a website, normal DVD's and video in HD (played from a computer now and HD-disk later on). I have only had time to do a few small tests. I think I will probably choose 25P. For steady nature scenes on a tripod this should be fine. But do you think this will cause too much judder when people, a boat or an elephant move around in front of the camera or when the camera is handheld or on a moving boat ? Another option would be to mix 50i and 25P recordings but when you edit the video you still have to choose to output it in 50i or 25P. I am not sure how well video editing software handle this. Would this mixing be acceptable and give a good result - or is it better to stick to just one format ? I hope someone can tell what you use and what you think is best. I am sure that a lot of other Canon HV20 owners think about the same - both PAL and NTSC users. Note that the answer may not be exactly the same for NTSC and PAL users. In PAL we do not need to worry about the conversion/pulldown so that may make a difference in the final result.

June 16th, 2007, 03:55 PM	#13
Don Meers Regular Crew Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 63	Thailand I just returned from thailand with my hv20 .Shot everything hdv25p cine mode. editing the footage now. Looks great. Even the low light.

May 29th, 2007, 03:30 AM	#2
Fabio Martina New Boot Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Milan - Italy Posts: 13	Hi Michael, unfortunely I can't answer to your question. I bought a PAL HV20 just few days a go and I already have to do more test. I gently ask you a question: how do you do to watch the movie de-interlaced on the PC ? Do you before transforme the .m2t files in something else deinterlaced ? Thanks in advance Fabio

May 29th, 2007, 09:50 AM	#3
Enea Lanzarone Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Switzerland Posts: 53	Fortunately, it absolutely doesn't matter if you edit 25P in a 50i timeline or not. 25P is not handled any different than 50i. It's your choice what to use, but personally I'd go for 25P. I don't think I will ever use 50i with the HV20. 25P motion with the HV20 looks so much smoother than with any cinema/frame mode I've seen on many other cams. I just hate that 'cheap tv commercial' and 'home movie' look of 50i. 25P looks much more stylish and artistic to me, no matter what I shoot. Fabio: you can use the free VLC player for both watching footage via firewire or already captured clips. The VLC player has a built in configurable deinterlacer, which works in real time. Saluti a Milano da un siciliano in Svizzera! ;)

May 29th, 2007, 11:40 AM	#4
Andrew Boss New Boot Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Kent, UK Posts: 6	Which deinterlacing mode should you use in VLC? Blend, bob, discard, linear, mean, x?

May 30th, 2007, 02:35 AM	#5
Fabio Martina New Boot Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Milan - Italy Posts: 13	Grazie Enea, I'll try some experiments... Fabio p.s. Semmai ti scrivo in privato così posso parlare in italiano che mi riesce meglio !

May 30th, 2007, 10:17 AM	#6
Marco Delgado New Boot Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Mexico City Posts: 5	I'm on the same dilemma... I'm travelling to Alaska tomorrowand still not sure if I should use 24P or 60i... I think I will go with 24P for all my shoots using a tripod and if I'm walking or shooting from the helicopter I'll go with 60i.

May 31st, 2007, 09:54 AM	#7
Fabio Martina New Boot Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Milan - Italy Posts: 13	It works !! X Andrew The correct deintarlacing mode is "discard" (for PAL) It must also to go into Preference...video...filters...deinterlacing...and choose "discard" and Preference...video...filters to flag "deinterlacing" By

May 31st, 2007, 02:13 PM	#8
Fergus Anderson Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: London, UK Posts: 321	i would have thought for 25p you dont want any deinterlacing so i would leave it at none

June 4th, 2007, 05:40 AM	#10
Fergus Anderson Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: London, UK Posts: 321	discard is not the same as no deinterlacing in VLC. I think it discards altenate fields

June 4th, 2007, 06:36 AM	#11
Fabio Martina New Boot Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Milan - Italy Posts: 13	Perhaps is an error of my translation: the correct choise for deinterlacing in VLC PAL footage, for me is the 4th in the menu list, between "bob" and "linear": I don't know the word in VLC english version (I have the italian menu)... by Fabio

June 4th, 2007, 10:54 AM	#12
Fergus Anderson Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: London, UK Posts: 321	Hi Fabio No that option is "discard", what you want is the top one on the list which is to "disable"