HV20/M2 (full res frame grabs)

Brian Valente · April 12th, 2007, 09:14 AM

Clearly the chip is there. The biggest challenges with the HV20 are simply how to use a consumer-oriented camera in filmmaking. You really have to dig to figure out how to disable all the auto functions, and the lack of precise controls (zoom numbers, etc.) make consistent setup a little more involved.

I think where it will shine is in mainstream applications/shooting scenarios. Where it may be a little more challenging is in the fringe shooting cases, such as extreme low lighting, high latitude shots, etc. where you don't have the kinds of controls available in more pro-oriented cameras.

It also seems to be a pretty meaningful step down the path of a simpler camera and more everywhere else. I almost think of it as a "shooting raw" kind of acquisition tool, where the cinema look (35mm lenses, cinema gamma, etc.) is done elsewhere instead of the camera. Fortunately, the tools are there to make this a reality today.

Peter J Alessandria · April 12th, 2007, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Valente

Taylor stopped by and I snapped this pic of his rig:

Awesome pics Taylor. Thanks for posting them.
Brian - a couple of questions about using the M2 with my HV20:
1. I'm going to add a Beachtek adapter for XLR inputs. (Probably the DXA-2s). You probably don't know this specifically yet, but I'm wondering what effect adding an adapter will have on lining up the M2 with the camera. The DXA-2s for instance raises the camera 1.25" above the tripod mount. It looks like there's enough room with the M2 but just checking.
2. What's the deal with using Canon EOS lenses with the Brevis (or any other 35mm adapter.) You cannot manually set the apeture on these lenses so how is that adjusted? (I ask b/c I have several Canon EOS lenses and would like to not have to buy new lenses.)

Brian Valente · April 12th, 2007, 11:01 AM

Hi Peter

as you can see from the pic you need to raise the camera anyways 5/8" (3/4" is shown in the pic, but it looked a tad tall when we took it out). It depends on where you mount the Beachtek - if it's beneath the rods, it would be the setup you see here. You could also mount it between the camera and rod system, which just means you would need to raise the rods a bit.

On the canon EOS, the electronic aperture in the lens means you shoot wide open. There is a thread on the redrock site about a mod Tatt Si has been working on that allows you to control aperture, which is here:

http://redrockmicro.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3137

Brian Valente · April 13th, 2007, 10:39 PM

Peter - after thinking a bit, it's probably better if you put the beachtek beneath the baseplate. It will make for a rock solid setup.

Cheers

Brian

Peter J Alessandria · April 14th, 2007, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Valente

On the canon EOS, the electronic aperture in the lens means you shoot wide open. There is a thread on the redrock site about a mod Tatt Si has been working on that allows you to control aperture, which is here:

http://redrockmicro.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3137

OMG - just looking at that guy's setup makes my eye twitch! I think I'll just buy a couple of old Nikon or Minolta lens that have manual apeture adjustment ;-)

Which baseplate are you referring to in your previous post?

Josh Reiss · April 14th, 2007, 04:07 PM

Hi!
just wondering if someone could breakdown the advantage of this setup for a newbie like myself...

is this so you can get seperate better aperture/shutter adjustment?
where do you get one of these?

thanks!
-Josh

Michael Krumlauf · May 29th, 2007, 02:57 PM

How much would an M2 kit for the HV20 cost, and would i need to venture to any 3rd party website to get anything that Redrock might not have like a ring for the HV20's small thread screw mount????

Brian Valente · May 29th, 2007, 05:17 PM

Hi Michael

A complete kit including rod support system, adapter, lens mount, and achromat, along with a quick release plate is $1295.

you can get the step-up ring (I believe it's 43-55mm and then 55mm-72mm) at adapterrings.com

Cheers

Brian

Michael Krumlauf · May 30th, 2007, 07:33 AM

Thanks so much for the info! I am thinking of selling the XL2 for an HV20 with one of your adapters! I have seen great results from these 2 (HV20, M2) both together and alone (M2 with other cams like HVX) and its very cool to even think that technology has brought us to a camera about the size of a small shoe to give images as good as a camera 4x its size!

Mike

Brian Valente · May 30th, 2007, 08:25 AM

Hi Mike

yeah, it's a really fascinating camera. One one hand it's got this amazing image. On the other hand it's a consumer camera, so you end up focusing less on all the settings and knobs, since there basically aren't any :)

I am working with Alex Nikishin (the camera op from ILLEGAL) on any fine-tuning of our setup this week, and expect to have some clips from our work.

Dennis Wood · May 31st, 2007, 01:36 PM

Michael, if you do work with the bare cam, selling your XL2 for an HV20 might be a bit disappointing. As an adapter cam, it's great...but wouldn't compare to the XH-A1 in terms of "bare" cam shooting with respect to image controls and audio. As Brian has mentioned already, the the HV20 is just an imaging engine (like any cam) when used with a 35mm lens adapter, so it's shortcomings are not that evident in that mode.

Jim Rog · May 31st, 2007, 04:28 PM

I thought the Letus35 flip enhanced took care of the flip maybe i got it wrong

Luca Furgiuele · September 16th, 2007, 01:25 PM

forgive my ignorance.

but i'm very interested in purchasing an HV20 to put a lens adaptor on it. what's the difference between the the M2 and the redrock micro? other than a nice comfy shoulder mount.

Brian Valente · September 16th, 2007, 01:30 PM

Hi Luca

Redrock Micro is the company - M2 is the cinema lens adapter (as in the micro35 version 2)

Cheers

Brian

Luca Furgiuele · September 16th, 2007, 01:40 PM

i just now realized this.
what i meant is what's the difference between the M2 and the micro35. this one:
http://rebelsguide.com/dl/hv20-hh.jpg

this picture has been popping up just about everywhere.

April 12th, 2007, 09:14 AM	#16
Brian Valente Major Player Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 293	Clearly the chip is there. The biggest challenges with the HV20 are simply how to use a consumer-oriented camera in filmmaking. You really have to dig to figure out how to disable all the auto functions, and the lack of precise controls (zoom numbers, etc.) make consistent setup a little more involved. I think where it will shine is in mainstream applications/shooting scenarios. Where it may be a little more challenging is in the fringe shooting cases, such as extreme low lighting, high latitude shots, etc. where you don't have the kinds of controls available in more pro-oriented cameras. It also seems to be a pretty meaningful step down the path of a simpler camera and more everywhere else. I almost think of it as a "shooting raw" kind of acquisition tool, where the cinema look (35mm lenses, cinema gamma, etc.) is done elsewhere instead of the camera. Fortunately, the tools are there to make this a reality today. __________________ ========================== Brian Valente Redrock Microsystems

April 12th, 2007, 11:01 AM	#18
Brian Valente Major Player Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 293	Hi Peter as you can see from the pic you need to raise the camera anyways 5/8" (3/4" is shown in the pic, but it looked a tad tall when we took it out). It depends on where you mount the Beachtek - if it's beneath the rods, it would be the setup you see here. You could also mount it between the camera and rod system, which just means you would need to raise the rods a bit. On the canon EOS, the electronic aperture in the lens means you shoot wide open. There is a thread on the redrock site about a mod Tatt Si has been working on that allows you to control aperture, which is here: http://redrockmicro.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3137 __________________ ========================== Brian Valente Redrock Microsystems

April 13th, 2007, 10:39 PM	#19
Brian Valente Major Player Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 293	Peter - after thinking a bit, it's probably better if you put the beachtek beneath the baseplate. It will make for a rock solid setup. Cheers Brian __________________ ========================== Brian Valente Redrock Microsystems

April 14th, 2007, 04:07 PM	#21
Josh Reiss New Boot Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 12	newbie explanation? Hi! just wondering if someone could breakdown the advantage of this setup for a newbie like myself... is this so you can get seperate better aperture/shutter adjustment? where do you get one of these? thanks! -Josh

May 29th, 2007, 05:17 PM	#23
Brian Valente Major Player Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 293	Hi Michael A complete kit including rod support system, adapter, lens mount, and achromat, along with a quick release plate is $1295. you can get the step-up ring (I believe it's 43-55mm and then 55mm-72mm) at adapterrings.com Cheers Brian __________________ ========================== Brian Valente Redrock Microsystems

May 29th, 2007, 02:57 PM	#22
Michael Krumlauf Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 128	How much would an M2 kit for the HV20 cost, and would i need to venture to any 3rd party website to get anything that Redrock might not have like a ring for the HV20's small thread screw mount????

May 30th, 2007, 07:33 AM	#24
Michael Krumlauf Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 128	Thanks so much for the info! I am thinking of selling the XL2 for an HV20 with one of your adapters! I have seen great results from these 2 (HV20, M2) both together and alone (M2 with other cams like HVX) and its very cool to even think that technology has brought us to a camera about the size of a small shoe to give images as good as a camera 4x its size! Mike

May 30th, 2007, 08:25 AM	#25
Brian Valente Major Player Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 293	Hi Mike yeah, it's a really fascinating camera. One one hand it's got this amazing image. On the other hand it's a consumer camera, so you end up focusing less on all the settings and knobs, since there basically aren't any :) I am working with Alex Nikishin (the camera op from ILLEGAL) on any fine-tuning of our setup this week, and expect to have some clips from our work. __________________ ========================== Brian Valente Redrock Microsystems

May 31st, 2007, 01:36 PM	#26
Dennis Wood Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 916	Michael, if you do work with the bare cam, selling your XL2 for an HV20 might be a bit disappointing. As an adapter cam, it's great...but wouldn't compare to the XH-A1 in terms of "bare" cam shooting with respect to image controls and audio. As Brian has mentioned already, the the HV20 is just an imaging engine (like any cam) when used with a 35mm lens adapter, so it's shortcomings are not that evident in that mode.

May 31st, 2007, 04:28 PM	#27
Jim Rog Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: PAL Zone Posts: 188	I thought the Letus35 flip enhanced took care of the flip maybe i got it wrong

September 16th, 2007, 01:25 PM	#28
Luca Furgiuele Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Canada Posts: 26	forgive my ignorance. but i'm very interested in purchasing an HV20 to put a lens adaptor on it. what's the difference between the the M2 and the redrock micro? other than a nice comfy shoulder mount.

September 16th, 2007, 01:30 PM	#29
Brian Valente Major Player Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 293	Hi Luca Redrock Micro is the company - M2 is the cinema lens adapter (as in the micro35 version 2) Cheers Brian __________________ ========================== Brian Valente Redrock Microsystems

September 16th, 2007, 01:40 PM	#30
Luca Furgiuele Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Canada Posts: 26	i just now realized this. what i meant is what's the difference between the M2 and the micro35. this one: http://rebelsguide.com/dl/hv20-hh.jpg this picture has been popping up just about everywhere.