Low Light settings for HF M40 at DVinfo.net

Troy Davis · November 24th, 2011, 07:17 PM

Just purchased a HF M40 as a B cam. I've tried some low light test footage and so far it's not what I expect. The footage has more grain than I expect and wanted to know what LOW LIGHT settings are working for others that own the m400, m40, or m41?

Thanks Much,
Troy

Jeff Harper · November 24th, 2011, 07:22 PM

You might start by trying to use the auto gain setting set to around 18db. I find on the XA10 the camera is noise free up to 18db.

I have plenty of recent footage that can confirm this. Your camera is not familiar to me, so I don't know, but it's my understanding the sensor is the same as the XA10. It could be the electronics are different and maybe not as effective as the more expensive cameras, but I don't know that.

I also am assuming your camera has the auto-gain setting, so if if doesn't never mind.

Someone will surely come along that knows your camera better than I.

Troy Davis · November 24th, 2011, 07:34 PM

Thanks Jeff. I've tried adjusting the gain up to 18db and still get noise. It must be some of the other settings that I need to adjust. I guess I will keep trying.

Jeff Harper · November 24th, 2011, 11:50 PM

Troy, that is the only setting I adjust, most of the time, except for white balance. I will adjust exposure when I have backlighting, etc, but otherwise, the gain setting only. Gain is what causes noise, so I wonder if there is anything else to be done.

I have a sneaking suspicion the M40 has less advanced ability to deal with low light than the G10, but I don't know that, as you know.

It makes sense if that is the case, as unfortunate as that would be. A price difference as great as that between the cameras has to be justified somehow. I know the lens is not the same, and the viewfinder is also different.

You might google the issue like M40 vs G10 in low light, etc and see what you find. Good luck, keep us posted.

Troy Davis · November 25th, 2011, 12:25 AM

Jeff,

I saw some sample footage (see below) on Vimeo that shows great low light footage using the M400 and M40. What's strange is that when I increase the black levels in Sony Vegas the footage looks fine. My thinking is that I should be able to get the same w/o making adjustments in post. I will try the google search you suggested. As always, thanks for the help.

Troy

Jeff Harper · November 25th, 2011, 12:37 AM

Does look OK, his gain is set to 9db except at 60i he's at 15, and the image is not as bright, which makes no sense, but maybe it's the 60i making the difference?

At 9db, from his test, you should get no noise.

Troy Davis · November 25th, 2011, 12:50 AM

That's correct. I will try some more test tomorrow. I know this has nothing to do w/ the problem, but I also added a Canon Wide Angle lens. It makes the camera look a lot larger than it is and the wide angle looks great. If I can get the LL issue solved I will be satisfied:-)

Buba Kastorski · November 25th, 2011, 12:31 PM

HF M has different lens, i suspect it won't be as good as HFG/XA10 in low light, but it still better than anything in it's price range.

Troy Davis · November 28th, 2011, 11:43 AM

Thanks Bubba. Made a few adjustments that work a little better. The settings from the video link on page 5 of this thread help a lot.

Jeff Harper · November 28th, 2011, 02:11 PM

I think it's a bit of a downer the low light performance isn't more noise free, more in line with the G10, but that is asking a lot for the price, I suppose.

November 24th, 2011, 07:17 PM	#1
Troy Davis Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Raleigh,NC Posts: 263	Low Light settings for HF M40 Just purchased a HF M40 as a B cam. I've tried some low light test footage and so far it's not what I expect. The footage has more grain than I expect and wanted to know what LOW LIGHT settings are working for others that own the m400, m40, or m41? Thanks Much, Troy

November 24th, 2011, 07:22 PM	#2
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Re: Low Light settings for HF M40 You might start by trying to use the auto gain setting set to around 18db. I find on the XA10 the camera is noise free up to 18db. I have plenty of recent footage that can confirm this. Your camera is not familiar to me, so I don't know, but it's my understanding the sensor is the same as the XA10. It could be the electronics are different and maybe not as effective as the more expensive cameras, but I don't know that. I also am assuming your camera has the auto-gain setting, so if if doesn't never mind. Someone will surely come along that knows your camera better than I. __________________ "The horror of what I saw on the timeline cannot be described."

November 24th, 2011, 07:34 PM	#3
Troy Davis Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Raleigh,NC Posts: 263	Re: Low Light settings for HF M40 Thanks Jeff. I've tried adjusting the gain up to 18db and still get noise. It must be some of the other settings that I need to adjust. I guess I will keep trying.

November 24th, 2011, 11:50 PM	#4
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Re: Low Light settings for HF M40 Troy, that is the only setting I adjust, most of the time, except for white balance. I will adjust exposure when I have backlighting, etc, but otherwise, the gain setting only. Gain is what causes noise, so I wonder if there is anything else to be done. I have a sneaking suspicion the M40 has less advanced ability to deal with low light than the G10, but I don't know that, as you know. It makes sense if that is the case, as unfortunate as that would be. A price difference as great as that between the cameras has to be justified somehow. I know the lens is not the same, and the viewfinder is also different. You might google the issue like M40 vs G10 in low light, etc and see what you find. Good luck, keep us posted. __________________ "The horror of what I saw on the timeline cannot be described."

November 25th, 2011, 12:25 AM	#5
Troy Davis Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Raleigh,NC Posts: 263	Re: Low Light settings for HF M40 Jeff, I saw some sample footage (see below) on Vimeo that shows great low light footage using the M400 and M40. What's strange is that when I increase the black levels in Sony Vegas the footage looks fine. My thinking is that I should be able to get the same w/o making adjustments in post. I will try the google search you suggested. As always, thanks for the help. Troy Canon m40 outside night test on Vimeo Canon M400 low light on Vimeo

November 25th, 2011, 12:37 AM	#6
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Re: Low Light settings for HF M40 Does look OK, his gain is set to 9db except at 60i he's at 15, and the image is not as bright, which makes no sense, but maybe it's the 60i making the difference? At 9db, from his test, you should get no noise. __________________ "The horror of what I saw on the timeline cannot be described."

November 25th, 2011, 12:50 AM	#7
Troy Davis Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Raleigh,NC Posts: 263	Re: Low Light settings for HF M40 That's correct. I will try some more test tomorrow. I know this has nothing to do w/ the problem, but I also added a Canon Wide Angle lens. It makes the camera look a lot larger than it is and the wide angle looks great. If I can get the LL issue solved I will be satisfied:-)

November 25th, 2011, 12:31 PM	#8
Buba Kastorski Trustee Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Toronto Posts: 1,414	Re: Low Light settings for HF M40 HF M has different lens, i suspect it won't be as good as HFG/XA10 in low light, but it still better than anything in it's price range. __________________ I love this place!

November 28th, 2011, 11:43 AM	#9
Troy Davis Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Raleigh,NC Posts: 263	Re: Low Light settings for HF M40 Thanks Bubba. Made a few adjustments that work a little better. The settings from the video link on page 5 of this thread help a lot.

November 28th, 2011, 02:11 PM	#10
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Re: Low Light settings for HF M40 I think it's a bit of a downer the low light performance isn't more noise free, more in line with the G10, but that is asking a lot for the price, I suppose. __________________ "The horror of what I saw on the timeline cannot be described."